UCLA student tased multiple times... pointless police violence?

I agree completely. It seems pretty clear that the only offense that the student committed was not bowing and tugging his forelock at the cops' request. That kind of behaviour is what the cops (and people like nemesis juggernaut) think is "escalation".Well, of course it IS escalation. From the police point of view, any challenge to their complete authority is the most dangerous challenge that can be made. Passive resistance to the cops is far more dangerous to them than any screaming drunk or loony with a knife. Of course, that is the reason the cops got mad. They undoubtedly treated him worse than they would have treated somebody caught drunk driving but who responded with the expected obsequity.Fuckin pigs.Mick

You know, I've watched the video clip a few times and one of the main things that upsets me is that the surrounding students, while clearly disapproving of the cops' behaviour, do absolutely nothing to help the victim. Absolutely nothing at all!If I was in the position of the onlookers, I find it hard to imagine I would do nothing at all. I think it would be appropriate to perform a citizen's arrest on the cops, and to give some first aid to the student. When I put myself in the place of the onlookers, I would like to think I would try to help the tasered guy by giving one or more of the cops a good uppercut to the head. The fact that the students surrounding this incident are unable to do a single thing to help him other than yelling "stop that" is quite depressing.This all indicates to me a rather scary attititude - "we should all respect cops" - has permeated the society even to those who should be most against it.Very sad. This guy was physically attacked for no reason, and his fellow student stood around in a circle and did absolutely nothing to help him.Mick

crashfrog,I think you are being a bit silly here. I was expecting to be criticised for my attitude that cops are working against the interests of normal students. I DID NOT expect to get criticised for thinking that the US democracy has degraded to such an extent that standing up to cops was tantamount to suicide. If you genuinely think that the twenty to thirty students surrounding this incident would have been shot and killed by the cops, then american democracy is in a FAR WORSE a state than I have interpreted it. Sure, if the students are in danger of being murdered for standing up for a brown-skinned person, then you are quite right, they should be saving up their efforts for more coordinated activity. But I doubt very strongly that the cops in this case were going to shoot thirty white students to death. I am not aware of any incident where college cops have shot to death thirty white students. But maybe you are right, and US citizens are genuinely living in some crazy Orwellian fantasy of instant obliteration if they stand up to the police???? Again, you have the weird idea that the cops are going to kill any student who stands against them. If you are serious, I hope you are talking to your congressman about this problem. Because it would be a very serious problem, if it were true. Well, in your fantasy world in which anybody standing up against the tyrannical UCLA security guards is going to die a violent death, that is probably the best that they can do. Personally, I think that the cops are servants of the people, and that a couple of well-placed uppercuts would be sufficient in calming the situation and showing the cops exactly who they are supposed to be working for.I'm really baffled by your post. Your comments on biological matters seem quite sensible, but when you talk about student politics you make it sound like major massacres of students are right round the corner!Mick

This is why Americans are considered political illiterates everywhere in the world. These lazy, bourgeois people think that the aim of democracy is to avoid "being bashed on the head". Their concern with playing things by the book is what allowed their rulers to invade another country and to kill tens of thousands if people in the name of an emasculated vision of democracy which involves "being nice to cops". It's depressing to read it, and more so because the people who write this nonsense are on the left rather than the right of politics.It is time for the left in the US to stand against the authoritarian violence that is carried out in their name. It is unsurprising that Americans fail to do so. Rather, they would rather deal in ironies: Pathetic.MickEdited by mick, : No reason given.

Well that is your problem isn't it? I have been active in trade unions and anti-racism campaigns in my own country, and it maybe is time for middle class white students at UCLA to be active too.Mick

well michael, this is exactly what I mean. Lazy americans who think they are excluded from democratic participation because they live in backwaters like Oklahoma. It's pathetic, and dangerous.Mick

Okay, I said:"This is why Americans are considered political illiterates everywhere in the world"In response I get the following replies: Well, I'm proved incorrect aren't I? Politically-committed citizens of the US have clearly demonstrated their clarity of thought and knowledge of history.Excuse me whie I vomit.MickEdited by mick, : No reason given.

