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Author Topic:   New catholic scandal
Parasomnium
Member
Posts: 2175
Joined: 07-15-2003


Message 1 of 75 (647165)
01-08-2012 9:33 AM


Has anyone seen this already? A Spanish cleric says it's OK for women who have had an abortion to be raped. Here is the link.

Go to your work, send an e-mail to all your colleagues in which you say that women who have had an abortion may be wantonly raped, and see what happens. My guess is that you'll be out of a job before the day is over. So why the perverted misogynist sociopath Javier Martinez, the archbigot of Granada, has not been sacked five minutes after he proclaimed his gross ideas to the world is anybody's guess. But if the catholic church is not prepared to take action against this hatemonger (and I think that's not going to happen any time soon), someone else has to do it. Is there an organisation that can start legal proceedings against Javier Martinez of Granada, or better still, against the catholic church as a whole? Not in order to abolish it completely - people who believe religious nonsense have to have a place where they can do so without bothering the rest of us - but in order to force it to get rid of its rotten apples. Perhaps for starters an international arrest warrant can be issued on the grounds of incitement of violence against women?


"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science." - Charles Darwin.

Replies to this message:
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 Message 34 by Cat Sci, posted 01-10-2012 11:06 AM Parasomnium has not yet responded

  
Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5143
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 2 of 75 (647167)
01-08-2012 9:40 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Parasomnium
01-08-2012 9:33 AM


I wish I read Portuguese.....
Yes, that dipshit needs to be arrested.
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Modulous
Member
Posts: 6429
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005
Member Rating: 1.3


(1)
Message 3 of 75 (647170)
01-08-2012 10:02 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Parasomnium
01-08-2012 9:33 AM


Just the other day I was wondering whether anyone could deserve rape, and of course my thoughts went to mass murderers and genocidal maniacs as possibilities. I never came to a certain conclusion on that matter, but it turns out that the Archbigot has also thought of this.

Not only can a person deserve rape, but a single abortion is worse that masterminding and inciting the deaths of millions. Who'd have thought?

(From the linked article)

quote:
For the Archbishop Hitler's and Stalin's crimes (he forgot Franco's) were 'less dreadful than abortion'.

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Trixie
Member (Idle past 170 days)
Posts: 1011
From: Edinburgh
Joined: 01-03-2004


(2)
Message 4 of 75 (647175)
01-08-2012 10:16 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Parasomnium
01-08-2012 9:33 AM


Perhaps for starters an international arrest warrant can be issued on the grounds of incitement of violence against women?

That I would love to see. The comments are a disgrace and the RCC should not only be distancing itself from them and him, it should be condemning them and him and apologising to women all over the world.

What an utter, utter fuckwit!


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Jon
Member
Posts: 4117
From: Minnesota, U.S.A.
Joined: 12-29-2005
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 5 of 75 (647247)
01-08-2012 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Coragyps
01-08-2012 9:40 AM


Yes, that dipshit needs to be arrested.

Why?


Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Buzsaw
Member (Idle past 396 days)
Posts: 9158
From: new york usa
Joined: 03-14-2003


Message 6 of 75 (647253)
01-08-2012 9:10 PM


So What's New With The RCC?
What's been going on behind the purple curtains for centuries in the convent brothels, the confessional booths, etc is coming into the lights.

For eye openers read Behind The Purple Curtains, 1950 by Walter Montano and Fifty Years In The Church Of Rome by Father Chiniquy, etc.


BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Someone wisely said something ;ike, "Before fooling with a fool, make sure the fool is a fool." :)


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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5143
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 7 of 75 (647266)
01-08-2012 10:02 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Jon
01-08-2012 8:18 PM


As Para said - incitement to violence. Spain, like Texas, probably has no law against dumbassery.
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Jon
Member
Posts: 4117
From: Minnesota, U.S.A.
Joined: 12-29-2005
Member Rating: 1.2


(1)
Message 8 of 75 (647279)
01-08-2012 11:23 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Coragyps
01-08-2012 10:02 PM


A Cure Worse than the Disease?
Spain, like Texas, probably has no law against dumbassery.

As well they shouldn't.

But honestly, I'm more concerned about the views expressed claiming this man should be arrested than I am worried about anything this bishop actually said. I think arresting him for expressing his views is far more dangerous than anything he said.

Jon


Love your enemies!

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Replies to this message:
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frako
Member
Posts: 2402
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


(5)
Message 9 of 75 (647311)
01-09-2012 8:40 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by Jon
01-08-2012 11:23 PM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
As well they shouldn't.

But honestly, I'm more concerned about the views expressed claiming this man should be arrested than I am worried about anything this bishop actually said. I think arresting him for expressing his views is far more dangerous than anything he said.

Jon

If i rally a mob in front of your house saying stuff like you work with the devil and you should be gang raped. Then the mob would proceed in to your house and gang rape you but i would stay outside or go and have a cup of coffee some place else. Would i be responsible for you being raped and should i be punished?


Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand

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Jazzns
Member (Idle past 376 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


(1)
Message 10 of 75 (647338)
01-09-2012 10:27 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by frako
01-09-2012 8:40 AM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
If i rally a mob in front of your house...

Then the crime would be the rallying not related to what you said in particular that enabled you to do the rallying.

