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Author | Topic: Harry Potter: Its all over | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taz Member (Idle past 3312 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
nator writes:
While I agree with you about the morality thing, I don't think it reflects real world situation at all. Take a look at the first movie. Every step of the way, Harry is protected and embraced by the figures of authority. They even gave him the Nhimbus 2000...3000...whatever. It's my experience that it's the good/nice guys that never get the attention they deserve in real schools. Just talking about dating, you have to be an asshole to get any date these days (and I'm talking from experience here... after I became a nice guy, my hits went down to almost zero). It is a great morality tale about choosing to do the right thing, even when it costs you dearly, and how incredibly hard it often is to do that. Disclaimer: Occasionally, owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have used he/him/his meaning he or she/him or her/his or her in order to avoid awkwardness of style. He, him, and his are not intended as exclusively masculine pronouns. They may refer to either sex or to both sexes!
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mike the wiz Member Posts: 4755 From: u.k Joined: |
SPOILERS ALERT
He (Snape) didn't really care about Harry. I don't know, I think he was a private person, because of his request for Harry to never know about his obsession with Lily. He saw James in Harry, and obviously he therefore disliked him. He was a goody deep down, I think he simply felt compelled to become a deatheater as it was his only chance to oppose everyone he hated, because he was jealous. That was the only group that would accept him. Perhaps he saw himself in Draco Malfoy. That was one hell of a lot of memories he gave Potter when he was dying. Lol. I think Harry would have needed a barrel to fit all that memory-gas into.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
i didn't like three as a movie for precisely the reasons you complain about the first two... i think.
it was a great survey of what happened in the book, but it only touched on things oh so quickly and i didn't feel like it explained anything. it didn't seem to stand on its own very well. of course, i may be biased since i didn't see it until after i had read it but saw the other two prior to reading them. i somehow skipped 3 while seeing the movies. i have no idea what happened. 4 was timed very differently from the book, but it stood pretty well.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
Brekka brenna.it's easy. a common girl's name even. just not mine. the first two films were mould-filled Hellpants possible. i saw them in the theatre a million years ago. i have fossils to prove that date.
the time travel element is really fun on screen. i agree. i guess it wasn't a BAD movie. it's just that it worked so much less than i had hoped. Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
Everything that Harry loved or that protected him or gave him any guidence had to be taken away from him in order for him to do what he needed to do, and that included Hogwarts and the teachers there. Loss and abandonment and how we pesevere and make our own way is a major theme of the series.
i agree. also, note that the story ended in chorus at hogwarts. btw i thought it was really interesting that each of the seven horcruxes was destroyed by someone different.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
Where you sad for Snape? I was. I thought he was a good guy he's my favorite character, i think. but that may be because he's the voice of god. i think even his reasons for turning to dumbledore were flawed, but people grow, and he sure did. he was grumpy, but redeemable. Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
i'm sorry? you actually watched the last season of babylon 5?
i guess it lost it for me when marcus died. but then i was just that much too young for politics then and aftermath is so much politics. i was ready for ds9 though.
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Tusko Member (Idle past 121 days) Posts: 615 From: London, UK Joined: |
I hate getting people's names wrong, sorry. I just have a complete mental block over yours for some reason. Maybe I just can't handle more than two syllables that I don't expect together? I'll try to do my best but try not to be annoyed if I do it again - its not on purpose!
I was perhaps a bit harsh on the first two Potter films - I just remember them being really long and not really earning it for me. Also I got a bit embarrassed for a couple of the semi acting youngsters. But it looked cool - though it has been I while since I saw them too.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
I'll try to do my best but try not to be annoyed if I do it again - its not on purpose! it's alright. i've just had this moniker for more than five years. i actually will answer to it in person. i went on a few dates with a guy who intoduced me to his parents as brenna. it was quite funny but completely unintentional.
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nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: The first couple of books are pretty innocent. Harry has it pretty hard for most of the rest of the books. His life really sucks, pretty much all around, for years.
quote: ...except for Snape, who hates his guts and tries to make his life hell. ...and also except his blood relatives, the Dursleys, who also do their best to make his life a terrible one.
