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Author Topic:   Faith now has her own forum (pertaining to evcforum.net topics)
Adminnemooseus
Director
Posts: 3860
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 1 of 42 (424170)
09-26-2007 12:01 AM


Suspended member Faith has been in some e-mail communication with various admins. One indicated that she has started her own forum, to reply to certain content.

Her forum and her comments can be found at:

http://forums.delphiforums.com/faithtalk1/start

Replies can be made to her there. Please be nice.

Adminnemooseus


Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Jazzns, posted 09-26-2007 11:23 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded
 Message 3 by jar, posted 09-26-2007 11:24 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded
 Message 5 by The Matt, posted 09-26-2007 11:51 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded
 Message 8 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-26-2007 12:26 PM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

    
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 1713 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 2 of 42 (424250)
09-26-2007 11:23 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Adminnemooseus
09-26-2007 12:01 AM


Open the Flood Gates!
If we have let CFO among others back in, why can't we just let Faith back in?

As you can see, people who want a voice will take measures to have it. Why not facilitate that HERE, in this wonderful forum, with a record of debate and dialogue.

I realize I have changed my position on this. But hey, it won't be the last time I have been convinced that I was wrong.


Of course, biblical creationists are committed to belief in God's written Word, the Bible, which forbids bearing false witness; --AIG (lest they forget)
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Adminnemooseus, posted 09-26-2007 12:01 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member
Posts: 30409
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 3 of 42 (424254)
09-26-2007 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Adminnemooseus
09-26-2007 12:01 AM


Let Faith in
I agree, let her in.


Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Adminnemooseus, posted 09-26-2007 12:01 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

  
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1729 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 4 of 42 (424260)
09-26-2007 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Jazzns
09-26-2007 11:23 AM


Re: Open the Flood Gates!
yeah. she's not contracycle or anything lol.

at the very least, let her in with access only to that forum to start or something.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Jazzns, posted 09-26-2007 11:23 AM Jazzns has not yet responded

  
The Matt
Member (Idle past 3343 days)
Posts: 99
From: U.K.
Joined: 06-07-2007


Message 5 of 42 (424264)
09-26-2007 11:51 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Adminnemooseus
09-26-2007 12:01 AM


Why was faith banned, if you don't mind me asking?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Adminnemooseus, posted 09-26-2007 12:01 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Phat, posted 09-26-2007 12:10 PM The Matt has not yet responded
 Message 7 by Phat, posted 09-26-2007 12:11 PM The Matt has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 10805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 6 of 42 (424269)
09-26-2007 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by The Matt
09-26-2007 11:51 AM


delete double post

Edited by Phat, :


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by The Matt, posted 09-26-2007 11:51 AM The Matt has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 10805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 7 of 42 (424270)
09-26-2007 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by The Matt
09-26-2007 11:51 AM


This post and a few more near it explain the events leading up to the ban and suspension.

Faith was and is an enigma and an interesting character.

If I get a vote, I say lets watch her forum for a week or so and then the administrators can vote whether or not to let her back in here. Of course, Percy always has veto power over our decisions!

He who pays the light bill makes the rules! :)


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Adminnemooseus, posted 09-26-2007 3:18 PM Phat has not yet responded
 Message 10 by kuresu, posted 09-26-2007 4:12 PM Phat has not yet responded
 Message 13 by Rob, posted 09-27-2007 12:54 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16018
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 8 of 42 (424276)
09-26-2007 12:26 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Adminnemooseus
09-26-2007 12:01 AM


So ... she wants to debate with evolutionists ... behind their backs?

Hmm. One can almost see the sense in it.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Adminnemooseus, posted 09-26-2007 12:01 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

  
Adminnemooseus
Director
Posts: 3860
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 9 of 42 (424329)
09-26-2007 3:18 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Phat
09-26-2007 12:11 PM


Re: Faith suspension
I think there is a more recent suspension and story. But I'm not now going to try to track it down.

Adminnemooseus


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Phat, posted 09-26-2007 12:11 PM Phat has not yet responded

    
kuresu
Member (Idle past 314 days)
Posts: 2544
From: boulder, colorado
Joined: 03-24-2006


Message 10 of 42 (424345)
09-26-2007 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Phat
09-26-2007 12:11 PM


One tiny problem, phat.

