EvC Forum: Between A Rock & A Hard Place

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Topic: Between A Rock & A Hard Place

ICANT

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Message 15 of 67 (514791)
07-12-2009 9:54 PM

Reply to: Message 1 by Phat
07-11-2009 10:06 AM

Re-I don't know

Hi Phat,

Phat writes:

I don't even know what I believe anymore, except that I know that I DO believe that Jesus is alive, was and is Gods character and died for all of our collective sins and imperfections.

Phat you know what you believe.

You are just not willing to accept it.

Phat as Jesus told Nicodumus ye must be born again.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 1 by Phat, posted 07-11-2009 10:06 AM		Phat has seen this message but not replied

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ICANT

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Message 42 of 67 (514996)
07-14-2009 4:39 PM

Reply to: Message 33 by Peg
07-13-2009 9:55 PM

Re Hell

Hi Peg,

Peg writes:

So why are they teaching that hell is place of fiery torment where souls are burned with fire forever??? its not what the bible says. The churchs have not remained true to what the bible says...they have twisted the scriptures to preach their own dogma.

Peg they keep getting hell mixed up with their final resting place.

Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Verse 15 tells you who will be in the lake of fire.

God Bless,

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	Message 33 by Peg, posted 07-13-2009 9:55 PM		Peg has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 45 by Peg, posted 07-15-2009 8:39 AM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 43 of 67 (515000)
07-14-2009 4:48 PM

Reply to: Message 28 by Phat
07-13-2009 12:46 PM

Re: Synopsis

Hi Phat,

Phat writes:

How do you know what I do and do not accept?

Simple you have told me many times.

You may believe but you have never committed proven by your own testimony.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 28 by Phat, posted 07-13-2009 12:46 PM		Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 47 by Phat, posted 07-15-2009 10:25 AM		ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 48 of 67 (515080)
07-15-2009 10:54 AM

Reply to: Message 45 by Peg
07-15-2009 8:39 AM

Re: Hell

Hi Peg,

Peg writes:

so what does it mean that 'death' and 'hell' is cast into the lake of fire?

It just means that no matter how you or anyone else gets it mixed up there is a final place of separation.

The Lake of Fire is the final resting place of the devil and his angels and all those whose names are not written in the Lambs book of Life. A name gets written in that book when a person is born again.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is [the book] of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

There is no place left to hide.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

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	Message 45 by Peg, posted 07-15-2009 8:39 AM		Peg has not replied

ICANT

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Message 49 of 67 (515086)
07-15-2009 11:32 AM

Reply to: Message 47 by Phat
07-15-2009 10:25 AM

Re: Synopsis

Hi Phat,

Phat writes:

Because to me, your idea of commit means to no longer ask questions. You expect me to take a leap of faith and no longer question anything about Dogma or tradition.

Trust me, when I first got "saved" I never questioned anything. God has since prompted me that its OK to do so.

With all my wild beliefs I have put forth over my time here on EvC you should know by now that I question everything except the existence of God, what He says, and what He can and will do.

The things listed below I do not question because the Scripture says:
In Hebrews 11:6 "But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."

God created everything that there is. Genesis 1:1
God said He loved me.
God came to earth in the form of a man called Jesus and died on the cross so I could have eternal life.
God said He would save me if I trust Him to do so all I had to do was receive the free full pardon He offered.
I trusted God to save me and give me eternal life.
God said He would prepare a place for me and would come get me one day so I could be where He is for eternity.
I believe God did what He said He would do.

You are questioning everything except the existence of God and Jesus.

If you notice Heb. 11:6 does not give you an option of believing or not believing.

It says you "MUST BELIEVE" that "God IS"

It says you "MUST BELIEVE" that "God IS" a "REWARDER" of them that "diligently SEEK HIM"

Phat writes:

Trust me, when I first got "saved" I never questioned anything.

Maybe you should have questioned whether you had an emotion encounter or a real experience of accepting God's pardon.

I would suggest that you do that now.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 47 by Phat, posted 07-15-2009 10:25 AM		Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 50 by Phat, posted 07-16-2009 4:43 PM	ICANT has replied
	Message 54 by purpledawn, posted 07-17-2009 1:27 PM	ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 51 of 67 (515268)
07-16-2009 9:32 PM

Reply to: Message 50 by Phat
07-16-2009 4:43 PM

Re: Questions,Doubts, and Conclusions

Hi Phat,

Phat writes:

So I take it you never dare to question scripture. What makes you so sure it is inerrant?

What part of my list did you not understand?

