Evil Muslim conspiracy...

I was able to look at thelinks, other than the "Missing Imam" the other is just called "imam" by who ever wrote the news article. But in the following sentence is refered to as simply a 'cleric'.The "missing imam" is a different story. Googling I found this:

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[Musa al-Sadr]... Aṣ-Ṣadr, who became known as Imm Ms

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Became known as Imam, not, given the title of Imam because it was thought he was an actual Imam of the House of the Prophet, like Khomeini.- Oni

No, Dr. A, that is not from the Shi'a doctrine. Here is where you got that from, and you were selective as to what you quoted, hopefully, unintentionally.Here is the right quote:

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Imamah (Shi'a doctrine)

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Immah is the Shia doctrine of religious, spiritual and political leadership of the Ummah. The Shīa believe that the A'immah ("Imams") are the true Caliphs or rightful successors of Muḥammad, and Twelver and Ismā‘īlī Shī‘ah, further that Imams are possessed of supernatural knowledge, authority, and infallibility (‘Iṣmah) as well as being part of the Ahl al-Bayt, the family of Muhammad. Both beliefs distinguish the Shī‘ah from Sunnis.

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What you quoted was the etymology of the word "imam."From the wiki link:

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Etymology

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The word imam denotes the one who stands or walks in front. He is the guide. It is commonly used to mean the person who 'guides' the course of prayer in the mosque; in many cases it means the head of a school. From the Shi'i point of view, this is merely a metaphorical usage of the word. Properly and strictly speaking, the term is applicable only to those members of the House of the Prophet (ahl al-bayt) designated as the infallible.

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The Shi'a doctrine that I quoted is clear, Imams are the true Caliphs and rightful successors of the Prophet, and applicable to only those members of the House of the Prophet.As it says, these different view points are what distinguishes Sunni from Shi'a.Further more - as I have repeatedly said and provided links for this - no other Iranian cleric has been given such a title of Imam, other than Khomeini. And other than him, you have only shown me a vague reference in an article and one other man who simply became known as Imam. Who then went missing. Source

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Khomeini was the first and only Iranian cleric to be addressed as "Imam", a title hitherto reserved in Iran for the twelve infallible leaders of the early Shi'a. He was also associated with the Mahdi or 12th Imam of Shia belief in a number of ways. One of his titles was Na'eb-e Imam (Deputy to the Twelfth Imam). His enemies were often attacked as taghut and mofsidin fi'l-arz (corrupters of the earth), religious terms used for enemies of the Twelfth Imam. Many of the officials of the overthrown Shah's government executed by Revolutionary Courts were convicted of "fighting against the Twelfth Imam". When a deputy in the majlis asked Khomeini if he was the 'promised Mahdi', Khomeini did not answer, "astutely" neither confirming nor denying the title

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Also, Iranian's believed he was the 12th Imam.

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Tears of joy were shed and huge quantities of sweets and fruits were consumed as millions of people jumped for joy, shouting 'I've seen the Imam in the moon.' The event was celebrated in thousands of mosques with mullahs reminding the faithful that a sure sign of the coming of the Mahdi was that the sun would rise in the West. Khomeini, representing the sun, was now in France and his face was shining in the moon like a sun. People were ready to swear on the Qur'an that they had seen Khomeini's face in the moon. Even the Tudeh Party [the party of "Scientific Socialism"] shared in the [enthusiasm]. Its paper Navid wrote: 'Our toiling masses, fighting against world-devouring imperialism headed by the blood-sucking United States, have seen the face of their beloved Imam and leader, Khomeini the Breaker of Idols, in the moon. A few pipsqueaks cannot deny what a whole nation has seen with its own eyes

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He didn't claim to be the Mahdi, millions of people believed he was.He didn't give himself the title of Imam, since that is a title in the Shi'a doctrine held for only for those members of the House of the Prophet. He was given that title because it was believed he was the Mahdi, the 12th Imam of the House of the Prophet.Given all this information, how do you see it now?- Oni

What you quoted was the etymology of the word Imam, Dr. A. I quoted the actual Shi'a doctrine that explained it is only in reference to the 12 Imams of the House of the Prophet.If they OFTEN name clerics Imam, then you should be able to find more proof than just a vague reference in an article and a guy who became known as imam. There would be, as you claim, thousands. Like for the Sunni's. But you have no other evidence to support the claim, no other clerics named imam. My position is that an Imam, for the Shi'a, as the Doctrine I quoted explains, is considered infallible. On that point, I am right. You quoting the etymology of the word imam doesn't trump the actual Shi'a doctrine which states that very thing.I don't care about devotion, my point has always been infallibility.- Oni

Another link I foud that supports my position: Source

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Imamah (Shi'a Ismaili doctrine)

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The Ismaili view on the Imamah differs from the Twelver Shi'a view, in particular because the Imam in Ismailism is the Noor of Allah. Ismailis believe that the Noor of Allah is present in the Imam, and that there is only a Zahiri (exoteric) difference between each one. Therefore Ali and every Imam are one in essence.