That suspension post is from '05.
Faith posted almost up until the end of last year.

www.evcforum.net/cgi-bin/Threads.cgi?action=tml&mbrid=73 -->www.evcforum.net/cgi-bin/Threads.cgi?action=tml&mbrid=73">http://www.evcforum.net/cgi-bin/Threads.cgi?action=tml&mbrid=73
That's a list of Faith's messages.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Phat, posted 09-26-2007 12:11 PM Phat has not yet responded

    
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 42 (424412)
09-26-2007 9:17 PM


Yes Vote On Conditions
I see no need to evaluate on the basis of her new forum. Admins know her well enough to make a determination.

I vote to allow Faith back with NO special treatment some believe she was given for emotional intemperance. I don't think she would want to be treated any different than anyone else. If she violates, like everyone else she get's suspensions until she conforms to the standards admins expect. If she gets emotionally intemperate, admins can deal with it with whatever action it takes to fix it.


BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past.
Replies to this message:
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Omnivorous
Member (Idle past 769 days)
Posts: 3808
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005


Message 12 of 42 (424445)
09-27-2007 12:35 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Buzsaw
09-26-2007 9:17 PM


One Forum, One Condition
I'd love to see Faith return. Although our relationship was, uh, rocky, I think we attained a bit of mutual respect and understanding.

And any forum that can endure a Cold Foreign Object can handle Faith.

No conditions are necessary, and never were: just treat her like any other member, suspensions and all. As a moderator, I also opposed the banning of Randman until it was clear that a consistent discipline of suspensions was not in the works, perhaps because frequent suspensions might have made him look like a creationist martyr.

I say, suspend members for clear violations of forum rules, and if that means they surface once a month before again being sent beyond the pale, so be it--then at least the possibility of change is not extinguished.

Bannings are like executions. I oppose those, too.

Bannings result from weariness and loss of patience. Suspensions of steadily increasing lengths should prevent those from occurring.

Who knows, maybe Iano of the Sepulchral Hands will hang out more, too. At least these folks could write a coherent sentence. I miss that.

Yo, Faith! Behave! :)

Edited by Omnivorous, : No reason given.


Real things always push back.
-William James

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This message is a reply to:
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Rob 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3650 days)
Posts: 2297
Joined: 06-01-2006


Message 13 of 42 (424446)
09-27-2007 12:54 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by Phat
09-26-2007 12:11 PM


Phat:
He who pays the light bill makes the rules!

I am not going to say a word... (other than those 8).

Edited by Rob, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Phat, posted 09-26-2007 12:11 PM Phat has not yet responded

    
Admin
Director
Posts: 12552
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002


Message 14 of 42 (424539)
09-27-2007 11:41 AM


The Return of Faith
First, some history.

AdminFaith made a series of posts in the admin forum just prior to her departure, and while any of number of messages could serve as the starting point for a series of excerpts, I choose this one from me, Message 191:

Admin writes:

Hi Faith,

You don't like what I said about your approach to discussion, and I don't think much of posturing and indignation as rebuttal, so we're even. If you want to be treated like an adult then begin acting like one. See if you can stick with an actual discussion for a change, without characterizing replies as "maddening", or the ever popular "You are all so infuriating." See this discussion through to the end, contribute constructively throughout, and thereby prove my criticism completely wrong. So far you're just proving my point.

Let's make the steps even smaller and see if we can find some common ground. What did you mean when you said this in Message 1:

AdminFaith writes:

I read your message 144 about the requirements of science and simply thought how it defines creationism out of existence...

What part of my Message 144 "defines creationism out of existence"? Weren't you referring to the parts about science's focus on the natural world?

--Percy

AdminFaith replied in Message 192:

AdminFaith writes:

You will not talk to me like that if you want to have a discussion with me.

I replied in Message 193:

Admin writes:

Faith writes:

You will not talk to me like that if you want to have a discussion with me.


What you're doing is what you always do. As serious examination of your position draws increasingly difficult to avoid, you sabotage discussion by finding an excuse to get up on your high horse and ride off in a huff, or your other favored alternative, disintegrating into an excoriation of all and sundry that brings discussion to a halt as the moderators have to take over. Go ahead, Faith, prove me wrong.

There's another choice available to you. You could contribute constructively to the discussion. This is a simple question, please help move the discussion forward by addressing it:

AdminFaith writes:

I read your message 144 about the requirements of science and simply thought how it defines creationism out of existence...

What part of my Message 144 "defines creationism out of existence"? Weren't you referring to the parts about science's focus on the natural world?

