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Author Topic:   Geologic Column
edge
Member (Idle past 1707 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 38 of 41 (443395)
12-24-2007 8:30 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Creationist
12-24-2007 5:01 PM


Re: Geologic Column
Well, it is what it is, and the connotation is clear.
It is to most of us. But you seem to remain confused. Why do you not address the dictionary definition I gave you?
Carbon 14 dating is used to calibrate tree ring dating and vice versa.
And you have an example of this?
When a rock is found in a certain geologic column layer, it is assumed to be a certain age. If radiometric dating is used on the rock to confirm it,...
Ah, there is your problem. Confirmation of a result is not necessarily circular reasoning, nor is it necessarily fallacious.
... if it agrees with the assumption, then it is used. If it doesn't, it is thrown out, ...
Perhaps you have an example of this?
...something went wrong with the procedure is assumed.
Possibly, maybe the original determination was wrong. I have had that happen, too. But basiccally, when there is discrepancy, we try to find the reason. I'm sure you've done the same thing with cross-word puzzles or something. Do you really think that is a fallacy?
Clear examples of circular reasoning.
Circularity, perhaps. Feedback, perhaps. But in no way have you give us an example of circular reasoning as a fallacy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Creationist, posted 12-24-2007 5:01 PM Creationist has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 39 of 41 (443396)
12-24-2007 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Creationist
12-24-2007 5:01 PM


Re: Geologic Column
Carbon 14 dating is used to calibrate tree ring dating and vice versa.
Actually, this is not true. Tree ring data is used to calibrate C14 dating. Period. Full stop. Tree rings are calibrated simply by counting backwards.
Funny thing is, when the C14 measurement is taken for tree ring corresponding to 10,000 years ago, and the C14 measurement for the 10,000th varve in Lake Suigetsu is taken, and when the C14 measurement for the 10,000th layer in the sediment of the Carico basin is taken, they are all the same. Just as if the 10,000th tree ring, the 10,000th varve, and the 10,000th marine sediment (and the 10,000th layer in certain stalactites found in Bahaman caves, did I mention those?) all formed at the same time.
Now you've ignored this important point when I've brought them up before tonight, but I am curious as to why the amazing coincidence here, how tree rings, varves, and marine sediments (and layers in stalactites) all formed at exactly the same rate so as to give consistent C14 dates?

"The guilty one is not he who commits the sin, but the one who causes the darkness."
Clearly, he had his own strange way of judging things. I suspect that he acquired it from the Gospels. -- Victor Hugo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Creationist, posted 12-24-2007 5:01 PM Creationist has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by Creationist, posted 12-24-2007 8:48 PM Chiroptera has not replied

Creationist
Member (Idle past 5646 days)
Posts: 95
Joined: 10-19-2007


Message 40 of 41 (443401)
12-24-2007 8:48 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Chiroptera
12-24-2007 8:31 PM


Re: Geologic Column
Actually, this is not true. Tree ring data is used to calibrate C14 dating. Period. Full stop. Tree rings are calibrated simply by counting backwards.
I don't think so.
Are tree-ring chronologies reliable?
quote:
Because the ratio of 14C to 12C in the atmosphere varies over time, raw radiocarbon "dates" are calibrated to obtain actual calendar dates using dendrochronology. This process of calibration is an essential part of the radiocarbon dating method, and eliminates assumptions about historical atmospheric radiocarbon concentrations and the constancy of the decay rate of radiocarbon over time. (See How does the radiocarbon dating method work?) Dendrochronology thus provides an essential service to radiocarbon dating, the major method used to date archaeological remains, guaranteeing its accuracy throughout the period of interest to biblical chronology.
Hardly independent methods.
Funny thing is, when the C14 measurement is taken for tree ring corresponding to 10,000 years ago, and the C14 measurement for the 10,000th varve in Lake Suigetsu is taken, and when the C14 measurement for the 10,000th layer in the sediment of the Carico basin is taken, they are all the same. Just as if the 10,000th tree ring, the 10,000th varve, and the 10,000th marine sediment (and the 10,000th layer in certain stalactites found in Bahaman caves, did I mention those?) all formed at the same time.
Every single time? That is impressive. If it were only true.
Now you've ignored this important point when I've brought them up before tonight, but I am curious as to why the amazing coincidence here, how tree rings, varves, and marine sediments (and layers in stalactites) all formed at exactly the same rate so as to give consistent C14 dates?
Did I say I had a problem with the earth being 10000 years old? However, I do believe it is closer to 6000 years.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Chiroptera, posted 12-24-2007 8:31 PM Chiroptera has not replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 41 of 41 (443405)
12-24-2007 9:13 PM


Terminal topic drift - There's gotta be a better place for this discussion
Varves, tree rings, carbon dating etc. is getting pretty remote to the intended theme of this topic - Going to close it down.
If someone wishes to revive this topic in an on-topic fashion, please post a reopen request at the "Thread Reopen Requests" topic, link below.
Adminnemooseus

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