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Author Topic:   Which God?
MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 62 of 81 (108156)
05-14-2004 8:45 AM
Reply to: Message 60 by jar
05-13-2004 11:18 PM


Multiple gods
Just curious. Is there some reason you think there is more than one?
No, it's my opinion that whenever someone finds god, or makes a religous committment, that ultimately it is the same and only one.
If it turns out that the God that is speaking to you is Fred, would that be better or worse than if it is Elaine?
No, although as far as a females vs male view of god, I tend to think god is not physical, hence no naughty parts. But a female god would be cool, although I think we can rule that out since men do not exerience PMS.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by jar, posted 05-13-2004 11:18 PM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 63 by Bonobojones, posted 05-14-2004 8:04 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied
 Message 64 by wmscott, posted 05-16-2004 9:30 AM MonkeyBoy has replied
 Message 67 by nator, posted 05-16-2004 11:52 AM MonkeyBoy has replied

  
Bonobojones
Inactive Member


Message 63 of 81 (108280)
05-14-2004 8:04 PM
Reply to: Message 62 by MonkeyBoy
05-14-2004 8:45 AM


Re: Multiple gods
The Gnostic Bible's creation story is full of female overtones. Maybe that's why the early Church had a "Night of the Long Knives" on the Gnostics. Some fragments survived, it appears.
On the Origin of the World - Bethge and Layton - The Nag Hammadi Library

Reunite Gondwana!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-14-2004 8:45 AM MonkeyBoy has not replied

  
wmscott
Member (Idle past 6269 days)
Posts: 580
From: Sussex, WI USA
Joined: 12-19-2001


Message 64 of 81 (108597)
05-16-2004 9:30 AM
Reply to: Message 62 by MonkeyBoy
05-14-2004 8:45 AM


Yes there is only one true God.
What you feel calling you is inside you, humans have a desire for a relationship with God, it is how we are made. As you have seen in your own case, even when we have "everything" we still feel we are missing something, this spiritual longing. Those who believe that we evolved, believe that we have this longing because it united stone age hunters into more successful groups and thus was a beneficial adaption, while those of us who believe in God believe that God made us this way because we were meant to have a close spiritual relationship with him. So man's built in spiritual nature is acknowledged by many who don't even believe in God. You will also find that you have a second longing as well, the desire for utopia or paradise, a longing for a perfect world where there is no pain or suffering and everything is good. You also have a desire to live forever in perfect health. The reason people have these desires is because we were made to live forever on earth in a society under God's direct rule, this is also why every time something bad happens, people always ask why God didn't prevent it, because in the world we were meant to live in, he would have. Humans are hardwired to live in a very different world than the one we live in today, this is why there so much stress, we are not adapted or made to live on our own, Independent of God's rulership. The reason why we are not living in a perfect world under God's rule is the explained in the Bible.
Now as to which "god" is calling you or rather has built this spiritual longing into you, there is of course only one true God, the creator. Only our maker could have put our spiritual awareness into us, none of the made up gods of human invention could have since they are not even real and there of course can be only one creator. (1 Corinthians 8:5-6) "For even though there are those who are called "gods," whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many "gods" and many "lords," there is actually to us one God the Father, out of whom all things are, and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are, and we through him." Throughout the Bible it is repeated that while there maybe many false gods, there is really in the end only one true God. (Psalm 83:18) "That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah, You alone are the Most High over all the earth." In english Jehovah is the most common pronunciation of the divine name and when names are transliterated from one language to another, the most common form is used so Jehovah is the name of God the creator.
A further possibility on your discovery of your spiritual longing is mentioned in scripture. (John 6:44) "No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him;" Jehovah is always looking for those willing to serve him, it could be that your longing is more than just a desire to know God, God may see something good in you and could be drawing you to him. You need to under take a study of the Bible which is God's open letter to mankind, and learn more about God and using the Bible, identify the one religion that is actually following the Bible and doing God's will. Just as there are many false gods but only one true god, there are also many false religions but only one true religion and the Bible is the key for finding it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-14-2004 8:45 AM MonkeyBoy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 65 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 10:01 AM wmscott has replied

  
MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 65 of 81 (108603)
05-16-2004 10:01 AM
Reply to: Message 64 by wmscott
05-16-2004 9:30 AM


There can be only One
wmscott -
I do believe through faith, that it was a calling of some sort. I do not entirely understand why, however. I was happy and content person that also happened to be an atheist. No crisis or tragedy occurred, no one was "witnessing" to me; the calling hit me out of blue. I cannot find a reason for it.
there is of course only one true God, the creator.
Does this imply that there are minor or lesser gods? In D & D, there are greater and lessor demons and devils and demigods, and D & D is pretty much where I think they exist; in fanatasy only, next to Mage and Paladin. Seriously, I'm beginning to think that all paths lead to One, that the fallacy (IMO) of "one true god" is a misconception , in a way. Again, no evidence, just faith.
A further possibility on your discovery of your spiritual longing is mentioned in scripture.
You need to under take a study of the Bible which is God's open letter to mankind, and learn more about God and using the Bible, identify the one religion that is actually following the Bible and doing God's will.
If I were striving to be a Born Again Christian, then yes; that advice would be applicable. I am not convinced at all that the bible is inspired by god. There are some 'nice' things in there, and I like most of the words of Christ; but I am not convinced that Christ was divine (I'm not sure he was convinced of his divinity either).
I have been meditating, and sometimes I 'feel' god speaking to my heart or soul, and other times I feel nothing.
Maybe what I experienced 3 weeks ago was a profound case of heartburn, (hence my avatar) after a rather filling dinner. If so, then I have been proficient in decieving myself, and will take great care not to let it happen again. Or it could be that I enjoy the comfort of a hope of an afterlife, that I believe everyone will take part in.
I think I went off topic several times already, so before I incur the wrath AdminAsgara, I'll stop .
For now.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by wmscott, posted 05-16-2004 9:30 AM wmscott has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 66 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 11:17 AM MonkeyBoy has replied
 Message 78 by wmscott, posted 05-19-2004 7:04 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 66 of 81 (108615)
05-16-2004 11:17 AM
Reply to: Message 65 by MonkeyBoy
05-16-2004 10:01 AM


