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Author Topic:   Fulfilled Prophecy
iceage 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5937 days)
Posts: 1024
From: Pacific Northwest
Joined: 09-08-2003


Message 5 of 303 (373878)
01-03-2007 12:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Buzsaw
01-02-2007 7:37 PM


Standard of Specificity
There needs to be some standard of specificity for prophecy.
This is not even weak but simply ludicrous.
buz writes:
1. Travel will increase. Of course, the horse was the fast road for humans for all the milleniums until the emergence of the industrial revolution. Prophecies implying increase of and faster travel:
Daniel 12:4 (about 530BC) Daniel says: "But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."
Item: increase of knowledge and travel.
The allegedly prophetic content here is:
  • "Many shall run to and fro". Oh come on ... I would not even put this in the weak to very weak category.
  • "and knowledge shall be increased". Now that is right up there with Pat Robertson. Knowledge has increased since the advent of written languages... Duh.
    Continuing on in awe and amazement....
    Nah. 2:3 writes:
    The shield of his mighty men is made red, the valiant men are in scarlet: the chariots shall be with flaming torches in the day of his preparation, and the fir trees shall be terribly shaken. The chariots shall rage in the streets, they shall justle one against another in the broad ways: they shall seem like torches, they shall run like the lightnings.
    Battle dress in ancient days was often red. The Spartan wore red tunics and so did the Romans. Big deal. The remainder is some poetic excesses that you are stretching to point of absurdity.
    "flaming torches" while other translations such as ASV use the following language "the chariots flash with steel".
    This is just picturesque language.
    I could dig into the any ancient literature and find just as "remarkable" prophecies.
    Let's see.
    Virgils Aeneid writes:
    Thus they pretend, but in the hollow side
    Selected numbers of their soldiers hide:
    With inward arms the dire machine they load,
    And iron bowels stuff the dark abode.
    Clearly this foretold of a particular style of computer virus that masquerades as a useful or attractive application while hiding a insidious sinister purpose deep within the "bowels".
    Or the Spartan aerodynamic inverted V battle dress symbol prophesied future rocket based weapons.

  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Buzsaw, posted 01-02-2007 7:37 PM Buzsaw has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 7 by arachnophilia, posted 01-03-2007 1:09 AM iceage has not replied
     Message 12 by Nighttrain, posted 01-03-2007 2:48 AM iceage has not replied
     Message 19 by Buzsaw, posted 01-03-2007 8:44 PM iceage has replied

    iceage 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 5937 days)
    Posts: 1024
    From: Pacific Northwest
    Joined: 09-08-2003


    Message 8 of 303 (373882)
    01-03-2007 1:13 AM
    Reply to: Message 4 by Taz
    01-03-2007 12:38 AM


    Re: Not Prophecy but rather Nonsense.
    taz writes:
    I have no idea why people of the past (or even present day prophets) communicate in such obscure manner.
    That is simple. The number 1 rule in successful prophecy is to be obscure. The more specific you are the more likely you will be wrong.
    The number 2 rule in successful prophecy - Never but never but a near future time frame on it.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 4 by Taz, posted 01-03-2007 12:38 AM Taz has not replied

    iceage 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 5937 days)
    Posts: 1024
    From: Pacific Northwest
    Joined: 09-08-2003


    Message 10 of 303 (373893)
    01-03-2007 2:16 AM
    Reply to: Message 1 by Buzsaw
    01-02-2007 7:37 PM


    Sir Isaac Newton Quote
    Just for grins I did a little digging into one of your references. The alleged quote of Sir Isaac sounded a little funny.
    Allegedly Sir Isaac writes:
    'I believe, that in the providence of God, though the method now be entirely hidden, men will yet travel on the earth at the rate of fifty miles an hour.
    First I notice the alleged quote is second hand. Some fellow John Lewis Shuler is quoting Sir Isaac Newton. But I cannot find any other reference or even the direct source of the quote. Hmmmm sound even a little more funny.
    Further I could find very little John Lewis Shuler let alone "Signs of the Times". Perhaps it was a pamphlet, however not a reliable reference.
    Buz do you have a direct source for your Sir Isaac Newton quote?
    Even further Lewis Shuler takes some liberty with the alleged quote and adds a bit of additional information.
    John Lewis Shuler writes:
    Newton declared that he was convinced from a study of Bible prophecy that there was destined to be a marvelous increase in the speed of transportation on the earth.
    The statement that Newton arrived at this declaration based on the biblical prophecy is not support by the alleged Newton quote.
    Edited by iceage, : No reason given.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 1 by Buzsaw, posted 01-02-2007 7:37 PM Buzsaw has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 155 by Buzsaw, posted 01-08-2007 9:34 PM iceage has not replied

    iceage 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 5937 days)
    Posts: 1024
    From: Pacific Northwest
    Joined: 09-08-2003


    Message 21 of 303 (374201)
    01-03-2007 8:50 PM
    Reply to: Message 19 by Buzsaw
    01-03-2007 8:44 PM


    Re: Standard of Specificity
    buz writes:
    corroborating prophetic end time stuff such as the phenomenal return of Jews to Israel and with a super-phenomenal increase in both travel and knowledge.
    "Many shall run to and fro" and "knowledge shall be increased" does not convey super-phenomenal increase.
    At any rate, I am very underwhelmed.
    BTW.... You specifically used a supposed quote by Sir Isaac to buttress your OP. Can you find provide an independent reference for that quote? Reference Message 10

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 19 by Buzsaw, posted 01-03-2007 8:44 PM Buzsaw has not replied

    iceage 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 5937 days)
    Posts: 1024
    From: Pacific Northwest
    Joined: 09-08-2003


    Message 106 of 303 (375064)
    01-07-2007 1:53 AM
    Reply to: Message 104 by anglagard
    01-07-2007 1:11 AM


    Re: Ten Well Known Examples
    You list is a bit short....
    Jim Jones - Everybody knows the story. Liar, killer, sexual glutton, etc.
    Randy Weaver of Ruby Ridge fame - Randy was a ultra religious nut case job. Weaver smeared the blood of a goat over the front door frame in celebration of Passover. During their menstrual periods, Vicki and the
    girls, "unclean" in the eyes of their male god, had to retreat to
    a shed outside. Proxy Killer with the aid of the FBI.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 104 by anglagard, posted 01-07-2007 1:11 AM anglagard has not replied

    iceage 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 5937 days)
    Posts: 1024
    From: Pacific Northwest
    Joined: 09-08-2003


    Message 150 of 303 (375463)
    01-08-2007 7:29 PM
    Reply to: Message 149 by Buzsaw
    01-08-2007 7:16 PM


    Re: Proof orbelief?
    Never mind....
    Edited by iceage, : No reason given.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 149 by Buzsaw, posted 01-08-2007 7:16 PM Buzsaw has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 156 by Buzsaw, posted 01-08-2007 9:45 PM iceage has not replied

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