|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total) |
| |
popoi | |
Total: 915,815 Year: 3,072/9,624 Month: 917/1,588 Week: 100/223 Day: 11/17 Hour: 0/0 |
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Sinning for Others | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat Sci writes:
To me it seems like a catch-all no-escape clause: "Thou shalt not A, B, C... or anything else that God doesn't want you to do." As iano used to say, it's impossible to obey the law.
What does blasphemy of the HS mean to you?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
|
Cat Sci writes:
To me it seems like a catch-all no-escape clause: "Thou shalt not A, B, C... or anything else that God doesn't want you to do." As iano used to say, it's impossible to obey the law. What does blasphemy of the HS mean to you? That's not how the Bible describes it. I outlined that in Message 5:
quote: I expanded on that in Message 6:
quote:
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Mal Junior Member (Idle past 3176 days) Posts: 15 From: Stockholm Joined: |
Thank you for the welcome.
I think that what Jon meant was to ask if any one of us would...of their own free will...take on the sin of another (kinda like Jesus did) even if it meant we would perish as a result. I might be wrong, however. That would be an interesting topic if that is what Jon meant. There may be some objections.
Hows Sweden, by the way? The weather is not nice today.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Mal Junior Member (Idle past 3176 days) Posts: 15 From: Stockholm Joined: |
What does blasphemy of the HS mean to you? Can you give an example of it?
Thank you for replying. I would say it is as you have explained in another post. Making a false claim or speaking wrongly of the HS. For example, claiming that God's (Jesus') power (HS) is of Satan (Matt 12:24). Mark 3:28-29 (KJV)
Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
I would say it is as you have explained in another post. Making a false claim or speaking wrongly of the HS. Would you also agree with my Message 6 that it goes the other way too? That is, a televangelist, for instance, who is lying about the HS being behind his magic tricks is committing the sin of blaspheming the HS?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Mal Junior Member (Idle past 3176 days) Posts: 15 From: Stockholm Joined:
|
Hi
Would you also agree with my Message 6 that it goes the other way too? That is, a televangelist, for instance, who is lying about the HS being behind his magic tricks is committing the sin of blaspheming the HS? I would agree, it makes perfect sense. There was something about prophets making false prophecys in my head somewhere so I did a search and think this might help. Deuteronomy 18:20
But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death." It looks a little like the televangelist example you gave. They are both making false claims about God. I might be completely wrong!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death." Man... OT God was vicious! There'd be a lot of people today that He'd have put to death if that was still a rule.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Jon Inactive Member |
Welcome, Mal!
I was confused by the first two sentences as one refers to a single item and the other to plural. By 'unforgivable sin' I simply mean the idea that sin(s) exist that cannot be forgiven no matter the circumstances.
"If it meant saving the life of an innocent person, would you commit an unforgivable sin damning your soul to eternal torment?" I am not sure under which circumstances this could happen. If you save the life of an innocent person is that not a good thing that deserves a reward rather than a punishment? I would think so; though, of course, it isn't my decision to make.
I am not sure which god would sentence someone to eternal torment for saving an innocent person. Apparently New Cat's Eye thinks his might:
quote: I find it rather disturbing.Love your enemies!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
GDR Member Posts: 6202 From: Sidney, BC, Canada Joined: Member Rating: 1.9 |
Jon writes: Do you believe in unforgivable sin?What do you consider these sins to be? I suggest that it is serving and loving evil and calling it good. Here is a quote I've used before from CS Lewis's book "The Last Battle". Aslan represents the Christ figure and Tash represents the face of evil.
quote: It isn't so much that the sin can't be forgiven but it is simply that worshipping or following that which is evil or hateful, (as that is the opposite of what Christ taught), then we have made our choice and God honours that choice. As Lewis says in "The Great Divorce" quote: The only thing I would add is that I also believe that in the end there is perfect justice, and if such things as mental illness are involved then God's perfect justice will prevail.He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God. Micah 6:8
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat Sci writes:
I think you're being too specific. Blasphemy is all about attitude and respect. I call it a catch-all because "the judge" can always say, "I don't like your attitude," - i.e. he can find you in contempt whether you intended contempt or not.
That's what Jesus said Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit was. Its when God does something and then you go: "Nah, that wasn't God that was the devil."
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
It would seem to me the whole idea is whether the Judge has any right to hold you accountable to an arbitrary standard. I would argue that he does, in fact, have that power and that right. You may argue about the right...after all, freethinkers love loopholes.
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: You may argue about the right...after all, freethinkers love loopholes. How exactly are you using the word "loophole"? You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
|
I think you're being too specific. Blasphemy is all about attitude and respect. I call it a catch-all because "the judge" can always say, "I don't like your attitude," - i.e. he can find you in contempt whether you intended contempt or not. Blasphemy Against the Holy Spirit is different than just your regular old everyday blasphemy, which presumably is forgivable. Also, if the judge is God then he should be able to look inside you and see if your contempt was intended, so that analogy isn't working for me.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Yes, that's what I'm saying. It's an arbitrary standard, entirely at the whim of the judge and sometimes unpredictable.
It would seem to me the whole idea is whether the Judge has any right to hold you accountable to an arbitrary standard. Phat writes:
So might makes right?
I would argue that he does, in fact, have that power and that right.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat Sci writes:
Sez you.
Blasphemy Against the Holy Spirit is different than just your regular old everyday blasphemy.... Cat Sci writes:
God's omniscience is irrelevant. It's the fact that you don't know how He will react that makes it impossible to obey the law.
Also, if the judge is God then he should be able to look inside you and see if your contempt was intended, so that analogy isn't working for me.
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024