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Author | Topic: Prayer, faith and healing | |||||||||||||||||||
Pringlesguy7 Inactive Member |
Fact, only around 10% of ancient Christian historical sites are actually excavated!! you know why? no one has the money! They have found the walls of Jericho, some of Solomon's castles and other fortified strucers, pottery, tablets from egyptians referring to events from the exodus and other biblical events. And.....he is right, there are a lot of artifacts and stuff from digsites from other cultures, this is because many of the ancient Israeli's were taken captive during different periods of their history, and they were removed from their land, and some intermarried. Also, if you look up other ancient civilizations, and some stuff they believe, most will have a flood story, and a creation story....hmmm...where other book have I read that has a creation story, and a flood story.The Bible. ( also look up Gilgamesh, and the Enuma elish, or the Epic of Atrahasis)
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Pringlesguy7 Inactive Member |
I would definately be interested in watching and throwing my 2 cents in now and then in that debate. I have already a bit, but I will be looking forward to see what Doyle has to say. P.S doyle, in regard to your Dad's healing experiences....I think you have the wrong idea of Christianity, no where in the Bible does it say that all who call on the name of the lord will be healed, it does they they will be saved, and I believe that if all those people you father visited were believers, that they right now are in paradise with God our Father.
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John Inactive Member |
quote: Source, please. How are we getting this figure anyway? 10% of sites mentioned in the NT? 10% of sites found? If the latter, you can't know if the site is an ancient Christian historical site until it is excavated.
quote: It is a rare archeaologist, whatever the subject, who doesn't have this problem.
quote: Jericho was inhabited for a loooong time-- starting about 10kya. There are ruins of several settlements, none of them matching the biblical accounts.
Repeated excavations by various expeditions at Jericho and Ai, the two cities whose conquest is described in the greatest detail in the Book of Joshua, have proved very disappointing. Despite the excavators' efforts, it emerged that in the late part of the 13th century BCE, at the end of the Late Bronze Age, which is the agreed period for the conquest, there were no cities in either tell, and of course no walls that could have been toppled.
No webpage found at provided URL: http://www.library.cornell.edu/colldev/mideast/jerques.htm quote: Hmmm....
The three cities of Hazor, Megiddo and Gezer, which are mentioned among Solomon's construction enterprises, have been excavated extensively at the appropriate layers. Only about half of Hazor's upper city was fortified, covering an area of only 30 dunams (7.5 acres), out of a total area of 700 dunams which was settled in the Bronze Age. At Gezer there was apparently only a citadel surrounded by a casemate wall covering a small area, while Megiddo was not fortified with a wall. The picture becomes even more complicated in the light of the excavations conducted in Jerusalem, the capital of the united monarchy. Large sections of the city have been excavated over the past 150 years. The digs have turned up impressive remnants of the cities from the Middle Bronze Age and from Iron Age II ( the period of the Kingdom of Judea). No remains of buildings have been found from the period of the united monarchy (even according to the agreed chronology), only a few pottery shards.
Page not found - Biblical Archaeology Society quote: The Exodus from Egypt, the wanderings in the desert and Mount Sinai: The many Egyptian documents that we have make no mention of the Israelites' presence in Egypt and are also silent about the events of the Exodus. Many documents do mention the custom of nomadic shepherds to enter Egypt during periods of drought and hunger and to camp at the edges of the Nile Delta. However, this was not a solitary phenomenon: such events occurred frequently over thousands of years and were hardly exceptional. Generations of researchers tried to locate Mount Sinai and the encampments of the tribes in the desert. Despite these intensive efforts, not even one site has been found that can match the biblical account. -- same source as the previous quote
quote: This is really pretty meaningless. Cultures existing side by side frequently have similar myths.
quote: Yes, and all of these tales predate the Genesis story. Who do you think borrowed from whom? Certainly the writers of the Epic of Gilgamesh didn't borrow from a book that was not to be written for more than a thousand years? I'm sorry, but archaeology is the Bible's worst friend. ------------------
No webpage found at provided URL: www.hells-handmaiden.com
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Pringlesguy7 Inactive Member |
as to my source of where i got the 10%, this is an estimation, because no one knows for sure how much was round, as compared to how much is being dug up. I got this percentage from my professor with his PHD in ancient Semetic languages and culture...so I guess I just took it for granite that he knew what he was talking about. in reference to the money issue, im not sure how many investors care about Biblical archaeology, enough to invest lots of money and years to dig a city up, I know some do, but all i was getting at is that I'm sure more money has gone to digging in the egyptian pyramids and tombs, than in israel and the middle east looking for Biblical artifacts.
