Hello ICANT,
ICANT writes:
It tell us water gets in the mantle through subduction.
If it gets there by subduction it comes from the surface.
When did enough water get there to fill our oceans 5 times?
Let's consider that for a moment. Here's the geological account..
quote:
Initially molten, the outer layer of the planet Earth cooled to form a solid crust when water began accumulating in the atmosphere. The Moon formed soon afterwords, possibly as the result of a Mars-sized object with about 10% of the Earth's mass,[2] known as Theia, impacting the Earth in a glancing blow.[3] Some of this object's mass merged with the Earth and a portion was ejected into space, but enough material survived to form an orbiting moon.
Outgassing and volcanic activity produced the primordial atmosphere. Condensing water vapor, augmented by ice delivered by comets, produced the oceans.[4] As the surface continually reshaped itself, over hundreds of millions of years, continents formed and broke up. The continents migrated across the surface, occasionally combining to form a supercontinent. Roughly 750 Ma (million years ago) (ICS 2004), the earliest known supercontinent Rodinia, began to break apart. The continents later recombined to form Pannotia, 600—540 Ma (ICS 2004), then finally Pangaea, which broke apart 180 Ma (ICS 2004).[5] The present pattern of ice ages began about 40 Ma (ICS 2004), then intensified during the Pleistocene about 3 Ma (ICS 2004). The polar regions have since undergone repeated cycles of glaciation and thaw, repeating every 40,000—100,000 years. The last glacial period of the current ice age ended about 10,000 years ago.[6]
reference
No mention of a flooded earth. A gradual accumulation of water with moving continents continually transporting that water into the earth through subduction activity.
Now let's look at your model, or musings. Here we have fast plate tectonics after Noah's flood in the days of Peleg.
So the oceans after Noah's flood are already subsided. Then plate activity, so no water gets subducted since the waters of Noah already abated. It is your idea that does not answer how 5 ocean volumes get into the interior of the earth!
In addition to this flood of Noah you have a flood separating the initial long history of Genesis 1:1 from the rest of Genesis. But there is no subduction activity to transport that water beneath the ground. Only a model that allows for continual plate tectonic activity when the oceans formed can account for the water in the interior. Thanks. Your argument supports me not you!
I don't see where taking materials and creating something is anything special.
Well maybe you'd like to create a dog for me then. I'd prefer a new breed so that it may serve as a conversation starter. Thanks.
Special creation is the standard terminology to distinguish it from natural descriptions. It amounts to definitions and terminology accepted by most so communication can take place w/o talking past one another.
But as I see it, an evolutionary process makes us human and creation from scratch makes us androids or robots or machines.
Isn't it amazing how so many different creatures came on the scene at one time without any apparent common ancestor.
Doesen't that speak to instant creation rather that billions of changes over millions of years.
Actually a time of millions of years is 'explosive' compared with the billions that passed before. There was a development in single celled life forms that created oxygen as a waste product. It was chloroplasts. That change in the atmosphere allowed the evolution of the respiration cycle, 18 times more efficient than the previous method of creating energy, glycolysis. This extra energy availability allowed for the development of higher lifeforms. We still share that inefficient hardware BTW of glycolysis. Why if we are designed from scratch did that inefficient mechanism get thrown into the design as well?
Also, when posting to RAZD's thread on age correlations I mentioned that the Oklo reactors started 2 billion years ago. I thought about that and the coincidence of going back two billion years to get a 3% concentration of U-235 to U-238 to start a chain reaction and the oxygen becoming available in the waters through photosynthesis to move Uranium through rain and collect it in one spot seemed too great. So I did the calculations and it turns out that a 3% concentration was reached at 1.72 billion years ago. Going back to two billion years means the concentration exceeded 3%. So the reactor you see, was waiting on Uranium to become oxidized and transported via rain to get underway, not on the relative concentrations of the isotopes of Uranium which were already sufficient.
This proves the creation of oxygen in the atmosphere some 2 billion years ago as does the iron oxide bands found in the earth. If you understand evolution it predicts that changes would be sudden. It takes time for the gradual changing mutations to find something that is better and an improvement over what went before. When it finds something it quickly takes over and stasis is again observed while evolution searches for something better yet..
What's the problem?
Those volcanos were not always covered with water. When the became covered with water they did not cease to build the islands.
When the continents moved to their present position the shifting of the land masses caused land to rise in many places, why not the islands.
You ever wonder why the Hawaiian islands don't have any native land animals. Everything they have had to fly there, swim (float) or be carried there.
It was not part of the land mass that was divided therefore animals had not scattered out over it.
quote:
Hawaiian "Hot Spot":1
Over the past 70 million years, the combined processes of magma formation, volcano eruption and growth, and continued movement of the Pacific Plate over the stationary Hawaiian "hot-spot" have left a long trail of volcanoes across the Pacific Ocean floor. The Hawaiian Ridge-Emperor Seamounts chain extends some 6,000 kilometers from the "Big Island" of Hawaii to the Aleutian Trench off Alaska. The Hawaiian Islands themselves are a very small part of the chain and are the youngest islands in the immense, mostly submarine mountain chain composed of more than 80 volcanoes. The length of the Hawaiian Ridge segment alone, from the Big Island northwest to Midway Island, is about equal to the distance from Washington, D.C. to Denver, Colorado (2,600 kilometers). The amount of lava erupted to form the Hawaiian-Emperor chain is calculated to be at least 750,000 cubic kilometers-more than enough to blanket the entire State of California with a layer of lava roughly 1.5 kilometers thick.
reference1. Kious and Tilling, This Dynamic Earth: The Story of Plate Tectonics: USGS Online Publication and
ICANT writes:
shalamabobbi writes:
I don't think a one time sudden movement of the plates would correspond with the facts.
Does your thinking make it true or false?
My thinking is the result of facts like that for the formation of the chain of Islands above. A one time fast movement of the plates does not agree with the data.
ICANT writes:
shalamabobbi writes:
No record of evidence of a global flood exists. Lots of evidence for local floods however does.
But that is exactly what you would expect to find if the land mass was divided after the flood.
No. Except you said Noah's flood was not very deep and did not participate in the creation of the geologic column or of fossils.
So fossil beds that correspond to pangea have no method of formation by your model/musings.
ICANT writes:
I have no problem with the sun and moon being made (`asah) on the fourth day.
Because they were created (bara') in Genesis 1:1.
In Genesis 1:16 God had to do some work to make the sun and mood visible as the light was not reaching the earth.
Well if your previous interpretation of scripture was not a stretch this certainly is.
Genesis 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of heaven.
You need to modify your previous cut and paste job of genesis to add these scriptures to what really took place in Genesis 1:1..
So what is the problem since the sun and moon was there a long time before Genesis 1:2?
That is not what the text says? Hint: read Granny Magda's signature line again..
ICANT writes:
shalamabobbi writes:
Any geologic records that show this yearly seasonal activity contradict your model.
Yea the Hemlock trees in Alaska have a real hard time dealing with the 6 months of light and 6 months of darkness.
Bring their seedlings south and they grow at the same rate per year, almost like they were running on a self contained program.
Six months of light followed by six month's of dark is a yearly seasonal environment. What you proposed was continual light bath 24/7 which would not show up as seasons in the varve records or ice core samples.
And now that you say the sun moon and stars existed prior to their mentioned creation in Genesis 1:16,17 and really occurred in Genesis 1:1 Then your continual light bath and one long day hypothesis gets blown out of the water as well..
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