Speaking in tongues - gift from God or satan?

My experience with charismatic churches and Christian friends is that speaking in tongues is one of the gifts of the holy spirit and represents a "closer communion" with the holy spirit.I'm just now reading up on information from other Christians who say it's a sign of Satan, that the holy spirit's gifts didn't apply beyond the lifespans of the apostles, and that speaking in tongues or receiving visions, powers of healing, miracles, or indeed any messages from God, are in violation of Revalations which says God's Word cannot be added to.This is a pretty radical difference in interpretation between different bible-believing Christians. What do the Christians here think about this?------------------
o--greyline--o

Acts2:4 All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues[1] as the Spirit enabled them.
5Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven. 6When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard them speaking in his own language. 7Utterly amazed, they asked: "Are not all these men who are speaking Galileans? 8Then how is it that each of us hears them in his own native language? 9Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome 11(both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs--we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" 12Amazed and perplexed, they asked one another, "What does this mean?"
13Some, however, made fun of them and said, "They have had too much wine.[2] "I personally tend to believe that the gift of tongues is the Holy Spirit enabaling you to speak to someone in their own language, even though you have no idea how to speak their language. I have yet to find any reference to the babbling and moaning that goes on in some churches. The gifts of the Holy Spirit always have a purpose, I see no purpose to a bunch of people babbling incoherently in a church building.1Cor12:4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men.
7Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[1] and to still another the interpretation of tongues.[2] 11All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.So the gift of tongues is only 1 of the gifts of the spirit, I personally don't understand why it gets so much attention. Verse 7 also mentions that the gifts of the Spirit are given for the common good. What good is babbling in church? Other than to appear "super spiritual", which is pride, which is sin. Doesn't seem like the fruits of this line up with the fruits of the spirit. So I am at this point quite leary of what is commonly called speaking in tongues. However if speaking in tongues is defined as "the Holy Spirit enabaling you to speak to someone in their own language, even though you have no idea how to speak their language", then I believe this is a legitimate gift of the Spirit.As to the belief that speaking in tongues is from the devil, well this is why we are to test the spirits. Satan is not a powerless being by any stretch of the imagination, and from the begining of Genesis has been a deciever. Satan can mimick spiritual gifts in order to lead us astray and tarnish our testimony to others. When I look back even to the plagues in Egypt, the pharoh's magicians were able to mimick the first few signs that Moses performed. So satan is not new at this deception. This is why Christians must be careful and test the spirits, to see the fruits.------------------
Saved by an incredible Grace.

Jimmy Swaggart use to utter some tongues in his TV preaching. I listened to him on occasion and it seemed that when he did this little tongue bit, he repeated the same thing each time he did it and with no interpretation by another person, as the Bible requires. Penticostal charasmatics use them the most and it seems they are the ones who get involved with most of the public scandals.On the other hand, Paul said, "forbid not the speaking of tongues," so if the gift is exercised in a scriptural manner, it should not be a problem. I've never observed it done in a scriptural manner. One of the apostles, I believe also Paul admonished Christians to "seek the best gifts," and his warnings about the tendency of abusing the tongues gift implies it is not one of the better gifts to desire.

Jimmy Swaggart and many other Pentecostals also believe and teach that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is suppose to be evidenced by the speaking in tongues. This is total nonsense and not according to scripture. The apostle Paul says in I Corinthians 12:13, "For by one Spirit we are all baptized into one body." Thus all who are born of the spirit, i.e. born again,are baptized into the body of Christ as spirit-born Christians. This salvation experience of being spiritually born is the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

I've also heard that speaking in tongues is evidence of baptism by the Holy Spirit, but I haven't heard anyone saying it's requisite evidence, ie. that all those baptised in the Holy Spirit will speak in tongues.The "babbling" tongues mentioned has been analysed by linguists who found that it didn't resemble a true language - it was just a small number of vowels and consonants repeated endlessly, with each congregation tending to have similar-sounding babble (but different from other congregations).Does anyone know of any instances (outside the bible) where people spoke in real languages that they had never learned?------------------
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No, but I heard of an instance where a Pentecostal preacher who had spent time in Egypt and frequently "spoke in tongues" was found out by a Egyptian grad student who visited his church. He was reciting his Egyptian language lessons - "The pen of my aunt is on the table" sort of stuff. The student called him the Egyptian equivalent of a sorry MF and walked out.