In response to your response about the walls of jericho, i am staring at a picture in my old testament book "Encountering the Old testament, which whows a picture with the caption of "the ruins of Jericho" as to the article that says the evidence is very disappointing...My book that is Published, tells a little bit different story. It says that there was a conquest, but the date is what people are not sure about. Here is an excerpt "Archaeologists have excavated many sites the Bible says the Israelites conquered. Evidence from Jericho, unfortunately, has proven largely in conclusive, but excavations at Lachish, Debir, and Hazor have revealed massive destrucion layers from about the thirteenth century .C. .....The Bible specififally names only three cities the Israelites burned--Jericho,Ai, and Hazor. Moreover, evidence of the migration of othe people into Palestine about 1200 B.C. suggests these people--not the Israelites-- may have destroyed the many towns and villages. In light of the disagreement over the archaelogical data, it seems wisest to await further evidence. We can still affirm the historicity of the events in the Book of Joshua, even if we do not know precisely when they occurred" (Encountering the Old Testament p169-170) If a city were to be burnt, especially a few thousand years ago, that could be a reason why there is not a lot of evidence about it around today. This book was published in 1998, the article you have a link to(Bible Archaeology review) is published in 1999. It appears as though they are in conflict a bit, im not saying they are wrong, because I have no clue who runs that site, all I'm saying is, this is what is in a Published book. And the first article, it seems as though the writer went in with a biased opinion that no matter hwat he found, the BIble would be wrong. You said "Jericho was inhabited for a loooong time-- starting about 10kya. There are ruins of several settlements, none of them matching the biblical accounts."These other sites...waht are they? just curious, or are they the sites of Hazor, Megiddo and Gezer? As for the other creation stories, all I know right now, is that if you believe the flood story, then all life originated from that one spot where the Ark landed, and as God confused and spread out the people from Babel, that they would all have the same basic concepts of acreation story the flood,etc... (but they would all be different, to fit them into their mythology)You have a good point about the epic of Gilgamesh, im sorry if I did not communicate that well enough. You are right, they probably did not copy it from the Bible. if you are looking for everything that is in the BIble, to be documented somwehre on paper in a museum, you are probably not going to find it. So I hope you do not get too disappointed. I am also not afrid to say that I dont know. One should not be expected to know everything about GOd, becuase that is just not going to happen.Page not found - Biblical Archaeology Society take a look at that, and that is even the same site you used. (and no I do not think I am always right,im just trying to present maybe different points you may have not heard) http://www.biblical-archaeology.net/"the Shishak Relief depicts Egypt's victory over King Rehoboam in about 925 BC, when Solomon's Temple in Judah was plundered. This is the exact event mentioned in 1 Kings 14 and 2 Chronicles 12." http://www.bible-archaeology.com/Bible Archaeology: Cities of Ancient Israel "Bible archaeology finds its ultimate significance in the cities of ancient Israel. Mentioned more than 50 times in the Bible, Jericho was the initial entry point into the Promised Land for the Israelite people (Joshua 6). Archaeology has now confirmed the location of this fortified city of walls and towers that guarded entry to the land of Canaan from the east" a little further down on this page....."Excavations in the north have also revealed the city of Dan, which was a Canaanite stronghold conquered by Israel (specifically, the tribe of Dan) around 1150 BC (Judges 18). The rebuilt city, which became the northern boundary of Israel, has delivered a wealth of artifacts with biblical importance. The southern boundary of Israel was Beersheba, which became a fortified city during the period of King Solomon (1 Kings 4:25). Excavations between 1969 and 1976 have revealed massive walls, gates, wells and storehouses consistent with biblical accounts" Archaeology is not the Bibles worst friend?? Maybe you didnt look into it quite enough?[This message has been edited by Pringlesguy7, 10-09-2003] [This message has been edited by Pringlesguy7, 10-09-2003]
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Amlodhi Inactive Member |
Hello Rock Hound, Pringlesguy7, John, Doyle, messenjaH, etal . . .
OK, this sounds like fun. I told Rock Hound that I would start a biblical archaeology thread in the miscellaneous forum. Sorry I got sidetracked, but I'm heading over there right now to start a thread (give me a few minutes). I hope you will all join in. Edited to update: As per IrishRockhound's suggestion, I have now started a new biblical archaeology thread in the miscellaneous topics forum. I have requested that either messenjaH or Pringlesguy7 choose one of the points they have raised in this forum and reproduce it on the new thread to open the discussion. Namaste' Amlodhi [This message has been edited by Amlodhi, 10-09-2003]
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popeye Inactive Member |
I didn't believe in faith healing until a friend of me told me a story about something that really happened. You can read it here : Duplicate post hidden Edited by AdminJar, : No reason given.
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popeye Inactive Member |
I didn't believe in faith healing until a friend of me told me a story about something that really happened. You can read it here :
shortened link Edited by AdminJar, : No reason given.
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popeye Inactive Member |
Triplicate post hidden. Edited by AdminJar, : No reason given.
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AdminJar Inactive Member |
popeye stop it right now.
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popeye Inactive Member |
spam removed
Edited by AdminJar, : spammer
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popeye Inactive Member |
spam removed
Edited by AdminJar, : spammer
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randman  Suspended Member (Idle past 4921 days) Posts: 6367 Joined: |
A good place to learn about the importance of faith is reading the gospel accounts of Jesus' ministry and study the teachings of Jesus on faith and healing. Faith is an important ingedient in bringing forth a healing or miracle via a ministry or believer involved in such things.
However, that does not always mean the person needs to have faith. The gospels show where a friend's faith can suffice. I also don't think that any of this rules out God healing for his own purposes with or without anyone's faith being expressed for that healing, but we know from experience, that God generally does not cure all illnesses since many people die from illnesses. I'd also point out that faith alone is not the only necessary ingredient. Jesus probably had plenty of faith, but did no miracles until fasting for a long period of time, and subsequently receiving a greater anointing. Fasting generally precedes receiving the power for healing and miracles, as far as the ministry is concerned.
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AdminJar Inactive Member |
Popeye you are suspended for one week for continued spamming. If you post that link after that you will be suspended indefinitely.
Comments on moderation procedures (or wish to respond to admin messages)? - Go to:
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