Sequel Thread To Holistic Doctors, and medicine

And taking non-prescription drugs naively and on the advice of a naturopath or their lapdogs, the commercial naturopaths, is like walking into the forest to speak to wise woman who heard that beetle wings are an effective cure for TB.If you think the system is corrupt - making a different system with less checks and balances is not the solution to remove corruption. After all - naturos get to sell their products without needing to spend lots of money and time testing their product or conducting trials - they have less overheads so they get more profit. Surely then, corruption and confirmation bias is more likely - not less?

Exactly. Like when your pancreas is inflamed, and you think that Morphine is as effective as Kool Aid, and that Willow Bark is much better....

I did, I was assuming you knew that there were effective painkillers produced by the corrupt pharma industry - but you went and implied they were as effective as Kool Aid. That's why I mentioned the pancreas. I hope yours never gets inflamed - but if you start chewing willow bark, you will regret doing so very very quickly.Edited by Modulous, : No reason given.

Would you care to comment how holistic doctors, naturopaths etc etc have managed to overcome the winds of capitalism? All I have seen is that they simply don't spend the same levels of money on research and development as well as tests and trials so they can make profit without charging as much as the pharmaceutical industry. Would you be happier if the pharmaceutical industry lowered its prices and reduced its research and tests so that you end up with a doctor who prescribes medicine because it worked for his neighbour's aunt?

I've not seen any different, they are the same molecule. I've seen something similar, and I think this is a criticism primarily at Vitamin E (Tocopherol). My chemistry is not strong enough to completely follow the argument, but I can say that Vitamin E comes in 8 naturally occurring flavours. If you were to buy it, wiki advises you would get either

• Fully synthetic vitamin E, "d, l-alpha-tocopherol", the most inexpensive, most commonly sold supplement form usually as the acetate ester;
• Semi-synthetic "natural source" vitamin E esters, the "natural source" forms used in tablets and multiple vitamins; highly fractionated natural d-alpha tocopherol
• Less fractionated "natural mixed tocopherols" and high gamma-tocopherol fraction supplements
  

I'm not sure if similar things should be mentioned with regard to the other vitamins, but I'm almost certain that it doesn't come into the equation with Vitamin C.I imagine that their interaction with light would differ, but that would be because their properties differ.

I object to many evils, but I cannot see any alternatives that are less evil. Still - perhaps the difference comes from the differences in our culture. Capitalism seems much bigger in the states. And before Big Pharma, mankind didn't look for aphrodisiacs? I'm afraid the hunt for aphrodisiacs is completely natural. The difference is that getting Viagra doesn't involve killing rhinos or bull elephants.Oh - and it works.Also - I'm fairly sure there is still a billion dollar industry in 'natural' viagras. Edited by Modulous, : No reason given.

As wiki amusingly points out:

quote:

---

1ml of a solution which has gone through a 30C dilution would have been diluted into a volume of water equal to that of a cube of 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 meters per side, or about 105 light years. Thus, homeopathic remedies of the standard dilutions contain, with overwhelming probability, only water.

---

The guy that pioneered Homeopathy believed some kind of healing spirit force was kept in the water, even if there no molecules of the active substance in it. The chances that your bottle of water has a single molecule of active substance is incredibly low - you'd do better to spend the money on lottery tickets instead so that you can quit your job and try to discover what's causing those darned headaches.

Welcome to the NHS. They would prefer to spend more time, but they don't have any of that due to the patientoctor ratio. This source suggests that it may now have increased to about 12 minutes. A less comprehensive study has this table:

Actual consultation length (real time) 	     8.96  4.36 min (1-25 min)
Perceived time                               8.37  4.42 min (1-32 min)

I thought you were all about treating the root causes, not the symptoms. Seems to me like you have root cause issues am I right? Out of interest, have you seen any studies about the effects of withdrawal of whatever you are taking?

So you suffered from a mental illness had terrible side effects from anti-depressants, you found that other people had also suffered terrible side effects from anti-depressants and you visit an ND, and this led you to distrusting vaccinations, and thus to not vaccinating your child?To me that sounds like: "I am allergic to penicillin and I almost died because of it, I know lots of people who are in a similar situation to me, I spoke to an ND and now I won't let my daughter be given anaesthetic for her operation".The known side effects of not getting vaccinated: Death
The known side effects of getting vaccinated? Bruising? Scars? Temporary sickness? Are any of the possible side effects worse than death? How much more likely are they? How much more likely are they, as the number of people who don't get vaccinated increases?Horrified? Damn straight I'm horrified. And I don't care if you don't want to be 'preached to'. I suspect you will write off any rational and reasoned argumentation as to the irresponsibility of your actions as 'preaching'.