I was raised in a Pentecostal church and witnessed all sorts of "miracles", including speaking in tongues, being slain in the spirit, professing, etc. I used to believe that they were real ... until I saw a professional hypnotist. You know, the kind that make people do all sorts of crazy things under hypnosis for the amusement of the crowd. Well anyways, one of the guys bits was that he made the hypnotized pretend that they were from Mars and that they could only speak Martian. It sounded uncannily like the speaking in tongues that I heard in church. In addition he had the subjects instantly fall down on command. Very similar to being slain in the spirit. After seeing this show I started to notice how the pastors would use the same techniques as the hypnotist during the lead-ups to the "gifts".This brings me to a question. Has anyone ever witnessed a real miracle? I'm not talking about your garden variety "I felt something" miracle but a bonefide changed water into wine, walking on water miracle.P.S. This is my first post so don't go too hard on me.

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This brings me to a question. Has anyone ever witnessed a real miracle? I'm not talking about your garden variety "I felt something" miracle but a bonefide changed water into wine, walking on water miracle.

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I haven't, but no doubt that's because I'm not "open" to them. My sister claimed she saw a woman, lame from birth, being healed: she said her shorter leg grew longer before her eyes.During my brief stint as a Christian in a charismatic church I was called to the front for some "healing" on a sore shoulder (God had told the speaker there was someone present with a sore shoulder, so I thought that might be me). I was still new to the whole thing and didn't know that falling backwards was the done thing - so I didn't fall. Felt no need to fall. Wondered why someone had stepped up behind beforehand (to catch me). Now I know why the healer looked puzzled afterwards.Needless to say, the shoulder pains remained.------------------
o--greyline--o

I believe the 'babbling' is correctly termed glossolalia. Talking in a proper language unknown to the speaker is termed xenoglossy.

It's a strange thing that to many Christians everything has to be put down to God or Satan."Praise God that I found a plastic bag right next to those bushes full of blackberries!""Satan made me trip over the cat and break my wrist"Etc.Whereas there is in fact a great deal of clear space between the two.IME tongues is a bit like that. I don't think what most people are doing with this is speaking in another language. I suspect it's a phenomenon with a perfectly rational psychological explanation. But if God is able to use it to deepen their experience of and faith in Him, what's to stop Him doing so? The Bread and Wine of the Eucharist are normal physical things, and yet they are used to communicate the very presence of God.I don't do it myself, although I'm perfectly capable. For me it would not be helpful, as it is associated for me with particular elements of Christianity that I have moved away from and wish to stay away from. But it's not so very different from silent meditation, use of icons, or any of the other non-logical means I use to commune with God.[This message has been edited by Karl, 08-13-2003][This message has been edited by Karl, 08-13-2003]

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But if God is able to use it to deepen their experience of and faith in Him, what's to stop Him doing so?

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Well, that's the whole point as I see it. *Is* he using it to deepen their experience of and faith in him? Because Christians seem to disagree on this. (Obviously I prefer to go with the rational psychological explanation!) Cats and berries are not unusual phenomena. Speaking in other languages is, which is why God/Satan gets credited/blamed.

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The Bread and Wine of the Eucharist are normal physical things, and yet they are used to communicate the very presence of God.

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Not sure how this analogy is relevant. Speaking in tongues is not a normal thing (ie. most people don't do it, and those who do do it tend to be in a slightly altered state of consciousness). And the phenomenon is not to communicate the presence of God - it is apparently communicating *with* God (or in fact the holy spirit).------------------
o--greyline--o

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But if God is able to use it to deepen their experience of and faith in Him, what's to stop Him doing so?
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Well, that's the whole point as I see it. *Is* he using it to deepen their experience of and faith in him? Because Christians seem to disagree on this. (Obviously I prefer to go with the rational psychological explanation!) Cats and berries are not unusual phenomena. Speaking in other languages is, which is why God/Satan gets credited/blamed.

