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Author Topic:   Does radio-carbon dating disprove evolution?
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3938 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 6 of 308 (339134)
08-11-2006 5:00 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by randman
08-10-2006 11:55 PM


I'll chime in on the stuff I know.
Another example is coal. According to the geologic column, it takes several hundred million years for coal to form. Coal samples yield a radiocarbon age of only several thousand years.
C14 is not JUST produced in the atmosphere. It is also produced by normal radioactive decay of elements in the ground. There will be a low level of C14. Coal dates to the extreme limit of the method. It is like trying to measure an 18-wheeler on a home scale, they only go up to about 300 lbs. You are not suggesting that 18-wheelers weight 300 lbs just because we picked a stupid way to measure it do you?
Even today, when you hear someone saying that they have found a dinosaur fossil 100 million years old, it is not because of radiocarbon dating, but simply because the geologic column says that dinosaurs went extinct 65 million years ago. Radiocarbon dating on dinosaurs have yielded dates more than 10000 years.
Radiocarbon dating on fossils is simply stupid. There is no more carbon left in a fossil. The definition of a fossil is organic material that has been REPLACED by minerals in the surrounding rock. Most things that are fossilized are also at the extreme limit of the method. See the comment above about an 18-wheeler. People who radiocarbon date fossils are just trying produce erratic results KNOWING that the method will produce them because it just does not fit. This is complete and utter dishonesty by Creationists. See my signature.
If evolutionists are right in maintaining that life started a few billion years ago, 99% of fossils would yield a radiocarbon date of more than 10000 years. But according to radiocarbon databases, more than 90% of fossils have an age less than 10000 years. This is in spite of the fact that we have instruments that can measure ages up to 70000 bp.
Once again, you are going to get erratic results becuase it is just plain retarded to carbon date fossils. You are just measuring the carbon content of the rock. Radiocarbon dating rocks is futile and dishonest. The rest of the post is more of the same. When Creationists do any radioisotope dating, they usually do it to stuff they KNOW is outide the method or just plan invalid. See Snelling's invalid use of radiocarbon.

Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by randman, posted 08-10-2006 11:55 PM randman has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by johnfolton, posted 08-11-2006 8:51 AM Jazzns has not replied

  
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3938 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


(1)
Message 38 of 308 (339574)
08-12-2006 4:27 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by randman
08-12-2006 2:28 PM


Re: the usual idiocy from some evos
Randman, do you think it is valid to carbon date something that is not organic?
What would you think of someone who did that and started screaming that carbon dating is false because it produced some crazy date?

Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by randman, posted 08-12-2006 2:28 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by randman, posted 08-12-2006 4:54 PM Jazzns has replied

  
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3938 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 41 of 308 (339591)
08-12-2006 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by randman
08-12-2006 4:54 PM


Re: the usual idiocy from some evos
I never said that they were not. I was talking about other things that are inorganic. Some well preserved samples of dinosaur remains have been found that are not fossilized. They are not fossils. I am not versed enough in the relevant sciences to determine if carbon traces from such samples are canidates for carbon dating.
What I asked you though, is simply do you think it is valid to carbon date something that is not organic? I would HOPE that your answer to this question is no.
What would you think of someone who did that and started screaming that carbon dating is false because it produced some crazy date?
What if I could show you a number of instances where Creationists were caught carbon dating objects that were inorganic?

Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by randman, posted 08-12-2006 4:54 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by randman, posted 08-12-2006 5:39 PM Jazzns has replied

  
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3938 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 47 of 308 (339676)
08-12-2006 8:00 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by randman
08-12-2006 5:39 PM


Re: the usual idiocy from some evos
Not all fossils contain that and the OP had the ABSURD claim that 90% of fossils carbon date to less than 10000 years. 90% of fossils do not contain left over carbon. Most fossil are completely mineralized.
So anyone who is carbon dating some of those fully fossilized samples is invalidly using the method on INORGANIC material.
But that is not the extent of Creationists misuse of the method. Even though it is known that you cannot carbon date fossils or marine animals Creationists seem to do that any and then claim that it invalidates the method.
My reply do you had a link to one high profile example of this.
Snelling's invalid use of radiocarbon
There is also the oft talked about snails and other marine animals that carbon date old. This is in COMPLETE contrast to the rules for when the method is valid. You cannot carbon date inorganic material. You cannot carbon date marine organisms because they are permiated with carbon from ocean sediments rather than from the atmosphere.
Creationists either ignorantly or purposefully dishonestly carbon date these inappropriate samples and then use them to claim that the method is invalid. Neither case looks good for the Creationist in general.
As I have always said on this board. You can carbon date a plastic spoon and it will give you a date. But that date does not MEAN ANYTHING.

Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by randman, posted 08-12-2006 5:39 PM randman has not replied

  
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