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Author Topic:   Would you give up your place in heaven...
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 71 of 113 (476358)
07-23-2008 9:02 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by cavediver
01-30-2008 6:25 AM


I don't want to say, "yes" because it would only be like what Peter said when he said he would die with Christ.
I HOPE that I would give up my place, ofcourse. The whole message is that Christ gave up his life, therefore the aim is to be like Him. Those hwo lay it down regain it, therefore Christ would not suffer me to perish in this scenario.
Let's say that these ten are some of the most selfless, moral, charitable people on earth - they just happened not to choose Jesus as their saviour. Perhaps they are atheists, hindus, devout muslims, whatever - they have all heard the Christian message and rejected it for one reason or another.
I don't know if you're trying to make the Gospel look unreasonable. What I do know is that works don't count according to the gospel, and if we show God our best, it qualifies as filthy rags to him. Like showing him tissue you have just wiped on your bum and saying; "Look what I done God".
Understanding of the bible in a deeper way will help here.
I can tell you right now it would be very easy to find more righteouss people than me, but TO OUR GOD, it's irrelevent - because, don't you see, - it's not our opinion that counts, it's God's opinion that counts, and logically - disagreeing with Him won't make him go away.
As for truly righteouss people - 100% holy, the scripture says; " The healed don't need a physician, the sick need a physician@.
I can only speak for myself, and I can tell you that having sinned and being a sinner in life, I need a physician. If you are truly righteouss, you can be confident on judgement day - but first we must understand that only God is good.
How can anyone have never done one wrong thing? And if God is without blemish - how can anything live in His sight if it is contaminated?
Unless we repent, we can't please God, according to the Gospel, as this begins his work in us.

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 Message 1 by cavediver, posted 01-30-2008 6:25 AM cavediver has not replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 72 of 113 (476360)
07-23-2008 9:07 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by Phat
07-07-2008 1:23 PM


Re: Theoretical Hypotheticals
Good point. Firstly - what is heaven?
Those who have Christ already have the Kingdom because it is within. How can someone desire to live in heaven if it is inherently foreign to them? Yet if they are perfectly righteouss - it couldn't be foreign to them, and they would know Christ.
This hypothetic can only be answered biblically, assuming biblical truth under Christian theology.
It is therefore hard to give an answer an atheist would understand in the way we understand it as believers.
Oh - an, hi phat!!
Edited by mike the wiz, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Phat, posted 07-07-2008 1:23 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by Phat, posted 07-23-2008 9:35 AM mike the wiz has replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 74 of 113 (476966)
07-29-2008 7:27 AM
Reply to: Message 73 by Phat
07-23-2008 9:35 AM


Re: Theoretical Hypotheticals
Phatzy writes:
It would be interesting, however, to see the resulting interaction between them and a God they didn't believe in.
It would indeed.
I think the problem is a contradiction in terms. The O.P. speaks of righteousness, but righteousness is defined by the bible, as that's where it comes from - and the bible says that no, not one is righteouss - all fall short of the glory of God.
For example, a very religious descent Budhist might be extremely moral - more so than you and I, --BUT-- the bible says that if they don't believe in Christ then they have sin - for God counts faith as righteousness.
So there is a contradiction in terms, because we can't as believers give up what God means by righteouss, for the sake of what humans consider righteouss.
(Sorry I take so long to respond, I only post at the library now).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by Phat, posted 07-23-2008 9:35 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by Phat, posted 08-01-2014 12:51 PM mike the wiz has not replied

  
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