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Yes, but it's seldom about speaking in other languages. Generally there's no interpretation - and I'm very sceptical when there is. I do remember at a church I attended many years ago a woman who would come out with a "message in tongues" at every service. It was always the same - I and another member of the congregation actually knew it syllable by syllable - and yet the interpretation was always different. But even with my scepticism I don't see there was anything evil about it. Hence my belief it was a human-derived phenomenon.As regards this personal non-interpreted use - you'd have to ask people who use it. I don't think it's about communicating doctrine, least of all the doctrine about whether glossolalia is a good thing or not

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The Bread and Wine of the Eucharist are normal physical things, and yet they are used to communicate the very presence of God.
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Not sure how this analogy is relevant. Speaking in tongues is not a normal thing (ie. most people don't do it, and those who do do it tend to be in a slightly altered state of consciousness). And the phenomenon is not to communicate the presence of God - it is apparently communicating *with* God (or in fact the holy spirit).

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Well, since the speaker doesn't know what he's saying, it's pretty useless as communication with God. I wonder if it has something to do with abandoning pure rationality and attempting to meet with a Presence that transcends rationality? Again, I don't do it, it never "worked" for me, so I don't know. Better ask a glossolalist.I bring in the Eucharist because my assertion is that glossolalia is a perfectly "ordinary" - in the sense of being non-supernatural in itself - like the physical elements of the Eucharist. I know what the Eucharist means to me and I am merely wondering whether a similar thing is going on in glossolalia.

The following study is apparently endorsed by the Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals. At least it appears on their website But it loads quicker and is easier to read, I think, at the address listed below.

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"This article seeks to demonstrate that a socio-linguistic approach to the understanding of the 'other tongues' of Acts 2 is more helpful than previously suggested approaches."
http://homepage.mac.com/...senthal/reformationink/rzacts.htm

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It's a heavy read but worth the trouble. I believe I now understand what happened that pentecost day.BTW. Doesn't this suggest that the "Christians" were still following the Law? Pentecost was a Jewish holy day prescribed sacred by Moses.db------------------
Doesn't anyone graduate Sunday School?

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Well, since the speaker doesn't know what he's saying, it's pretty useless as communication with God. I wonder if it has something to do with abandoning pure rationality and attempting to meet with a Presence that transcends rationality?

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Yes, this is exactly how it was described in the church I used to attend. It's direct communication between your soul and the Holy Spirit - your soul understands even if your mind doesn't.Interpretation is not necessary because it's not meant for the rest of the congregation. It's meant to "uplift" your own soul. I never heard a specific biblical explanation for it other than vague references to "a gift of the Holy Spirit".It would come as a huge shock to these people to discover that it's purely a psychological phenomenon and nothing to do with a direct line to God...------------------
o--greyline--o

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Well, since the speaker doesn't know what he's saying, it's pretty useless as communication with God. I wonder if it has something to do with abandoning pure rationality and attempting to meet with a Presence that transcends rationality?
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Yes, this is exactly how it was described in the church I used to attend. It's direct communication between your soul and the Holy Spirit - your soul understands even if your mind doesn't.

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I don't buy this distinction between mind and soul. There is only one "I" that I am conscious of, and if I speak in tongues, I don't understand what I'm saying. I've heard lots of this sort of thing from various churches, but it's pure unfounded conjecture.

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Interpretation is not necessary because it's not meant for the rest of the congregation. It's meant to "uplift" your own soul. I never heard a specific biblical explanation for it other than vague references to "a gift of the Holy Spirit".

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No, you won't. Ref: above "unfounded conjecture".

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It would come as a huge shock to these people to discover that it's purely a psychological phenomenon and nothing to do with a direct line to God...

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I'm sure it would. It also comes as a huge shock to the vast majority of Christians the world over who do not speak in tongues that their communication lines to God are not as good as those of those who do.