News on Religion in Our Goverments

When I was a GI, these shows were often not voluntary--some general officer was usually involved, and by god there would be attendance. Usually there was a mix of carrot and stick--refuse to attend, and draw unpleasant duty; attend, and get the day off.Today there are complaints in military academies and units of pressure to attend religious services and "events."The evangelical right is strongly entrenched in our officer corps.

Thanks, fearandloathing...can I call you fear? When I decided to stop lurking, I briefly considered reading in full each thread I joined, but there's just too much.The posts you linked are interesting, though, and I'll read through the rest of this thread. Those religious military practices sound all too familiar--worse than during my long-ago service, but in the same vein.

The good news about the DOMA is that it is being challenged in the courts, and the Obama administration has declined to defend it.I served with many excellent gay soldiers. I'm happy such fine men and women will no longer have to hide.

As I understand it, the Defense Department has declared a zero tolerance policy for harassment of gay troops.If that policy can be enforced anywhere, it will be in the military.That said, harassment in general, quite aside from gay-baiting, is a major issue in the ranks. Like most tribes, all you have to be is different. In my day, for example, you didn't want to reveal high test scores, atheism, or political and moral reservations about military objectives.But I still welcome this progress. It's one step of many.

I'm of two minds.As a general miscreant, I like it, especially if I could visit a black Baptist church. The food is awesome, the music rocks, and the sisters are gorgeous. I do hate doing what I'm told, but I hate paying fines to the state or doing time even more.As a matter of Constitutional principle, of course, it will be (and should be) stopped.So, in conclusion, I'd accept the GOOJF card and complain about it later.That's the American way.

Oh, I agree completely.But you don't gain converts, or even good will, by frog-marching people to your church.So I'm amused at the picture I have in my mind of scofflaws showing up in church (to the discomfiture of the congregation, no doubt), happy to dodge the fine/time dilemma but ticked off by being told what to do (as we miscreants generally are), and possibly corrupting the good morals of the choir members they break bread with later at the fish fry or around the gospel bird.On principle, you're absolutely right; I'm just charmed at the notion of getting out of jail free and devilishly amused by the likely unintended consequences

Ouch...rather have a toothache? No way--toothaches are right there in your head and can't be ignored. They can make a strong man cry.Having been marched off to church as a kid, I long ago learned to keep them out of my head altogether. I used to make up different, seditious words to the hymns and wait to see how long it took for the folks next to me to notice and slide down the pew...I'd rather take the free out-of-jail card and seduce a church lady with my bad boy self.As a card-carrying atheist and left-of-most general anarchist, of course, I deplore the program.

quote:

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Rock of ages
Roll with me,
Let me rock
Eternally.

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I don't remember what I sang for the second round, but it had something to do with sex--what didn't in those days? Ah, sometimes being immature is just being not-old. I highly recommend it.Just don't be mean.

Exactly.I kept trying to figure out what the one unforgivable sin was, so I could do it.Never quite figured that one out, but I suspect I got it covered.