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Author Topic:   Change in Moderation?
wj
Inactive Member


Message 137 of 303 (87916)
02-21-2004 6:05 PM


I may be wrong but Darwin's Terrior seems to have been suspended without warning. I think that all participants deserve the courtesy which was extended to simple in at least being warned first.
[This message has been edited by wj, 02-22-2004]

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 138 of 303 (88162)
02-23-2004 2:21 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by Adminnemooseus
02-20-2004 11:31 PM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
quote:
DT threw the first punch... and will serve the sentence for all you.
Tentitively 7 days from the time of offense.
Might certain parties like to edit in some apologies somewhere?
Darwin's Terrier's suspension has been lifted, after being in effect for 4 days.
I don't think such situations call for warnings before suspensions. Darwin's Terrier should have known better. Had the offending message been posted by a new member, he probably would have been branded a troll, and also been suspended.
Adminnemooseus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-20-2004 11:31 PM Adminnemooseus has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by wj, posted 02-23-2004 7:12 PM Adminnemooseus has replied

wj
Inactive Member


Message 139 of 303 (88218)
02-23-2004 7:12 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by Adminnemooseus
02-23-2004 2:21 PM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
An alternative way to view the situation is that a long term contributor who has generally behaved well and errs by posting an unacceptable single message is deserving of a warning rather than precipitous punishment. A new member without any track record of good behaviour posting the same material would be strongly suspected of being a troll, should be warned and then suspended if the trollish behaviour continues.
If in this particular case the offending message warrants suspension of the author, I would have thought that the message itself warrants deletion. To my knowledge the offending message(s) remain in the thread. I fail to see the logic in this situation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-23-2004 2:21 PM Adminnemooseus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-23-2004 7:27 PM wj has replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 140 of 303 (88220)
02-23-2004 7:27 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by wj
02-23-2004 7:12 PM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
WJ said:
quote:
If in this particular case the offending message warrants suspension of the author, I would have thought that the message itself warrants deletion. To my knowledge the offending message(s) remain in the thread. I fail to see the logic in this situation.
I have previously said twice (original and quote):
quote:
Might certain parties like to edit in some apologies somewhere?
Management VERY rarely edits messages for content. The original poster(s) is/are certainly welcome to do such.
Adminnemooseus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by wj, posted 02-23-2004 7:12 PM wj has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 141 by wj, posted 02-23-2004 7:47 PM Adminnemooseus has not replied

wj
Inactive Member


Message 141 of 303 (88222)
02-23-2004 7:47 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Adminnemooseus
02-23-2004 7:27 PM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
quote:
Management VERY rarely edits messages for content.
Given that suspension is also a very rare event, I fail to see why an offense which warrants suspension does not also warrants corrective action by removing the offending material. The message(s) appear(s) to be devoid of any useful information or redeeming quality.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-23-2004 7:27 PM Adminnemooseus has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Dr Jack, posted 02-24-2004 6:13 AM wj has replied

Dr Jack
Member
Posts: 3514
From: Immigrant in the land of Deutsch
Joined: 07-14-2003
Member Rating: 8.7


Message 142 of 303 (88322)
02-24-2004 6:13 AM
Reply to: Message 141 by wj
02-23-2004 7:47 PM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
Given that suspension is also a very rare event, I fail to see why an offense which warrants suspension does not also warrants corrective action by removing the offending material. The message(s) appear(s) to be devoid of any useful information or redeeming quality.
Because doing so removes the record of why the suspension was incurred, and also acts to clean the record of the offender?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by wj, posted 02-23-2004 7:47 PM wj has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by wj, posted 02-24-2004 6:32 AM Dr Jack has not replied

wj
Inactive Member


Message 143 of 303 (88323)
02-24-2004 6:32 AM
Reply to: Message 142 by Dr Jack
02-24-2004 6:13 AM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
Surely the rules are comprehensible so that a violation of the rules can be recognised without providing examples. And, if leaving the offending message in position is supposed to be of educational value, having it buried in the body of an obscure thread is hardly an efficient way of making it an example.
However, this is a diversion. My main point is that a warning would have been appropriate.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Dr Jack, posted 02-24-2004 6:13 AM Dr Jack has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-24-2004 1:13 PM wj has not replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 144 of 303 (88385)
02-24-2004 1:13 PM
Reply to: Message 143 by wj
02-24-2004 6:32 AM


Re: DT threw the first punch...
quote:
And, if leaving the offending message in position is supposed to be of educational value, having it buried in the body of an obscure thread is hardly an efficient way of making it an example.
Links to both the offending message and to the discussion in this topic is included in Message 24, of the "Suspensions and Bannings" topic.
Adminnemooseus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by wj, posted 02-24-2004 6:32 AM wj has not replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 145 of 303 (88738)
02-26-2004 3:15 AM