Re: There can be only One
He definitely has a good point in that there can only be ONE true GOD, Brahma - the creator.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 10:01 AM MonkeyBoy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 1:52 PM jar has replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2191 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 67 of 81 (108620)
05-16-2004 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 62 by MonkeyBoy
05-14-2004 8:45 AM


Re: Multiple gods
quote:
But a female god would be cool, although I think we can rule that out since men do not exerience PMS.
No, men are moody and irrational all the time instead of only a few days a month.

Critical thinkers and skeptics don't create answers just to manage their anxiety--Karla McLaren

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-14-2004 8:45 AM MonkeyBoy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 1:56 PM nator has not replied

  
MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 68 of 81 (108645)
05-16-2004 1:52 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by jar
05-16-2004 11:17 AM


There can be only One
I think I agree, but I was only saying that I do not believe that the bible, or any holy text should be consulted in order to come to that conclusion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 11:17 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 69 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 1:55 PM MonkeyBoy has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 69 of 81 (108647)
05-16-2004 1:55 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by MonkeyBoy
05-16-2004 1:52 PM


Re: There can be only One
The Map is not...

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 1:52 PM MonkeyBoy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 71 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 2:00 PM jar has replied

  
MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 70 of 81 (108648)
05-16-2004 1:56 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by nator
05-16-2004 11:52 AM


Oink
I like the idea of a goddess over a male god. But I think that god is neither male nor female; maybe not a hermaphrodite, but possibly asexual.
Still, if god is a she, I bet she has the best set of . . .
attributes ever.
Mmmm. . . . attributes. . . .

This message is a reply to:
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MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 71 of 81 (108649)
05-16-2004 2:00 PM
Reply to: Message 69 by jar
05-16-2004 1:55 PM


quote:
The Map is not...
I love that, really I do.
Jar, do you believe the bible? All or some of it?
This is nothing but an assertion on my part, but I think that the books/letters in the bible were possibly given, and to a large extent misinterpretted by the recipients. In other words, they were personal revelation for *that* person. To suggest that others follow what may well be a personal revelation reduces it to heresay.
In my opinion.
One God, many ways to get to him/her/it.
I think.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 1:55 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 2:47 PM MonkeyBoy has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 72 of 81 (108652)
05-16-2004 2:47 PM
Reply to: Message 71 by MonkeyBoy
05-16-2004 2:00 PM


Yes I believe in the Bible, but not as a literal document.
One of my favorite paintings is Georges De La Tour's Magdalen with the Smoking Flame.
Today, we can take the painting apart. We can determine how it was made. We can determine the compostion of the paints he used, the materials of the base, the symbolism in the painting, even the brushstrokes that he used to achieve each effect.
But that is not the content or import of the painting. The painting is far more than just the how. It is the knowledge and feelings that each of us, as individulas bring away from viewing the painting.
For me, that is similar to the Bible. Evolution can explain the how of what we see around us, geology can explain the structures and the processes that were involved, chemistry and genetics, mathmatics and astronomy can help us understand the hows. But the Bible helps us understand the WHYs and provides a set of guidelines that can help us live with one another and in this wonderous world.
But I do not believe that the Bible is the only such guide. In fact, I believe that each and every such document, each such religion and each such philosophy are equally valid. They are all Maps. Some may be more accurate than others, but they are all Maps.
This message has been edited by jar, 07-26-2005 10:18 AM

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 2:00 PM MonkeyBoy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 2:55 PM jar has replied

  
MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 73 of 81 (108653)
05-16-2004 2:55 PM
Reply to: Message 72 by jar
05-16-2004 2:47 PM


Jar, would you mind if we I email you? I have some questions and I am not sure that a debate forum is the appropiate place to air them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 2:47 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 74 by jar, posted 05-16-2004 3:04 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 74 of 81 (108655)
05-16-2004 3:04 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by MonkeyBoy
05-16-2004 2:55 PM


Go for it.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by MonkeyBoy, posted 05-16-2004 2:55 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied

  
Cold Foreign Object 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3069 days)
Posts: 3417
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 75 of 81 (109155)
05-18-2004 11:05 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by jar
05-10-2004 9:39 AM


Jar is promoting common polytheism - all dimensions lead to the same God.
This belief seeks to offend no one - everyone is ok.
Jar would you please substantiate these claims ?
Why don't you start by comparing Islam with Christianity, namely if Jesus is the Son of God according to christianity then what is He to Muslims ?
I think I have made my point, but I will have to wait and see, Jar is Jar.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by jar, posted 05-10-2004 9:39 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by jar, posted 05-19-2004 1:22 AM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
almeyda
Inactive Member


Message 76 of 81 (109174)
05-19-2004 12:18 AM


Jar is living in some sort of new age philosophy.

  
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