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Author Topic:   Does The Flood Add up?
deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2914 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 138 of 298 (324956)
06-22-2006 4:30 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by Gullwind
06-20-2006 9:55 PM


Re: Stability of the Ark
Nice post. But you will never get anywhere with creationists assembling relevant facts, you should know that. They have the ultimate comeback - God did it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Gullwind, posted 06-20-2006 9:55 PM Gullwind has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Gullwind, posted 06-22-2006 5:35 PM deerbreh has not replied

deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2914 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 198 of 298 (326986)
06-27-2006 10:10 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by lfen
06-27-2006 5:16 PM


Re: Dung beatles need Elephant Dung!
I mean what did they feed the anteaters and all?
Lots of carpenter ants working on that gopher wood I imagine. Not to mention termites. Noah likely made a special exception to his no screwing rule for the anteaters so that there would be enough anteaters to keep up with the demand.

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deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2914 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 252 of 298 (328580)
07-03-2006 2:27 PM
Reply to: Message 225 by Faith
07-03-2006 5:18 AM


Re: A small point
You don't have to assume great differences among the sons of Noah and their wives, though there could have been, since genetic diversity in any couple would have been much greater in those days, leading to much more variety in offspring. We assume far greater genetic potential so that all those varieties would have been expressed simply in the processes of migration and reproductive/genetic isolation of the different groups.
Along with the geology book I would recommend a good book on population genetics and maybe one on epidemiology. This statement is nonsense. One individual can have only so much genetic diversity. If you have only 8 individuals you have an extreme bottleneck, even if all of the individuals are completely heterozygous, which they are not likely to be, given that they lived in an ancient society where there was not a great deal of mobility - there would have been a fairly high rate of inbreeding/genetic load. The longer a population is around and the larger the population, the more genetic diversity, as mutations accumulate and there are many suitable mates available. A bottleneck of the human population down to eight people all from the same general region - and crowded into an Ark with a bunch of animals from all over the world - would in all probability have caused the extinction of the species. All it would have taken would have been a virus or bacterium carried by an animal for which the humans had no resistance. This is another good argument against a worldwide flood. And you can't argue "no diseases" because this is after the Fall, remember?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 225 by Faith, posted 07-03-2006 5:18 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2914 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 255 of 298 (328583)
07-03-2006 2:35 PM
Reply to: Message 250 by Faith
07-03-2006 2:17 PM


I already answered this somewhere in my posts last night. Original richer genome is the answer. In-breeding problems happen after a lot of selection has reduced the overall genetic diversity of a kind.
No. In-breeding problems are a result of inbreeding, which you would have in spades in Noah's grandchildren.

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 Message 250 by Faith, posted 07-03-2006 2:17 PM Faith has replied

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deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2914 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 258 of 298 (328591)
07-03-2006 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 254 by Faith
07-03-2006 2:33 PM


Re: A small point
But we YECs don't operate by that assumption. We have a completely other model in mind.
It doesn't matter what model you have in mind. That does not change the facts, which your model does not take into account. You can't just create new facts.
Again you are assuming uniformitarianism and assuming conditions now, and assuming the whole evolutionist program.
Well, one can study population genetics in a fruit fly colony in the lab, create bottle necks, etc and watch it all unfolding right in front of you. There is no reason NOT to assume that a human population 4000 years ago would have behaved in a significantly different way in terms of population genetics. Also we have some pretty good data on Amish and royal family populations and we know what inbreeding can do (and they don't generally marry any closer than second cousins. Noah's grandchildren were FIRST cousins). Again you have to provide some evidence that population genetics followed a different set of rules since the parsimonius explanation is that the rules are the same now as then.
Mutation is pretty much IT, and that is full of holes.
Off topic so I won't pursue it except to say that you have never successfully argued that point and you provide no citation so we can safely ignore it as "facts not in evidence."
they still had relative health compared to us, quite dramatically better health.
Again, an assertion with no evidence cited. Anyway the state of health of Noah and his family would not have been good for long if a virus being carried by an animal had swept through their tiny population.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 254 by Faith, posted 07-03-2006 2:33 PM Faith has replied

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