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Author Topic:   dinosaur and human co-existence
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 151 of 271 (560030)
05-12-2010 6:16 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by Buzsaw
05-12-2010 11:01 AM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
No comment on blind assertions.
Blindness involves not seeing things. For example, you are so blinded by your belief in your nonsense that you are ignoring all the extinct reptiles that are not dinosaurs.
All extinct. All reptiles. None of them dinosaurs.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 152 by DC85, posted 05-12-2010 7:07 PM Dr Adequate has replied
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 153 of 271 (560036)
05-12-2010 7:19 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by DC85
05-12-2010 7:07 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
It may be more closely related to mammals than to modern reptiles, but it's still a reptile.
Either "reptiles" is a clade or it isn't. If it is, then mammals are reptiles too, and if it isn't (which it isn't) then that's a reptile by virtue of its anatomy. Which is why it's a pelycosaur, not a pelycotherium.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by DC85, posted 05-12-2010 7:07 PM DC85 has replied

Replies to this message:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 155 of 271 (560038)
05-12-2010 7:45 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by Dr Adequate
05-12-2010 6:16 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
Oh, and who could forget the ichthyosaurs? Apart from me, obviously.
Of course these, like the pelycosaurs, went extinct before the KT boundary, but in creationist fantasy they all drowned in the Flood ... despite ichthyosaurs being marine organisms, but hey, it doesn't have to make sense does it?
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 159 of 271 (560262)
05-14-2010 12:24 AM
Reply to: Message 157 by Buzsaw
05-13-2010 11:00 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
A tad shaped like this little guy. Brookesia peyrierasi chameleon on leaf
Yes, they are related. Just like everything else.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 197 of 271 (560564)
05-16-2010 1:48 AM
Reply to: Message 194 by Buzsaw
05-15-2010 11:58 PM


Re: FOUL BALL!
Hey, kiddo, I wasn't born 5 years ago, so stop treating me as if I was. Nice try at obfuscating my position, applying my flood catastrophic non-uniform position to ToE dating methodology, which assumes relative uniformity.
And yet your response relied on those dating methods being accurate to better than one part in a hundred.
The problem with some of you people is that whenever a creationist begins scoring points, you resort to backhanded tactics, such as this or demeaning personal attacks relative to information damaging to your arguments.
No-one knows what would happen if a creationist started scoring points. What you are witnessing is the jeering when, as usual, a creationist scores an own goal.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 198 of 271 (560565)
05-16-2010 1:59 AM
Reply to: Message 185 by Buzsaw
05-15-2010 6:04 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
Pray tell, what better evidence does the crater selective extinction hypothesis have?
The imaginary hypothesis that you've made up in your head has no evidence and no adherents.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 199 of 271 (560566)
05-16-2010 2:03 AM
Reply to: Message 188 by Buzsaw
05-15-2010 9:04 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
Suggested? It's an established fact that one type exclusively became extinct while the others thrived and survived.
No. It is absolutely certain that this is untrue.
And then you guys wonder why scientists mock you.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 188 by Buzsaw, posted 05-15-2010 9:04 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 204 by Buzsaw, posted 05-16-2010 9:27 AM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 215 of 271 (560688)
05-16-2010 11:55 PM
Reply to: Message 212 by Buzsaw
05-16-2010 10:54 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
For decades I've wondered what triggered the ww flood event.
Traditionally, the flood has been ascribed to the will of God.
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened.
It would be feasable that the way Jehovah effected the ww flood was this very meteor strike.
You would then have to attribute all the sedimentary rocks below the KT boundary to real processes and not the magic flood.
Ever since a child I have asked God for wisdom and understanding in all things.
And then people wonder why I'm an atheist.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 212 by Buzsaw, posted 05-16-2010 10:54 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 224 by Buzsaw, posted 05-17-2010 10:29 AM Dr Adequate has replied
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 216 of 271 (560689)
05-16-2010 11:59 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Buzsaw
05-16-2010 9:27 AM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
Please explain your blind assertion, Doc. Thanks.
We have the skeletons of many other extinct reptiles besides dinosaurs, and you know this damn well if you've bothered to read this thread. I've supplied you with photographs, for pete's sake.
It is you who are apparently blind to evidence which I have waved in front of your face. Somehow your religion has made you so disconnected from reality that you can't see plesiosaurs and mosasaurs and pterosaurs and ichthyosaurs and pelycosaurs even when you're looking straight at them.
Please explain why you are pretending that I was making a "blind assertion" and tell me whom you were hoping to deceive with such a risible falsehood.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 218 of 271 (560693)
05-17-2010 12:28 AM
Reply to: Message 209 by Buzsaw
05-16-2010 10:16 PM


