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Author Topic:   The End of Evolution By Means of Natural Selection
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 4 of 851 (551971)
03-25-2010 2:45 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Faith
03-25-2010 1:07 PM


The end of evolution (again)
To my mind this absolutely spells the end of evolution. Evolution itself defeats evolution.
To be replaced by what?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Faith, posted 03-25-2010 1:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 29 of 851 (552028)
03-26-2010 12:09 AM
Reply to: Message 27 by Capt Stormfield
03-25-2010 9:24 PM


Re: It's a Forest, Not Just One Tree.
Actually it is just one tree, not a forest.
The scientific evidence suggests a pattern of one tree (or bush), branching all the time, while the biblical concept of "kinds" requires a forest -- that is, each of the "kinds" is specially created and does not branch.
I suspect this is the root of this entire thread.
Once again I suspect we see the biblical view of creation trying to argue against the scientific evidence.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Capt Stormfield, posted 03-25-2010 9:24 PM Capt Stormfield has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 101 by Faith, posted 03-28-2010 6:39 AM Coyote has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 683 of 851 (558135)
04-29-2010 11:23 PM
Reply to: Message 682 by Faith
04-29-2010 11:05 PM


Re: hypothetical beneficial mutations
Any old mistake can produce disease or nothing much but a beneficial allele would be a real fluke. Not impossible but SO highly improbable the odds are way against it ever happening.
Nonsense. If your (biblically inspired) position were correct there would be no improvement of any kind through time; there would only be decline and degredation. (The Fall, you know.)
But neither the genetic nor the fossil record supports that position.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 682 by Faith, posted 04-29-2010 11:05 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 684 by Faith, posted 04-29-2010 11:28 PM Coyote has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 685 of 851 (558138)
04-29-2010 11:39 PM
Reply to: Message 684 by Faith
04-29-2010 11:28 PM


Re: hypothetical beneficial mutations
And what sort of "improvement" do you think there is?
There really isn't any improvement with time. There are new varieties, interesting new varieties, but improvement?
False. Examine the fossil record, supported by genetics, from the Paleocene to the present and tell me the primates have not improved. (Paleocene, yes that's millions of years. Sorry, that's what the evidence shows.)
The fossil record supports nothing but the awesome array of living things that thrived in the pre-Flood world.
False. The flood is a myth. Even the early creationist geologists, seeking to document the flood, gave up just about 200 years ago. Since then the evidence against the notion of a global flood some 4,350 years ago has become overwhelming. I have produced evidence disproving the flood in my own archaeological research. Want to hear about it?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 684 by Faith, posted 04-29-2010 11:28 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 686 by Faith, posted 04-29-2010 11:49 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 736 by IchiBan, posted 05-04-2010 1:03 AM Coyote has not replied
 Message 744 by IchiBan, posted 05-04-2010 5:29 PM Coyote has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 752 of 851 (559133)
05-06-2010 10:10 PM


Summary
Whenever creationists start talking about "no new information" or "no beneficial mutations" or "degradation of the genome" and the like you can assume that they are coming from a biblical belief in "the fall."
This religious belief has not been confirmed by empirical evidence, but that hasn't stopped creationists from scratching for any shred of evidence that might be twisted to support their belief. That the vast majority of empirical evidence argues against their position does not seem to make any difference.
Or, as a poster on another board repeatedly said, "Divine revelation is the highest form of knowledge."
That religious belief was the driving force behind Faith's arguments, and no manner of evidence was able to persuade her to the contrary, became more and more obvious as the thread went on.
Thus we summarize this thread.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 805 of 851 (576906)
08-26-2010 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 803 by barbara
08-26-2010 9:28 AM


New species
Science has not proven that any mutations over time will produce a new species...
The evidence indicates that new species are produced, and that mutations and natural selection play a large role in this process.
This is what biologists and geneticists have concluded. It appears that the primary opposition to this comes from believers in certain fundamentalist religions, and their beliefs are not supported by scientific evidence.
Unless you have some evidence I am not aware of?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 803 by barbara, posted 08-26-2010 9:28 AM barbara has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 830 of 851 (603614)
02-06-2011 12:11 AM
Reply to: Message 829 by bluescat48
02-06-2011 12:08 AM


Re: Where is the end, if there is no beginning?
bluescat48 writes:
... Secondly there is no such thing as devolution, evolution is not directional.
There is when you believe that everything was created some 6,000 years ago and that there was a "fall" from which everything is "devolving."
Of course there is nothing in biology or evolution anywhere resembling that but that doesn't stop the trve believers.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 829 by bluescat48, posted 02-06-2011 12:08 AM bluescat48 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 831 by bluescat48, posted 02-06-2011 12:19 AM Coyote has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2133 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 832 of 851 (603616)
02-06-2011 12:29 AM
Reply to: Message 831 by bluescat48
02-06-2011 12:19 AM


Re: Where is the end, if there is no beginning?
Biblical literalists.
They have no interest in science except to destroy those parts that contract their beliefs.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 831 by bluescat48, posted 02-06-2011 12:19 AM bluescat48 has not replied

  
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