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Author | Topic: The definition of science: What should it be? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Rob  Suspended Member (Idle past 5849 days) Posts: 2297 Joined: |
Norman Borlaug used science to save 1.5 billion lives. That's "billion" with a "b." Your religion had absolutely no power to do the same. If not for science, they would have starved to death. Don't be such a polly wog, I didn't say science is evil and not useful. It is not inherently bad, just as sex is not inherently bad. All things need the proper boundaries and we as men cannot posses the power to say what those boundaries are. (go ahead, take the bait)
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AdminNosy Administrator Posts: 4754 From: Vancouver, BC, Canada Joined: |
Rob, you seem to have a very hard time staying on the topic. This seems to be apparent in most of the threads you join into.
I suggest you think harder about each post to be sure it is actually on topic and that fact will be apparent to me and others. If you continue to show a lack of focus I will give you a short initial time out to think more carefully. Edited by AdminNosy, : Modified title to highlight it for Rob
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nator Member (Idle past 2170 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Yeah...right...whatever. Your reply has nothing to do with the question you asked and the answer I provided, and, indeed, is simply a lame preaching attempt to derail the subject. Remember, we are in a science forum. So, I'll remind you that you asked:
quote: ...and I asnwered:
We won't ever have perfect knowledge of anything, but we can know with a good degree of confidence when we are on the right track. Perhaps we should stop using the word "truth" and start using the word "accurate" instead. Science strives to create models (aka theories) of natural phenomena which have greater and greater accuracy. A particularly accurate theory will survive many tests, and it will have great predictive and explanatory power. It will also often give rise to entire new fields of scientific study. Now, how about that second paragraph? I think that you need to differentiate between Truth and truth. If you think that you will find Truth (some kind of Ultimate Answer to the Meaning of Life) from science, you are barking up the wrong tree. Methodological Naturalism is simply a tool; an extremely effective, useful, productive tool. We use it to untangle the puzzles of natural phenomena. It has nothing at all to say about meaning.
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rgb Inactive Member |
Rob writes
quote:What the hell does this have to do with the definition of science?
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SuperNintendo Chalmers Member (Idle past 5834 days) Posts: 772 From: Bartlett, IL, USA Joined: |
That is the danger of science in the hands of a Godless state... I know this is off topic, so please don't reply... Nazi Germany was a Christian state and Hitler claimed to be Christian http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm
OFF TOPIC - Please Do Not Respond to this message or continue in this vein. AdminPD Edited by AdminPD, : Off Topic Warning
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kuresu Member (Idle past 2513 days) Posts: 2544 From: boulder, colorado Joined: |
why not kill off the weaker and troublesome among us for the betterment of the greater good. It is a huge logical moral dilemma for the naturalist. Only for those naturalists with a skewed view of what "survival of the fittest" means. Hitler took it the wrong way. See, humans thrive off of being social, and part of being social is having a set of rules, standards, morals. You want to keep the people who . . .well, screw it. You're gonna take it the wrong way if I type this. Point is, there is no moral dilemma for naturalists in regards to evolution--that is, for those who properly understand it. All a man's knowledge comes from his experiences
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Rob  Suspended Member (Idle past 5849 days) Posts: 2297 Joined: |
Lol
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Rob  Suspended Member (Idle past 5849 days) Posts: 2297 Joined: |
Can you give me an idea of what unnatural behavior would be as a scientific definition?
I think you'll find that killing is natural. Lust is natural. Envy is natural. Selfishness is natural...
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
It has been my wondrous discovery that Ethics are far more likely found in the realm of the Naturalist Scientist than in Theology. Science and scientists take ethics seriously. That cannot be said of Theologists, particularly those esposing the YEC or Biblical Creationist position.
In science the data, the evidence is inviolable. If a scientist is discovered falsifying data, using data that has been refuted, or even excluding that data which does not support his position, that scientist is likely to never work or get funded again. Every bit of his work, often going back many decades is pulled up and gone over with a fine toothed comb looking for any errors of ommission or commission. Ethics seems to me to be far more common, far more normal, far more deep-seated and indwelling in the Naturalist world than in the Theological world. Look at the lack of adverse reaction from the YEC and Biblical Creationist communities to those who lied under oath in Dover, or the continued use of falsified evidence by the likes of Ron Wyatt, of the outright lies of the leaders of the Evangelical community like Pat Robertson, Oral Roberts, Jerry Falwell, Gene Scott. The Naturalist community in general, and the Scientific community in particular seems to have a far greater understanding of honesty, ethics and morality than is seen in the public religious communities as represented by the televangelists, the Hams, the Wyatts, the Morrises or the Phelps. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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Rob  Suspended Member (Idle past 5849 days) Posts: 2297 Joined: |
You cannot leave that our there like that without a response. it's simply unfair! If the moderators wish to hide this response and your post it is ok. But I simply must respond....
You are correct! Hitler was a public Christian, just as Saddam Hussein was (excuse me... is) a public Muslim. Let's look at Stalin... A seminary student, but he rejected faith in the end. At least Stalin was consistent albeit consistently evil. His daughter Svetlana Stalin, in an interview with Malcolm Muggeridge, told of how her father died. Joseph Stalin suddenly sat up, shook his fist to the heavens, in a defiant gesture, and fell back into his bed and died. I know this... the definition of science lacks the ability to address such things. True science is not (in my opinion) material impericism, but metaphysical revelation. Don't worry! I'm in no position to affect the convention. I am only one man. I only attempt to influence individual members of the forum... Rob
OFF TOPIC - Please Do Not Respond to the off topic portions of this post or continue in that vein. AdminPD Edited by Rob, : No reason given. Edited by AdminPD, : Off Topic Warning
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Rob  Suspended Member (Idle past 5849 days) Posts: 2297 Joined: |
Speaking of public Christians
ps. Dear purple dawn, jar is right; Aslan is not a tame lion. This should be of grave concern to you, as He is going to return. Please don't try to fight Him. Couldn't help myself Phat... OFF TOPIC - If you must read content, use the Peek button but do not respond. AdminPD Edited by Rob, : No reason given. Edited by Rob, : No reason given. Edited by AdminPD, : Contents Off Topic
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rgb Inactive Member |
Rob writes
quote:I am speechless. Simply speechless.
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Percy Member Posts: 22392 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Rob writes: True science is not (in my opinion) material impericism, but metaphysical revelation. It's "empiricism". To measure the acceleration of gravity, an empirical approach might drop an object next to a long measuring stick while flashing a strobe light with a camera pointed at the whole arrangement. Then you'd measure the spacing of the images of the object on film and derive the acceleration of gravity. How would you find the acceleration of gravity using metaphysical revelation? --Percy
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PurpleYouko Member Posts: 714 From: Columbia Missouri Joined: |
Seconded.
In the face of comments like that it becomes painfully obvious that we are wasting our time.I also fear that we could easily slip back into the dark ages if this kind of thought becomes prevalent in those who make the laws. This is the perfect example of why scientists fight so hard to keep ID and other nonsense, out of the class room
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Rob  Suspended Member (Idle past 5849 days) Posts: 2297 Joined: |
How would you find the acceleration of gravity using metaphysical revelation? All of you are completely misunderstanding what I say... I would not use metaphysical revelation to find such things. And does gravity accelerate, or does the object by way of gravity? Empericists attempt to find out how the machine works. Metaphysics is a search for why the machine is here... I simply think the latter of the two is more important to understand... Science is wonderful, but for too many people (perhaps, not you), it serves a purpose it cannot; to answer or deny the bigger existential questions... Sorry for any confusion... Rbo
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