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Author Topic:   Reality is not based upon our perception.
1.61803
Member (Idle past 1524 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 14 of 37 (346668)
09-05-2006 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by GDR
09-02-2006 1:04 PM


The event takes place irregardless and independant of a observer. Or does the event exist in a state of superpositon? If a measurement is taken or a observation made; does looking in Schrodingers box affect the outcome? I believe there is a intimate relationship between conciousness / observation and causality. I also believe perception of reality is causal as well.
Thats why I always try to whistle a happy tune and think positive thoughts. Ya never know if the metaphysical is going to flop in your favor regardless if you believe in it or not. Then again I am a dyed in the wool NON-determinist.

"One is punished most for ones virtues" Fredrick Neitzche

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by GDR, posted 09-02-2006 1:04 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by GDR, posted 09-05-2006 2:06 PM 1.61803 has replied

  
1.61803
Member (Idle past 1524 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 16 of 37 (346722)
09-05-2006 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by GDR
09-05-2006 2:06 PM


GDR writes:
I agree but is that a philosophical or a scientific position? Maybe something of each.) Can that position ever be proven using the scientific method?
Hypothesis: conciousness and observation are interconnected to reality.
Boy throwing rocks in parking lot where new car is parked.
a: you don't witness it. Outcome you see broken windshied and make assumptions on what occured.
b. you observe boy throwing rocks, He sees you observing him and he stops his shenanigans. Your car is undamaged.
Conclusion: favorable outcome due to concious observation.
Double slit experiment: Open one slit and a partical pattern occurs. Open the other slit and a wave interference pattern emerges. Regardless of aiming photon in exact location. How in the hell? what the heck is going on???
Bells Theorem: The particle knows whats happening to it's paired electron. conciousness on a quantum level.
Spooky action at a distance? or just plain VEERED and I am not even from Holland.
So take your pick Copehagen, Multiple universe, Brane, M, or fane determinism based on Scrodinger wave function propagation based calculations. I as you can see dont have any answers. Im just glad I caught that kid throwing rocks.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by GDR, posted 09-05-2006 2:06 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by GDR, posted 09-05-2006 4:41 PM 1.61803 has replied

  
1.61803
Member (Idle past 1524 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 18 of 37 (346746)
09-05-2006 4:59 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by GDR
09-05-2006 4:41 PM


GDR writes:
I have trouble understanding the argument for the universe being deterministic.
SHhhsshhh!! not so loud.
You'll awaken Cave diver and Wounded King.
I believe it is like many things in nature a little of both. We can decide to tip the dominoe over or not...but once done it follows its course.
Peace .

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by GDR, posted 09-05-2006 4:41 PM GDR has replied

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 Message 20 by GDR, posted 09-05-2006 6:04 PM 1.61803 has replied

  
1.61803
Member (Idle past 1524 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 22 of 37 (346833)
09-05-2006 8:46 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by GDR
09-05-2006 6:04 PM


GDR writes:
what would exist if anything if all conciousness ceased.
You may find out in about 60 years. If there were not one extant organism on Earth do you think the cosmos would not exist? There was a time in our past when there was no planet Earth. No sun. And yet events unfolded to produce our planet and galaxy. That in itself suggest reality is based on something more than observation. But I propose that energy itself is concious.
That would explain alot. Although I have no way to provide evidence for that hair brained idea. But just what if quantum entanglement is a form of conciousness? I know sounds silly.
Almost as silly as a holographic universe.
Peace.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by GDR, posted 09-05-2006 6:04 PM GDR has replied

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1.61803
Member (Idle past 1524 days)
Posts: 2928
From: Lone Star State USA
Joined: 02-19-2004


Message 26 of 37 (346990)
09-06-2006 2:28 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by ringo
09-06-2006 2:03 PM


Re: Does reality require an observer?
Ringo writes:
So how does God communicate his observations to us- in a reproducible way?
Perhaps the Universe is more like a mind (of God) than a thought or observation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by ringo, posted 09-06-2006 2:03 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
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