Well Chiroptera, it's more serious than that.Your rulers have gone and invaded a foreign country for their own financial gain, and now they're tyrannizing dark-skinned citizens within US borders.I don't see any response from US citizens that makes me think anybody is taking this seriously. The question is, can you go and drift into a fascist government and enjoy it while feeling smug for scoring a point on Evc forum?Mick

I mean, what really pisses me off is that people like Chiroptera, who is on the far left of politics on EvC forum, seems happy to err on the side of the cops. They're fucking cowards for doing it - one has to wonder how far fascism in the US has to go before they'll criticize it. It just pisses me off, to see bright people make excuses for a bunch of right wing white fuckers in uniforms and with badges, kicking the shit out of an Iranian for no reason. They should be ashamed of themselves. And if that happened in MY library, I would certainly punch the cop in the head and rescue the Iranian.I should say, I have not spoken to a single person in Canada who thinks I'm off-the-wall, including professional librarians, who say they would not permit such violence on their premises and would welcome student support to get the cops off the premises.MickEdited by mick, : No reason given.Edited by mick, : in edit: mind you, libraries in Canada are open to the public, unlike elitist libraries in the US where you have to show ID just to get through the door.

michael, do you want to criticize my thought, or just make snide comments from the sidelines?

Dr Jones, you should have found out what your rights were before being hassled like that. The vast majority of Canadian univeristies allow ANYBODY to use their libraries. And I know from personal experience that UA is one of those libraries.in edit: as far as I know, public access to university libraries is guaranteed by law, in canada. Are you seriously suggesting that the cops would taser 20-40 people? That's just bullshit, and you know it is. That would never happen in a public library in the US.
MickEdited by mick, : No reason given.Edited by mick, : No reason given.

Chiroptera, that is the quote I would say is pro-cop. You say without any evidence whatsoever (indeed, you guarantee it!) that the cops have the favor of public opinion. You might disagree with my interpretation that you are pro-cop, but it would be better to make your position clear, rather than saying I am being stupid.MickEdited by mick, : No reason given.

Crashfrog, you are arguing against somebody's argument, but it is not mine!I have never suggested that anybody might die, and it is utterly innapropriate for you to suggest otherwise. I have made it quite clear that a concerted response from the onlookers might help the young man. I don't see anything there saying anybody has to die. This is probably something in your American fantasy world. I don't agree. That is, quite clearly, an explanation of the tasering cops attitude. You say that they tasered him "as an excuse for more brutality."It is an explanation I happen to disagree with. Deal with it. I happen to disagree with the idea that they did "exactly the right thing". I think I've made my reasoning quite clear.You make completely irrelevant propoganda comments, like: I'm not particularly worried about "winding up on my ass" but I don't want my point of view to be rubbished for no reason. I'm sorry, but I don't find that kind of argument convincing.Mick

Is it so strange that I have never heard of such a thing? I have to say I am amazed that you think "suicide by cop" is a normal state of affairs that I (for some reason?) am supposed to take for granted.No, I've never heard of "suicide by cop" and if that's seriously what is motivating these students' behaviour then it goes without saying that they can't be held responsible for what they do. Well I am learning a lot about US campuses here. Apparently students are in danger of lethal force while reading quietly in the library! I am sorry if UCLA has such problems with terrorism, that "lethal force" is de rigeur on campus.Sigh... If that is what your argument lies upon - lethal force as a standard form of discipline, and "suicide by cop" as a way of life - well then you can win the argument no probs.But don't you see how stupid your argument sounds? You appear to be saying: "If somebody gets tazered for no reason in the middle of your public library, don't do anything, because the cops might use lethal force on YOU!"MickEdited by mick, : No reason given.

Hmmn. That sounds encouraging. yet crashfrog is saying that suicide by cop and the use of lethal force is standard on US campuses... so now I don't know what to believe...