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Jaderis Member (Idle past 3446 days) Posts: 622 From: NY,NY Joined: |
While I agree with you about the morality thing, I don't think it reflects real world situation at all. Take a look at the first movie. Every step of the way, Harry is protected and embraced by the figures of authority. They even gave him the Nhimbus 2000...3000...whatever. It's my experience that it's the good/nice guys that never get the attention they deserve in real schools. Well if you had read the books you would have found that Harry is often shunned/ridiculed by his peers, given detention after detention (not just from Snape, btw), ridiculed by the press and persecuted by the Ministry of Magic. It's not just smooth sailing all the way and you have to read the books to really see it because the movies just gloss over most of it. You would also have realized why certain Authority figures seemed to favor him. Because they trusted Dumbledore and he knew Harry's destiny was to defeat Voldemort or be defeated by him. Wouldn't you look after someone who had to bear such a burden and whose very existence gave you hope for peace? I can't really blame you for your assessment, though, because the first book is pretty light fare compared to the rest and is treated pretty well, but that is only to portray the innocence and wonder of childhood and set the stage for the darker times to come. "You are metaphysicians. You can prove anything by metaphysics; and having done so, every metaphysician can prove every other metaphysician wrong--to his own satisfaction. You are anarchists in the realm of thought. And you are mad cosmos-makers. Each of you dwells in a cosmos of his own making, created out of his own fancies and desires. You do not know the real world in which you live, and your thinking has no place in the real world except in so far as it is phenomena of mental aberration." -The Iron Heel by Jack London
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Jaderis Member (Idle past 3446 days) Posts: 622 From: NY,NY Joined: |
I was sad for Snape (and sad we didn't get more of him in this last book). However, I don't really think he was all that good of a guy, although I also guessed that he was a double agent. Ultimately, the only thing he had was an unrequited love/unhealthy obsession for Lily. He didn't really care about Harry. I disagree. Snape was much more complex than that. IMHO, the memories concerning Lily were meant to show Harry why Snape was worthy of Dumbledore's trust and to show him what prompted Snape to work with the side of the Order. But, that's not all he was. I think he was nasty to Harry because he had to be in order to maintain his cover and Harry's resemblance to James only made it a little easier. I also think that he was frustrated at Harry's apparent mediocrity (and let's face it...Harry was pretty average at practical magic and Snape never really got to see him do anything at all impressive). He must have been thinking what I am doing all this for if this kid turns out to be nothing special after all? He desperately wanted Harry to learn the things necessary for his task ahead and he kept on pushing him (albeit in a seemingly malicious and back-handed way, but again that was necessary) up until the last time he saw him ("Shut your mouth and close your mind!!) in HBP. If Snape had only "converted" because Voldemort killed someone he loved, I don't think the trust would have been as powerful. I think that Snape realized what Voldemort truly was and that he didn't want to live in a world where Voldemort or his folowers held any sway (the memory where Lily condemns him for his increasingly alarming views hints at this). Only those who are incapable of love would want to live in that kind of world. Even the Malfoys ended up with misgivings when their beloved son was put in harm's way (well, Narcissa at least - we don't see much of Lucius after the debacle at the MoM). Dumbledore knew that and knew that Snape would do whatever was necessary to ensure that Volemort was defeated. Not out of revenge, but because he was able to love. It must have been such an incredible burden on Snape having to do the things he did. Especially killing Dumbledore (remember the "hate and revulsion" on his face when he did it?). Like I said...he was way more complex than that. "You are metaphysicians. You can prove anything by metaphysics; and having done so, every metaphysician can prove every other metaphysician wrong--to his own satisfaction. You are anarchists in the realm of thought. And you are mad cosmos-makers. Each of you dwells in a cosmos of his own making, created out of his own fancies and desires. You do not know the real world in which you live, and your thinking has no place in the real world except in so far as it is phenomena of mental aberration." -The Iron Heel by Jack London
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nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
The first two movies were just a bunch of scenes from the books, played on the screen. Too simple and list-like.
The third, though, actually had a central theme (time), was cinematically interesting and very well-edited, and the kids' acting was better, I think, because they got better direction. It also had a sense of humor and felt more like the director had a creative, cohesive vision.
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nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
You make very good points, and I shall ponder them.
PS Excellent post about "femininity" to Juggs over on the Feminism thread, BTW.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
i quite agree.
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