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Author Topic:   Creationism in Australia - growing?
Thor
Member (Idle past 5901 days)
Posts: 148
From: Sydney, Australia
Joined: 12-20-2004


Message 1 of 5 (221850)
07-05-2005 6:24 AM


Here is something that should be of particular concern to the Aussies around here.
I never thought it would ever be a big issue in Australia, but I came across this today and it has left me feeling decidedly uncomfortable.
It seems certain politicians are showing support for the Hillsong Church. I don't know a lot about them, but they certainly seem to have fundamentalist leanings. It seems the dude running the show, Brian Houston, is something of a creationist. They are currently having their annual conference, which has been attended by a number of politicians, including the Federal Treasurer Peter Costello. He was interviewed on Lateline last night (A late night current affairs show on the ABC, which is basically our equivalent of PBS) about it. Here is the part that caught my attention:
TONY JONES: Now, Brian Houston's belief - and Hillsong is his church - he says he's fundamentalist on this issue - he doesn't believe in evolution. In other words, he believes that Darwin got it wrong and that God created the world in six days, etc, etc. I mean, doesn't it worry you when someone like that has sway over a lot of impressionable minds?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, you know, I think young people make up their views themselves, to be frank. People get information from all sources. It might be from watching television, it might be from listening to the radio, it might be from reading the media, and it might be from going to church, and actually I think sometimes the church will be a balance to all of those other sources of information. At the end of the day, they'll make up their own minds. I don't think it's fair to say, just because they go to a particular church, that they can't think for themselves. In fact, I'd encourage them to think for themselves. I think it's a big part of exploring and learning your way towards faith.
TONY JONES: I take it you do believe in evolution, then?
PETER COSTELLO: Oh, yes. Look, you know, you shouldn't overstate the influence that kids are under. I think they're under a whole powerload of bad influences, frankly, that come through the media, through some forms of rap music, and actually, a bit of counterbalancing the other way may actually even the playing field a bit.
TONY JONES: A bit of creationism can't hurt; is that what you're saying?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, look, they'll make up their own minds. I think that they'll principally get their views on biology from their teachers at school, and they'll principally get their views on faith from their pastors, and the fact that different people have different views, I don't see as a dangerous thing. In an open society where kids are encouraged to question and learn, hearing different views doesn't do them too much damage.
If interested, the rest of the transcript can be read at Treasurer Peter Costello speaks after adressing the Hillsong Church - Lateline
It seems this Government doesn't care much about science. or at least, it doesn't care much if Australian kids grow up rejecting it in favour of mythology.
For more info on the church, see Hillsong Church - Welcome Home | Church
They seem to have a decent amount of money and influence. Could this herald a growth in creationism here in Oz? It certainly wouldn't happen overnight, but could it happen?
With the growth of the Family First party in the last election, and with John Howard looking more and more like Dubya's lapdog, I have to admit I'm a little concerned.
Any thoughts on this? Aussies? Anyone?
Admins: not sure where this would belong, Miscellaneous Topics perhaps?

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Dead Parrot, posted 07-05-2005 11:33 PM Thor has not replied

  
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Message 2 of 5 (221859)
07-05-2005 7:31 AM


Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
Dead Parrot
Member (Idle past 3335 days)
Posts: 151
From: Wellington, NZ
Joined: 04-13-2005


Message 3 of 5 (222034)
07-05-2005 11:33 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Thor
07-05-2005 6:24 AM


Averagely Scary
Well worth keeping an eye on - Especially if they're getting Government Funding for spreading thier own brand of nuttyness to rest of Oz. But I suspect their more interested in screwing money out of everybody than trying to "educate" them.
And besides, how well are AiG doing? they were an Aussie outfit originally, but I think they had to relocate to the US because people kept laughing at them, so I don't feel the urge to mine the Tasman just yet...
(Besides, we're got the Destiny Church on our side, and I want to leave an escape route open...)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Thor, posted 07-05-2005 6:24 AM Thor has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Sylas, posted 07-06-2005 12:14 AM Dead Parrot has replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5250 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 4 of 5 (222039)
07-06-2005 12:14 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Dead Parrot
07-05-2005 11:33 PM


Re: Averagely Scary
I don't see anything particularly disturbing in Peter Costello's comments. In fact, I'm a bit encouraged. Costello is a Christian, and made no bones at all about accepting evolution.
Dead Parrot writes:
And besides, how well are AiG doing? they were an Aussie outfit originally, but I think they had to relocate to the US because people kept laughing at them, so I don't feel the urge to mine the Tasman just yet...
Actually, AiG is doing very well indeed. They did not relocate to the US. They expanded into the US and other countries. They still operate here in Australia, and their main office is a bit down the road from me (Brisbane) in Acaia Ridge on Beaudesert Rd.
But I do think they are not having much impact outside churches, and that even within the churches their influence is limited. Costello's remarks show that.
Keeping an eye on things is a good idea. The most recent foray of AiG into the mainstream is a debate they had with the Australian Skeptics in Sydney Morning Herald webdiary website. Significantly, one of debators on the side of the Skeptics is a devout baptist; Ken Smith.
The linking at webdiary is not great. But the final statements are found here, and there are links back to the first and second statements. There are hundreds of comments linked to the debate; it would be interesting to work through and get numbers for various categories of response.
Cheers -- Sylas

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Dead Parrot, posted 07-05-2005 11:33 PM Dead Parrot has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Dead Parrot, posted 07-06-2005 1:02 AM Sylas has not replied

  
Dead Parrot
Member (Idle past 3335 days)
Posts: 151
From: Wellington, NZ
Joined: 04-13-2005


Message 5 of 5 (222042)
07-06-2005 1:02 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Sylas
07-06-2005 12:14 AM


Re: Averagely Scary
Sylas,
Thanks for the correction - I thought AiG were down to skeleton-staff-only level in Oz.
The Webdiary debate looks interesting, although a bit broken - I'll try again later. A quick flick through some of the comments though, suggests they are about 50/50 for each side...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Sylas, posted 07-06-2005 12:14 AM Sylas has not replied

  
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