Re: Fantastic Claims
So Hyro, things like the flood, ID (higher intelligence) having the ability to create and change things are no more fantastic, when you think about it objectively than things you people believe and claim to be factual.
A priori, creationist delusions are no more fantastic than scientific facts, just as a unicorn is not more fantastic than a giraffe.
The difference is that scientific discoveries are supported by evidence, whereas the fantasies of creationists are unsupported, and indeed contradicted, by the evidence.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 227 of 271 (560755)
05-17-2010 12:24 PM
Reply to: Message 224 by Buzsaw
05-17-2010 10:29 AM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
The Buzsaw thing has always applied science to the Biblical record. After all, God, being the source of the observable scientific laws does not violate his own laws.
So it is impossible for him to violate his own laws by turning water into wine or raising the dead or walking on water?
It is the Buzsaw Biblical Hypothesis that best accomodates 1 LoT, in that it eliminates the magical notion of your version of science that the universe and time being finite had a beginning, i.e. energy had a beginning.
Please do not lie to me about my own opinions.
The Buzsaw Biblical thing has a rational explanation for all of the design, order and complex things observed in the universe. We just don't observe complex order when things are left unmanaged except in flukey rare occasions. Things we observe around us in the real world deterioriate, run down and become disorderly as time passes. That's scientific.
This is not true, as we know by observation.
Now, Doc, you go on to fault fundies for looking for naturalistic causes while looking for magical explanations. That's not what I'm about or what I'm doing.
It's what you and your pals keep on doing.
You want to explain a real thing, such as the diversity of species.
Your explanation --- GOD DID IT BY MAGIC!
You want to explain an unreal thing, such as Noah's Flood.
Your explanation --- THERE WAS A METOR STRIKE.
God didn't simply say words to create things. He worked, using energy to do it. He didn't magically zap man into existence. He brought him forth from dirt, i.e. from the earth via work as does your science. Your science says the earth essentially created/designed itself, violating what we observe in real life around us. My Biblical science says it was planned and designed by energy that never had a beginning as per 1LoT.
Your statements about the first law of thermodynamics are not really coherent enough for me to comment on.
The most I can say is that you are suffering from delusions about the first law of thermodynamics.
If you will state more explicity how you would like to be stupidly, howlingly, ridiculously wrong about the first law of thermodynamics, then I shall mock you in greater detail. But so far all you have communicated to us is that you wish to be wrong about it in some way.
Could you actually have the cojones to be wrong about something in particular?
Only, Dr Adequate, if you do the inadequate thing of equating intelligent management of real processes to magic.
And of course I do not.
So, try again. Clearly I have made you angry, but I have not made you coherent.
I wish I could have made you coherent instead.
No Doc. You're an athiest because you have failed to ask the omnicient god, Jehovah the Biblical god, for wisdom and understanding in all things.
You are lying to me, about me.
I have of course tried. I have prayed and begged and wept for your imaginary god to tell me if he's real. That is one of the main reasons why I am no longer a Christian.
All I got was a strong impression that your imaginary friend is a lie.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 224 by Buzsaw, posted 05-17-2010 10:29 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 232 of 271 (560856)
05-17-2010 10:54 PM
Reply to: Message 229 by Buzsaw
05-17-2010 9:18 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
The flood hypothesis looks at the above evidence and attributes the warm and wet climate to a pre-flood planet and atmosphere as the vapor canopy which I've described.
How does it deal with the evidence for periods of glaciation and periods of desertification?