--Percy

AdminFaith replies in Message 195:

AdminFaith writes:

You will apologize for your personal comments in posts #178, #191, and #193. You will rescind them, you will promise not to say such things again, and THEN we will have a discussion, and not otherwise. The problem is not me complaining about abusive treatment, Percy, it is the abusive treatment itself, in this case your unbelievably rude and abusive way of dealing with me and others such as Buz.

And contrary to your snide analysis of my motives, I do want to have this discussion, but I refuse to submit to this kind of treatment from you.

Discussion then moves to a more appropriate thread in the admin forum. This is AdminFaith in Message 1:

AdminFaith writes:

To show that I am very willing to continue this discussion, I am starting a new thread which AdminWounded so wisely suggested is needed.
Some of the discussion already underway can be brought over here or at least linked to. It starts at Message 169 and runs to Message 195.

Although I'm very willing to have this discussion, as I said on the other thread, I will only have it on the terms I gave in the above message 195:

You will apologize for your personal comments in posts #178, #191, and #193. You will rescind them, you will promise not to say such things again, and THEN we will have a discussion, and not otherwise. The problem is not me complaining about abusive treatment, Percy, it is the abusive treatment itself, in this case your unbelievably rude and abusive way of dealing with me and others such as Buz.

And contrary to your snide analysis of my motives, I do want to have this discussion, but I refuse to submit to this kind of treatment from you.

As soon as the above conditions are met by Percy, I will answer his question in his post 191, repeated in 193:

Percy writes:


Faith writes:

I read your message 144 about the requirements of science and simply thought how it defines creationism out of existence...

What part of my Message 144 "defines creationism out of existence"? Weren't you referring to the parts about science's focus on the natural world?

I responded like this in Message 6:

Admin writes:

Hi Faith,

Following is the text of my last message from the thread where we were off-topic, Message 193. Sorry you don't like the image in the mirror I'm holding up, but changing it is under your control, not mine. I predicted that you would get up on your high horse and ride off into the sunset, and that's just what you're doing. If you find it insulting to have your behavior accurately described then I suggest you stop behaving that way.

I'm sure that around your dinner table it's considered rude to mention Ole Aunt Faith's problems with self control, but this isn't your dinner table. This is EvC Forum, and I'm the lead moderator responsible for insuring, among other things, that EvC Forum remains a premier discussion site for issues related to the creation/evolution debate. I see your participation in the science forums as a significant obstacle to that goal. If you would like to discuss this then I suggest you pick up the thread of the discussion by addressing the question I raise at the end.

--Percy


Faith writes:

You will not talk to me like that if you want to have a discussion with me.


What you're doing is what you always do. As serious examination of your position becomes increasingly difficult to avoid, you sabotage discussion by finding an excuse to get up on your high horse and ride off in a huff, or your other favored alternative, disintegrating into an excoriation of all and sundry that brings discussion to a halt as the moderators have to take over. Go ahead, Faith, prove me wrong.

There's another choice available to you. You could contribute constructively to the discussion. This is a simple question, please help move the discussion forward by addressing it:

Faith writes:

I read your message 144 about the requirements of science and simply thought how it defines creationism out of existence...

What part of my Message 144 "defines creationism out of existence"? Weren't you referring to the parts about science's focus on the natural world?

--Percy

AdminFaith responds in Message 7:

AdminFaith writes:

So be it. Buh bye.
Oh and if you ever recognize your disgusting error, your message #6 is now to be added to the list of those to be apologized for.

I'm not holding my breath.

And that was that. I suspended her moderator and her normal accounts and made them inactive.

As far as Faith returning, I have no objection, but I will say I'll move rather quickly if the kinds of problems she tends to cause resurface.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by jar, posted 09-27-2007 11:53 AM Admin has not yet responded
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jar
Member
Posts: 30409
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 15 of 42 (424547)
09-27-2007 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by Admin
09-27-2007 11:41 AM


Re: The Return of Faith
As far as Faith returning, I have no objection, but I will say I'll move rather quickly if the kinds of problems she tends to cause resurface.

I hope that you will reconsider that.

I do not think it is possible for Faith or any other Biblical Creationist to behave other than as Faith behaves. The problem is that Biblical Christianity and Biblical Creationism cannot be defended or justified using reason, logic or reality. They can only resort to emotion and invective, that is all they have.

To deny them those few remaining methods of defense of their position, you create a situation where they cannot make their best defense of their arguments, or any defense as a matter of fact.


Aslan is not a Tame Lion
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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