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 50 by Phat, posted 07-16-2009 4:43 PM		Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 52 by Phat, posted 07-17-2009 10:28 AM	ICANT has replied
	Message 53 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-17-2009 12:31 PM	ICANT has replied

ICANT

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Message 55 of 67 (515435)
07-17-2009 9:32 PM

Reply to: Message 52 by Phat
07-17-2009 10:28 AM

Re: Questions,Doubts, and Conclusions

Hi Phat,

Phat writes:

Please clarify. I asked you what was so wrong with questioning scripture. First of all, how can we be so sure that scripture is inerrant?

Phat I gave a list of things I don't question. But nobody can even read them.

Here is the list again.

Now as far as the scriptures we have being inerrant not a chance there have been too many people involved in copying it. Just look at how many bibles that have been translated in the last 50 years.

I do believe that the original word of God was inerrant. Too bad we don't have it today.

When it comes to questioning I guess you have never read any of my posts concerning the Bible.

I start in Genesis 1:1 and immediately question the placing of Genesis 1:2 it should not follow Genesis 1:1.

Genesis 2:4 should follow Genesis 1:1 as it says:

These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,

Generations is nothing but a history, or account of.

That verse claims to be the history of Genesis 1:1.

It is not the history or account of the events that took place in the 7 days in Genesis 1:2 through Genesis 2:3.

So yes I question everything except those in my list.

A born again child of God can not and will not question those. A religious person, or someone who has repeated a prayer after someone might question them.

I even believe in a flat earth with 4 corners just look at my avatar. That is what it looked like in Genesis 1:9.

As you know I am a pastor and I even encourage my people to ask questions at anytime. It is allowed during any message but they learned not to ask a question after about 10 minutes until 12 because I will take as long as necessary to answer the question.

Phat I tell my people to not believe a word I say unless it is confirmed by the Bible and the Holy Spirit.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 52 by Phat, posted 07-17-2009 10:28 AM		Phat has seen this message but not replied

ICANT

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Posts: 6769

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Message 56 of 67 (515437)
07-17-2009 9:52 PM

Reply to: Message 53 by Hyroglyphx
07-17-2009 12:31 PM

Re: Questions,Doubts, and Conclusions

Hi Hyrog,

Hyroglyphx writes:

Faith alone, particularly blind faith, seems useless without something initially verifying or prompting one to believe in the first place.

Firstly I don't have any faith of my own blind or otherwise.

I heard the gospel. John 3:16 17, 18.

Something in my mind convinced me those words were true and I accepted them and received the free full pardon offered by God. At the same time He sent the Holy Spirit to seal and assure me that I had been accepted. He gave me all the faith I have ever needed at that moment.

Hyroglyphx writes:

This is all learned from an early age.

And from Godly parents.

My problem was that when I was 2 my mom and dad separated and my dad and grandmother raised me. At that time neither was saved. If fact both were saved after I had been saved several years.

In the fourty's there was not much to do on the farm for about 6 months out of the year. We had a battery radio that grandpa would listen to the news on. There was no TV, no phones, not even electricity.

I had a passion for reading but the problem was there was only one book in the house. It was an old KJV Bible so I read it and by the time I was nine I had read through it 2 times. So when I heard the preacher preach the words were familiar to me but the Holy Spirit made them much more.

I went home went to bed and went to sleep but sometime during the night I woke up. August 18, 1949 I made a decision to put my trust in God from that time until this He has provided everything I have ever needed.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 53 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-17-2009 12:31 PM		Hyroglyphx has not replied

ICANT

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Posts: 6769

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Message 57 of 67 (515438)
07-17-2009 10:02 PM

Reply to: Message 54 by purpledawn
07-17-2009 1:27 PM

Re: Who is It?

Hi Dawn,

Purpledawn writes:

You're saying that the unknown writer of the letter to the Hebrews tells us that we don't have an option to believe or not believe in God's existence. I disagree.

I believe the writter was Paul but that is neither here or there. The book of Hebrews was written to a specific group of born again believers. It was not written to everybody in general.

The verse I quoated that you requoted says it is impossible to please God.

So if you want to be born again and spend eternity with God.

quote:
It says you "MUST BELIEVE" that "God IS"

It says you "MUST BELIEVE" that "God IS" a "REWARDER" of them that "diligently SEEK HIM"

You don't have an option.

Purpledawn writes:

Religious teachers and writers do try to make believers feel they aren't allowed to question the doctrine presented.

My congregation can question anything I teach and my people do.

God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
	Message 54 by purpledawn, posted 07-17-2009 1:27 PM		purpledawn has replied

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	Message 58 by purpledawn, posted 07-18-2009 12:33 PM		ICANT has not replied

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