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Author Topic:   Should wikipedia remove pictures of Muhammad
Granny Magda
Member
Posts: 2284
From: UK
Joined: 11-12-2007


Message 31 of 38 (454625)
02-07-2008 9:37 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by ThreeDogs
02-07-2008 9:52 AM


Three Dogs writes:

Even your friendly neighborhood muslim is subject to the koran. If he has detached himself from it, he is no longer muslim. If he is subject to the koran, he will do as the koran tells him do. That's broad, because it includes all muslims.

So you start by implying that all Muslims are dangerous zealots, and then, when it is demonstrated to you what a steaming pile of crap this is, you claim that those Muslims who don't fit your definition are "not real Muslims". What arrogant nonsense. What makes your presumption in judging who is and who is not Muslim so offensive, is that this idea, that it is possible to judge who is a "real Muslim" and who is not, is the very same idea that Muslim extremists use to justify terrorist atrocities.

Muslim terrorists know that they may kill or injure other Muslims when they engage in bombings and other acts of indiscriminate violence. The Koran forbids this. The zealots square this circle by claiming that Muslims living in the west are corrupt, tainted by the decadence of Western living, and so they are "not real Muslims". Thus, it is acceptable to kill them.

So you see, you are keeping rather bad company when you indulge in this sort of thinking. Why not let Muslims decide for themselves what their faith is, whilst you concentrate on your own beliefs, or lack thereof.

As for what the Koran says, I agree that it contains much that is intolerant and offensive. Much of its content is objectionable. About the same amount as the Bible in fact. Fortunately, most regular people have the good sense to ignore the more rabid sections from their holy book of choice, which is good news, or we'd be knee-deep in stonings and witch-burnings.

Where I live, I have thousands of Muslim neighbors and, they are just as good or bad to live with as any other of the many ethnic and religious groups here. In fact, my area has become a lot safer to walk around at night since the number of Muslims went up. Islam has many great flaws and I am extremely hostile towards it, but I have no problem with Muslims. Your depiction of Muslims is a pathetic racist delusion, doubtless fostered by your not having met very many of them.

Three Dogs writes:

When paganism is practiced in any so-called Christian religion, members of said religions are not Christian. JWs and LDSs are not Christian.

Ignorant rubbish. Have you even heard of the Nicene Creed? Jehovah's Witnesses are literal Bible believers and are most certainly Christian. Perhaps you would like to point out which bit of the Nicene Creed, that basic statement of Christian faith they disagree with?

With Mormons there is room to argue either way, but considering that they follow what they consider to be the teachings of Christ, who are you to say they are not Christian? Why not let them call themselves whatever the hell they like? Anyway, you have not answered Nator's question. How would you like it if all Christians were depicted as though they held the way out beliefs of the Mormons? Saying "Mormons aren't Christians" is no use, because as I have explained, plenty of other intolerant bigots on the Muslim side don't consider other varieties of Muslim to be "real" either.

Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Added some blank lines between paragraphs.


Mutate and Survive
This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-07-2008 9:52 AM ThreeDogs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 32 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-08-2008 9:58 AM Granny Magda has responded

    
ThreeDogs
Member (Idle past 2278 days)
Posts: 77
From: noli me calcare
Joined: 01-08-2008


Message 32 of 38 (454691)
02-08-2008 9:58 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by Granny Magda
02-07-2008 9:37 PM


Granmaw, you do protest too much
and utter ignorance is pouring from your pores. Aside from getting bent all out of shape.

Here is a small sample for you, from the koran, about killing the infidel, which is you, BTW, and everyone who reads this and the person who writes this response.

quote:

KORAN commands to kill infidels:

Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98

On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161

Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191

Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39

Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216



http://www.wvinter.net/~haught/Koran.html

There is more for you in the link.

quote:
O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73

Fight unbelievers who are near to you. 9:123 (different translation:
Believers! Make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Let them find harshness in you. (another source: ) Ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers....