Darwin's Terrier suspension wrap up?
I find that it has become far too common, for members to launch-off on a "humorous" off-topic, and then for others to follow up. If you must do such, please do it in the "Humor" topic.
Had Darwin's Terrier brought a quote to the "Humor" topic, and then launched his joke, I probably would not have had any great problem with it.
Again, Darwin's Terrier should have the sense to have known better (not to mention the others who followed up). Moderator warnings tend to get lost in the shuffle. The only sure way to get the needed attention is either by a suspension or by a topic closure. In this case, a topic closure would have been more a punishment to the non-guilty topic starter.
Sometimes a hard whack is needed to bring attention to a problem. This time, it was Darwin's Terrier that took the whack. A 2 day suspension would probably have been appropriate, but that would have largely been over the weekend, when things are slower anyway.
I announced a possible 7 day suspension to try to really stir things up, knowing that it probably was going to be less. I was really surprised that no one protested the harshness of the 7 day sentence. Actually, I surprised there wasn't more protest over the suspension even happening.
Cheers,
Adminnemooseus

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by Mammuthus, posted 02-26-2004 5:22 AM Adminnemooseus has not replied
 Message 147 by wj, posted 02-26-2004 6:51 AM Adminnemooseus has not replied

Mammuthus
Member (Idle past 6476 days)
Posts: 3085
From: Munich, Germany
Joined: 08-09-2002


Message 146 of 303 (88740)
02-26-2004 5:22 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Adminnemooseus
02-26-2004 3:15 AM


Re: Darwin's Terrier suspension wrap up?
quote:
Actually, I surprised there wasn't more protest over the suspension even happening.
Surprised? I would think overjoyed. Imagine a day where crashfrog, Mr. Hambre, Dan, Darwinsterrier, and myself post nothing...that sounds like the realization of your dream since absolutely everything we post seems to you to be too harsh, too over the top, too funny, to creationist intimidating, too off topic (and in crashfrogs case, too frequent). I mean I can understand that one would appreciate the terse wit and clarity of Stephen ben Yeshua, Syamsu, Willowtree or Skeptik and the wonderful on topic, well researched and referenced, scientific discussions that they bring to the forum but we worthless idiots deserve our say as well don't we?
Besides, Dan, Hambre and myself all indicated that if DT was suspended, we should be as well. wj has defended DT and protested your suspending him and I assume most of us agree with wj.
Ultimately though, what does it matter what any of us say or think? You have made it abundantly clear that you would prefer is we did not say anything about what we think to each other and certainly not to creationists.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-26-2004 3:15 AM Adminnemooseus has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by wj, posted 02-26-2004 6:57 AM Mammuthus has replied

wj
Inactive Member


Message 147 of 303 (88755)
02-26-2004 6:51 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by Adminnemooseus
02-26-2004 3:15 AM


Re: Darwin's Terrier suspension wrap up?
Admoose, I find your post rather disappointing. You seem to be resorting to a sledgehammer to crack a peanut without using other tools in the first instance.
Random, unpredictable punishment inconsistent with the infraction is not a rathonal method of applying discipline. And if you get kicks from handing out apparently unreasonable suspensions and waiting for the reactions then maybe it is worth reviewing why you are moderating in the first place.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-26-2004 3:15 AM Adminnemooseus has not replied

wj
Inactive Member


Message 148 of 303 (88758)
02-26-2004 6:57 AM
Reply to: Message 146 by Mammuthus
02-26-2004 5:22 AM


Re: Darwin's Terrier suspension wrap up?
quote:
wj has defended DT and protested your suspending him and I assume most of us agree with wj.
By way of clarification, I am only defending DT right to say something and the appropriateness of the censure meted out. Personally I found DT's post in poor taste and fairly offensive, along with others which followed. Nevertheless I don't the punishment fitted the crime.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by Mammuthus, posted 02-26-2004 5:22 AM Mammuthus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Mammuthus, posted 02-26-2004 7:34 AM wj has replied

Mammuthus
Member (Idle past 6476 days)
Posts: 3085
From: Munich, Germany
Joined: 08-09-2002


Message 149 of 303 (88770)
02-26-2004 7:34 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by wj
02-26-2004 6:57 AM


Re: Darwin's Terrier suspension wrap up?
Sorry if I mischaracterized your position. I was referring to post 137 where you indicated that DT was not given a warning before suspension. I was not trying to imply that you thought DT's post in question was of high calibre. I should have made it clear and hopefully this post fixes it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by wj, posted 02-26-2004 6:57 AM wj has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by wj, posted 02-26-2004 7:46 AM Mammuthus has not replied

wj
Inactive Member


Message 150 of 303 (88772)
02-26-2004 7:46 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by Mammuthus
02-26-2004 7:34 AM


Re: Darwin's Terrier suspension wrap up?
No problem.
[This message has been edited by wj, 02-26-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by Mammuthus, posted 02-26-2004 7:34 AM Mammuthus has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 151 of 303 (91766)
03-11-2004 1:27 PM


quote:
Mammuthus, MrHambre, and Dan Carroll - Aren't you the three that followed up on Darwin's Terrier's ill placed "humor", at that other topic. Are you doing something simular in this topic?
{Source of above quote - Adminnemooseus}
You're right. Our humor is dubious and misplaced.
Better we should all grow up, and post something like the 17 page, completely unmoderated rant in which Syamsu breaks at least six forum rules, which seems to be a-okay in mod eyes.
But satirizing that rant? Bad, bad, bad.
[This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 03-11-2004]

"Perhaps you should take your furs and your literal interpretations to the other side of the river."
-Anya

Replies to this message:
 Message 152 by Adminnemooseus, posted 03-11-2004 3:10 PM Dan Carroll has replied
 Message 156 by Syamsu, posted 03-12-2004 3:11 AM Dan Carroll has not replied

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