The guy disrespects the human race by his existence but he is not a criminal for what he said.

Moreover, how is this any worse than saying that people who don't believe in a particular sky daddy deserve to be burned in a lake of fire for all eternity? That someone's sovereign thoughts should allow them to be punished worse than anything we mere mortals can conceive?

I understand that the danger is that some people might really act on what this guys says but we can't say that speech is free unless there exist people who actually listen to you when you say nasty things.


BUT if objects for gratitude and admiration are our desire, do they not present themselves every hour to our eyes? Do we not see a fair creation prepared to receive us the instant we are born --a world furnished to our hands, that cost us nothing? Is it we that light up the sun; that pour down the rain; and fill the earth with abundance? Whether we sleep or wake, the vast machinery of the universe still goes on. Are these things, and the blessings they indicate in future, nothing to, us? Can our gross feelings be excited by no other subjects than tragedy and suicide? Or is the gloomy pride of man become so intolerable, that nothing can flatter it but a sacrifice of the Creator? --Thomas Paine

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Replies to this message:
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frako
Member
Posts: 2402
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


(1)
Message 11 of 75 (647341)
01-09-2012 10:44 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by Jazzns
01-09-2012 10:27 AM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
I understand that the danger is that some people might really act on what this guys says but we can't say that speech is free unless there exist people who actually listen to you when you say nasty things.

I agree speech should be fully free but if your speech causes someone to hurt another you should be responsible too.

So if someone acts on the priests ramblings and rapes a woman who aborted a child the guy who acted and the priest should be arrested, and punished. the guy who acted gets tried for rape, the priest gets tried on incitement of violence.

edit:
If no one acts on the priests ramblings my faith in humanity is partly restored, and the priest can be left alone to preach all the hate he wants.

Edited by frako, : No reason given.


Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand

This message is a reply to:
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Jazzns
Member (Idle past 376 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 12 of 75 (647354)
01-09-2012 11:54 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by frako
01-09-2012 10:44 AM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
So if someone acts on the priests ramblings and rapes a woman who aborted a child the guy who acted and the priest should be arrested, and punished. the guy who acted gets tried for rape, the priest gets tried on incitement of violence.

So if I say right now that I think certain Republican presidential candiates are economic terrorists and that I hope they drop dead and you go out and shoot one of them, I am responsible for inciting you to violence?


BUT if objects for gratitude and admiration are our desire, do they not present themselves every hour to our eyes? Do we not see a fair creation prepared to receive us the instant we are born --a world furnished to our hands, that cost us nothing? Is it we that light up the sun; that pour down the rain; and fill the earth with abundance? Whether we sleep or wake, the vast machinery of the universe still goes on. Are these things, and the blessings they indicate in future, nothing to, us? Can our gross feelings be excited by no other subjects than tragedy and suicide? Or is the gloomy pride of man become so intolerable, that nothing can flatter it but a sacrifice of the Creator? --Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5143
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 1.7


Message 13 of 75 (647363)
01-09-2012 12:23 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Jon
01-08-2012 11:23 PM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
I think I over-reacted a bit. I'll take back anything I said about arresting the man. Maybe he should be disciplined: the Pope could prohibit him from any contact with monaguillos for a couple of years.
This message is a reply to:
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Panda
Member (Idle past 177 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 14 of 75 (647373)
01-09-2012 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Jazzns
01-09-2012 11:54 AM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
Jazzns writes:

So if I say right now that I think certain Republican presidential candiates are economic terrorists and that I hope they drop dead and you go out and shoot one of them, I am responsible for inciting you to violence?

That would have to be decided in court.
But the answer is: "Yes, you could be responsible."

As a similar example:
A Guardian article on 2 lads that posted on facebook, encouraging riots in the UK.
They never attended a riot - "Neither of their Facebook posts resulted in a riot-related event."
All they did was post on Facebook.

But they still got 4 years in prison.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.


If I were you
And I wish that I were you
All the things I'd do
To make myself turn blue

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Replies to this message:
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Jazzns
Member (Idle past 376 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 15 of 75 (647383)
01-09-2012 1:55 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Panda
01-09-2012 12:54 PM


Re: A Cure Worse than the Disease?
But the answer is: "Yes, you could be responsible."

The point of the comparision was to elicit a further justification that the speech should be illegal. Can you justify it?

But they still got 4 years in prison.

Well, there are definitly some different sensibilities between the US and the UK regarding free speech. To any extent that someone should be imprisoned for something like that should be because they were orchestrating the riots BY their speech, not the speech itself.

Someone saying, "I am outraged! We should riot!" should be protected speech.


BUT if objects for gratitude and admiration are our desire, do they not present themselves every hour to our eyes? Do we not see a fair creation prepared to receive us the instant we are born --a world furnished to our hands, that cost us nothing? Is it we that light up the sun; that pour down the rain; and fill the earth with abundance? Whether we sleep or wake, the vast machinery of the universe still goes on. Are these things, and the blessings they indicate in future, nothing to, us? Can our gross feelings be excited by no other subjects than tragedy and suicide? Or is the gloomy pride of man become so intolerable, that nothing can flatter it but a sacrifice of the Creator? --Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 23 by Modulous, posted 01-09-2012 7:16 PM Jazzns has not yet responded

  
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