Allah has cursed the unbelievers and proposed for them a blazing hell. - 33:60

Unbelievers are enemies of Allah and they will roast in hell. - 41:14

When you meet the unbelievers, smite their necks, then when you have made wide slaughter among them, tie fast the bonds, then set them free, either by grace or ransom, until the war lays down its burdens. - 47:4
(different translation: ) When you meet the unbelievers in the battlefield, strike off their heads, and when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly.


I suggest you get yourself a good translation of the koran (Pickthall was an Englishman and I like his translation and it is generally accepted as accurate by muslims).

So far as LDS and JWs are concerned? I really don't care what opinion you hold about them. That you have not researched these isms, is clear. But, hey, I won't let anyone tell ME how to spend my time, either.

I don't imply, I KNOW all muslims are subject to the koran, those who remove themselves from the koran, are no longer muslims and subject to death. Get going granmaw; inform yourself.

Hey, granmaw, you never did tell me what you think of the saqqara bird.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by Granny Magda, posted 02-07-2008 9:37 PM Granny Magda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 33 by Granny Magda, posted 02-08-2008 2:07 PM ThreeDogs has responded
 Message 34 by nator, posted 02-08-2008 6:39 PM ThreeDogs has responded
 Message 38 by Vacate, posted 02-15-2008 6:57 AM ThreeDogs has not yet responded

  
Granny Magda
Member
Posts: 2284
From: UK
Joined: 11-12-2007


Message 33 of 38 (454737)
02-08-2008 2:07 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by ThreeDogs
02-08-2008 9:58 AM


Re: Granmaw, you do protest too much
Here is a small sample for you, from the koran, about killing the infidel...{Various unpleasant Koranic quotes follow}

Do you really imagine that I am ignorant of the unquestioned fact that the Koran contains vile and offensive crap? Of course I know that. You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that anyone who disagrees with you is ignorant, a moronic and childish attitude.
The point is that most Muslims have the common sense to ignore those passages, mostly because there is an expectation amongst Muslims to respect the laws of the land in which they live.
You ignored my point regarding the equally sick and offensive portions of the Bible. Do you suppose that all Christians are dangerous maniacs? Because the Christian holy book is chock full of incitements to dreadful acts.

I don't imply, I KNOW all muslims are subject to the koran, those who remove themselves from the koran, are no longer muslims and subject to death. Get going granmaw; inform yourself.

That is one interpretation yes. The fact is that there are plenty of other interpretations of the Koran within Islam. Which variety of Islam do you happen to hold up as being the one true Islam? Sunni? Sufi? You are trying to paint millions of people as being zealous fanatical murderers, and when it is pointed out that most Muslims are not like that, you just say that they are not real Muslims. Ridiculous. If in your tiny mind, the only real Muslim is a member of Al Qaida, I suggest that you go and join them, because you seem to have a lot in common. You both think that any Muslim who is not a killer is not a real Muslim.
What terminology should we use to describe the millions of Muslims who are not murderous loonies? Fortunately, it is not u to you to decide who is a "real Muslim" and who is not. That kind of thinking is the preserve of lunatic religious fanatics. Is a person who does not believe the entirety of the Bible not a "real Christian"?
As I said before, there are thousands of Muslims where I live. Do you suppose that they are all out slaughtering the unbeliever? Of course not. What the Koran says is just as irrelevant to the every day lives of Muslims as the ravings of the Old testament are to modern Christians.

So far as LDS and JWs are concerned? I really don't care what opinion you hold about them.

Then why are you posting on a debate board? The only parts of this board that is not composed of the opinions of others are the posts you write yourself. If you don't care what other people think, why don't you just sit at home, typing your mental-masturbatory drivel to yourself.

Hey, granmaw, you never did tell me what you think of the saqqara bird.