Let me guess ... cherry-picking? You ignore everything that you can't shoe-horn into your fantasy world? Am I right?
Heck I don't need to ask if I'm right, I can see from your posts that I'm right.
The flood hypothesis assumes a non-uniform catastrophic event.
Except that you're now trying to attribute your imaginary flood, not to magic, but to a meteor strike, which is of course an actual thing that really happens, and so is a uniformitarian hypothesis.
The implication of this is that the carbon and other element makeup of the planet and atmosphere previous to 4350 years ago would be unknown and likely much different than post flood.
No. Meteor strikes do not cause magical impossible events that magically make creationists right in some magical way that they are completely unable to explain.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 229 by Buzsaw, posted 05-17-2010 9:18 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 233 by Buzsaw, posted 05-17-2010 11:44 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 234 of 271 (560868)
05-17-2010 11:46 PM
Reply to: Message 233 by Buzsaw
05-17-2010 11:44 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
D A, the meteor strike, if happened just before the flood would have cooled the vapor canopy pre-flood atmosphere and condensed it causing the first rain as per the Biblical record. You have to factor in all of the ramifications of a pre-flood planet and atmosphere, including different dating data.
Show your working.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 238 of 271 (560882)
05-18-2010 12:32 AM
Reply to: Message 236 by Buzsaw
05-18-2010 12:01 AM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
Percy, throughout the years here at EvC, I've presented corroborating evidence such as fulfilled prophecy and other data which convinces me that the Biblical record is a reliable premise for my world view. I've shown why I believe the data could (I say could) accomodate the Genesis record. As I've contended, no secularist non-ID minded person will ever admit to any evidence that I've ever cited.
When your "evidence" consists of pretending that dinosaurs are the only extinct reptiles, then you are right, no sane person will ever "admit" that your garbage is true.
Ive presented another PoV based on the Biblical hypothesis ...
Don't kid yourself. The Bible may contain a lot of mistakes, but it doesn't contain your fantasies about extinct reptiles. That's something that you made up in your head.
Like the Arctic zebras. Remember that?
Obviously nobody here buys anthing I've said. I've aired all I have and am ready to move on to something else.
Good. Stop wasting your life talking nonsense to people who know that it's nonsense. Do something useful instead.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 236 by Buzsaw, posted 05-18-2010 12:01 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 275 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 250 of 271 (561502)
05-20-2010 11:51 PM
Reply to: Message 249 by ZenMonkey
05-20-2010 4:11 PM


Re: Reptiles and Dinosaurs
And guess what? No big die-off of coral, either 4350 years or 65 million years ago. Didn't happen. (Unless of course you want to again claim that all dating methods are meaningless, and the massive extinction of marine life in the Permian-Triassic extinction event 250 million years ago is the same thing as the K-T extinction event that happened 65 million years ago.
I'm pretty sure that a lot of coral species did go extinct in the KT event.
From WP:
Approximately 60% of late-Cretaceous Scleractinia coral genera failed to cross the K—T boundary into the Paleocene. Further analysis of the coral extinctions shows that approximately 98% of colonial species, ones that inhabit warm, shallow tropical waters, became extinct. The solitary corals, which generally do not form reefs and inhabit colder and deeper (below the photic zone) areas of the ocean were less impacted by the K—T boundary. Colonial coral species rely upon symbiosis with photosynthetic algae, which collapsed due to the events surrounding the K—T boundary.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by ZenMonkey, posted 05-20-2010 4:11 PM ZenMonkey has replied

Replies to this message:
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