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Like other Shi'ites the Ismailis reserve the position of Imam for descendants of ʿAl ibn Ab Ṭlib, though they reserve a special status to Ali himself.

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Like other Shi'ites, they reserve the Imam position for only those descendants of Al ibn Ab Ṭlib ...not just any old dude.C'mon good Dr., you rarely ever loose one, you can admit this one. - Oni

Is this not what you quoted:

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Etymology

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The word imam denotes the one who stands or walks in front. He is the guide. It is commonly used to mean the person who 'guides' the course of prayer in the mosque; in many cases it means the head of a school. From the Shi'i point of view, this is merely a metaphorical usage of the word. Properly and strictly speaking, the term is applicable only to those members of the House of the Prophet (ahl al-bayt) designated as the infallible.

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From wiki...?It says etymology, so I just assumed it was the etymology. Why else then would it say etymology? This is crazy talk.My point was that Shi'a reserve the name Imam to those of the House of the Prophet, which the Shi'a doctrine confirms:

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Immah is the Shia doctrine of religious, spiritual and political leadership of the Ummah.

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Properly and strictly speaking, the term is applicable only to those members of the House of the Prophet (ahl al-bayt) designated as the infallible.

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Like other Shi'ites, the Ismailis reserve the position of Imam for descendants of ʿAl ibn Ab Ṭlib, though they reserve a special status to Ali himself.

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Which it seems the evidence favors my position.I also said that Imam's are considered infallible:

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further that Imams are possessed of supernatural knowledge, authority, and infallibility (‘Iṣmah) as well as being part of the Ahl al-Bayt, the family of Muhammad.

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And the evidence confirms that too.I also said Iranins have never given the title Imam to anyone before or after Khomeini, a title only reserved for the 12 Imam's:

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Khomeini was the first and only Iranian cleric to be addressed as "Imam", a title hitherto reserved in Iran for the twelve infallible leaders of the early Shi'a.

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And that too is confirmed.Other than those 3 points, I have stated nothing else. Where am I wrong? Not that I can't be, it just seems from the evidence that what I've argued for is supported.- Oni

And I have not!, even in the quote you provide, said that anyone HAS TO believe any of this crap.But the fact remains that, even if you don't believe the Pope is infallible, Catholic doctrine still says he is.Likewise, you don't have to believe that an Imam is infallible, but Shi'a doctrine still says they are.The Pope is infallible. Imam's in the Shi'a branch are considered infallible. My arguement has never been that anyone actually has to believe that they are, just that the doctrines of these specific religions say they are. And these are the only two current, active religions who have infallible authorites.Which again brings me back to my original point, the religion can promote violence as a resolution to problems, but that doesn't mean that the muslims themselves are violent because of it. As you say, and I agree, no one has to believe what the religion's leaders preach.Where am I mistaken in any of the above?- Oni

There is nothing in Catholic doctrine that says you are the Pope. One just gets selected (by whatever criteria a Pope is selected.) Then, his title comes with infallibility.Seems like the same method for an Imam in the Shi'a doctrine. They are waiting for the 12th one to show up, and, by whatever criteria is used, it will then be determined if you are the 12th Imam. Which, in the case of Khomeini, it was. Then, his title comes with infallibility.Not that anyone has to believe that crap though, that I agree with. Yes, well, Rahvin got my point just fine, back when I was still making that point. Then you jumped in and said Shi'a Imams aren't considered infallible, and here we are. You have since conceded that they are, so - Oni

"...in everything he says."You needed to finish that statement. Only when he is in his "chair" as you said. But that means when he is in the official "Pope" position.In other words, if he eats a burger and says: "This is the best burger ever," that is not an infallible statement. Source

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For a teaching by a pope or ecumenical council to be recognized as infallible, the teaching must make it clear that the Church is to consider it definitive and binding. There is not any specific phrasing required for this, but it is usually indicated by one or both of the following:

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a verbal formula indicating that this teaching is definitive (such as "We declare, decree and define..."), or

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an accompanying anathema stating that anyone who deliberately dissents is outside the Catholic Church.

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For example, in 1950, with Munificentissimus Deus, Pope Pius XII's infallible definition regarding the Assumption of Mary, there are attached these words:

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Hence if anyone, which God forbid, should dare willfully to deny or to call into doubt that which We have defined, let him know that he has fallen away completely from the divine and Catholic Faith.

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When he said you were ghey. - Oni

Ah ok, cool. Correction noted.But reading the ex cathedra, the church places the decision on the Pope as to when he decides to be infallible. The Pope's have only decided to be infallible about 0.00001% of the time.- Oni