That is because I actually have better things to do than pander to childish bullshit. However, if you insist...
Saqqara birds were irrelevant to the thread in which you first mentioned them and they are irrelevant to this one too. The only reason you brought them up was to try and appear clever and interesting, a sadly doomed ambition. What exactly do you expect to achieve by quoting obscure and irrelevant facts? We can all play at that game you know. You will find that almost every member on this board will be able to mention obscure facts, about which you know nothing. I personally find Flammulina velutipes fascinating. Off you trot and look it up. Of course it has nothing to do with anything that we are talking about; the same as your saqqara birds. Please don't continue with this pathetic and childish troll behaviour. All it achieves is to make you look like an idiot.


Mutate and Survive
This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-08-2008 9:58 AM ThreeDogs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-11-2008 9:35 AM Granny Magda has responded

    
nator
Member (Idle past 1069 days)
Posts: 12961
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 34 of 38 (454799)
02-08-2008 6:39 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by ThreeDogs
02-08-2008 9:58 AM


Re: Granmaw, you do protest too much
So, the Jews are commanded by the Torah to stone disobedient children and adulterers to death.

Are you saying that any Jew that does not follow this directive is no longer a Jew?

And who died and made you the Grand Arbiter of who may call themselves a Muslim, or a Christian?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-08-2008 9:58 AM ThreeDogs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-11-2008 9:38 AM nator has not yet responded

    
ThreeDogs
Member (Idle past 2278 days)
Posts: 77
From: noli me calcare
Joined: 01-08-2008


Message 35 of 38 (455180)
02-11-2008 9:35 AM
Reply to: Message 33 by Granny Magda
02-08-2008 2:07 PM


Re: Granmaw, I didn't read your stuff
from a distance it looks like a repeat of your first corrupted disgorgement.

I threw you the bird to give you the opportunity to be interesting.

.....the silent muslim is the biggest killer of them all!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by Granny Magda, posted 02-08-2008 2:07 PM Granny Magda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by Granny Magda, posted 02-11-2008 6:14 PM ThreeDogs has not yet responded

  
ThreeDogs
Member (Idle past 2278 days)
Posts: 77
From: noli me calcare
Joined: 01-08-2008


Message 36 of 38 (455182)
02-11-2008 9:38 AM
Reply to: Message 34 by nator
02-08-2008 6:39 PM


quote:
So, the Jews are commanded by the Torah to stone disobedient children and adulterers to death.
Are you saying that any Jew that does not follow this directive is no longer a Jew?

And who died and made you the Grand Arbiter of who may call themselves a Muslim, or a Christian?


Nator, in your case it would have been better you stay locked up. It requires scholarship to discuss what you attempt. So, get some and we'll talk about it.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by nator, posted 02-08-2008 6:39 PM nator has not yet responded

  
Granny Magda
Member
Posts: 2284
From: UK
Joined: 11-12-2007


Message 37 of 38 (455261)
02-11-2008 6:14 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by ThreeDogs
02-11-2008 9:35 AM


Re: Granmaw, I didn't read your stuff
If you can't be bothered to read what others say, I shall extend you the same lack of courtesy in future and ignore you.


Click to enlarge

There seem to be a lot of them about at the moment, so please don't feed the trolls.


Mutate and Survive
This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-11-2008 9:35 AM ThreeDogs has not yet responded

    
Vacate
Member (Idle past 1028 days)
Posts: 565
Joined: 10-01-2006


Message 38 of 38 (456041)
02-15-2008 6:57 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by ThreeDogs
02-08-2008 9:58 AM


whos the fundiest?
I don't imply, I KNOW all muslims are subject to the koran, those who remove themselves from the koran, are no longer muslims and subject to death.

Is there some type of copyright infringement issue here? Didn't the Bible lay claim to this first?

I am just wondering Threedogs, if you have a point to your quotes pulled from the Koran? Surely you are aware that the exact same type can be taken from the Bible. What version of fire and brimstone are you destined for, what group of fundementalism is going to send you there?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by ThreeDogs, posted 02-08-2008 9:58 AM ThreeDogs has not yet responded

  
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