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Author | Topic: Did Dinosaurs live with man? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 10045 Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
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Marco Polo : Travels of Marco Polo book 2 "Leaving the city of Yachi, and traveling ten days in a westerly direction, you reach the province of Karazan, which is also the name of the chief city....Here are seen huge serpents, ten paces in length (about 30 feet), and ten spans (about 8 feet) girt of the body. At the fore part, near the head, they have two short legs, having three claws like those of a tiger, with eyes larger than a forepenny loaf (pane da quattro denari) and very glaring." The jaws are wide enough to swallow a man, the teeth are large and sharp, and their whole appearance is so formidable, that neither man, nor any kind of animal can approach them without terror. Others are met with of a smaller size, being eight, six, or 5 paces long; and the following method is used for taking them. In the day-time, by reason of great heat, they lurk in caverns, from whence, at night, they issue to seek their food, and whatever beast they meet with and can lay hold of, whether tiger, wolf, or any other, they devour;" Sounds like a crocodile to me. It would seem to me that you would describe a dinosaur by its height, not its length. The very fact that Polo describes its length strongly suggests a crocodile, or an animal unlike a dinosaur. Look at it from a different direction. Birds are modern dinosaurs. How would you describe the ostrich? By its length or by its height?
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Panda Member (Idle past 3735 days) Posts: 2688 From: UK Joined:
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SD writes:
So... ADMIRAL RICHARD B. BYRD'S DIARY (FEB - MAR.1947) (The Inner Earth : My Secret Diary)THE LAND BEYOND THE POLES - THE EXPLORATION FLIGHT OVER THE NORTH POLE. You believe Prince Charles is the anti-christ. You believe dinosaurs roamed the earth 500 years ago. You believe that the current Queen of England can trace her family history back to Thor. And you believe the Earth is hollow. What do your teachers think of your claims?Tradition and heritage are all dead people's baggage. Stop carrying it!
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9146 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3
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We must be being Poe'd.
No one is this freaking crazy.This is crazy even for Buz. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5949 Joined: Member Rating: 5.5 |
It's been decades since I read those stories! Edgar Rice Burroughs' fictional adventures of David Innes in the primordial world of eternal daylight on the inner surface of the hollow earth. It was in a later story that somebody else travelled there through a hole in the Arctic.
Since John Carter of Mars did so poorly in the box office, such that production of the sequel, The Gods of Mars, has been put on hold, do you think that may Pellucidar will be the next Burroughs series to be filmed? Trivia:In the 1930's, production had started on an animated version of Burroughs' first Martian novel, A Princess of Mars (which was really what the movie was supposed to be from), but it was halted. Had that not happened, then John Carter of Mars would have gone down in history as the first feature-length animated film, instead of Snow White and the Seven Dwarves. Well, hey, my fiction is a lot more interesting that yours!
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JonF Member (Idle past 190 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
Dating methods would apply to the stones themselves, not the engravings on the stones. Not necessarily. If there's pigment maybe it could be dates. It might even be possible to measure when the engraved portion of the stone was exposed. I don't know if they could be dated but I wouldn't say it's impossible. Edited by JonF, : No reason given.
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ringo Member (Idle past 434 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ScottyDouglas writes:
No it wouldn't. Crocodiles were contemporary wth dinosaurs and they're still around. If a herd of dinosaurs walked down Main Street today, evolutionists would be tickled pink. It wouldn't change the fact that evolution does occur or the theory of how it occurs. Did dinosaurs live amoungst men?If so then this would put a large hole in the evolutionary theory. Edited by ringo, : Fixed link.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5949 Joined: Member Rating: 5.5
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"We have been looking at the fossil record as a general test of the notion that life has evolved: to falsify that general idea, we would have to show that forms of life we considered more advanced appear earlier than the simpler forms." (Monkey Business, p.46, 1982)
Such nonsense. "advanced" vs "simpler"? That reveals such a gross misunderstanding of evolution and of the fossil record and what we would expect from the fossil record in the light of evolution. The "Ladder of Life" (depicted as an escalator in Jonathan Miller's brilliant cartoon book, Darwin for Beginners (also 1982, so by then we already knew better than your unnamed creationist simpleton)) is an old Lamarckian idea (or at least tied to Lamarckism) that evolution was a chain for gradation from the simplest types to the most complex. The Darwinian view that is held by evolution is that of a branching bush. So instead of seeing simple-to-complex, we would see transitions from an earlier form to a later form with the earlier form termed "primitive" because its modern characteristics are not yet fully developed. Your quote displays great ignorance, as do you by presenting it. BTW, I really do recommend to you Darwin for Beginners by Jonathan Miller and Borin van Loon -- http://www.amazon.com/...han-Miller/dp/0375714588/ref=sr_1_1 at amazon.com for the 2003 reprint. Entertaining and yet it will help you to finally start to learn something about evolution, a subject that you have demonstrated you are woefully ignorant of.
FIGURE 1. These are photos from the AD 2004 fossil dinosaur and human footprint excavation. About 100 pristine fossil human footprints with hundreds of dinosaur fossil human footprints have been excavated together since 1982 and witnessed by 100's of scientists, teachers and other volunteers. This ledge is about eight feet above the Paluxy River TX. in ancient Cretaceous limestone rock, formerly limy mud. This is one of many excavations since 1982.
After my initial study of "creation science" starting in 1981, I first started to engage in on-line discussion in the mid-1980's on CompuServe. We had one creationist there, Paul Ekdahl, who was near-legendary in that he never ever posted anything that he himself had written, but rather he would retype verbatim long passages from creationist books, such as one by ICR lawyer Wendell Bird. And his verbatim transcription of those books was so slavish that he even included references to footnotes, even though he never included the footnotes themselves. That showed us that he wasn't even applying any thought to what he was transcribing. The above four photos were taken at the excavation On the Cretaceous Rock ledges along the Paluxy River, five miles S.W. of Glen Rose Texas along Rt. 202. It is 2 miles S.W. of the bridge spanning the Paluxy River & the Creation Evidences Museum. The city of Glen Rose is 65 miles S.W. of Dallas - Ft. Worth Metro area on Rt. 67. The above photos were taken during the annual five day early July 2004 excavation; in recent years a team of four or five men prepare the chosen site every year generally by removing the top rock by back hoe before the volunteers arrive. In 1982 when the first discoveries were made the rocks were generally removed by pneumatic drills, crow-bars and car jacks. FIGURE 2. This 11 inch long fossil human footprint impression shown above was excavated on July 6, 1983 by Dr. Carl Baugh who then lived in Missouri. Hugh Miller and sons Kevin, Brian and Matt Miller along with Jeff Green drove from Columbus Ohio to participate from July 4 to July 6. Jeff is a nephew of Flavil Miller who in 1983 lived in Byesville OH and was the founder and president of the Creation Research Science Education Foundation that sponsored this expedition in 1983. This footprint is the third ichnite in a trail of five excavated from 1983 and 1988. It was the best of the five showing distinct toe tips, distinct heel prints, and aspect ratios characteristic of the human foot. Your post there, referring to figures that you did not even post, reminded me so much of Paul Ekdahl. Though he did finally post a couple message of his own, which were nothing be attempts to convert us. Such sad, pathetic creatures these creationists are. Also, the Paluxy tracks have been known for decades to be bogus. Not the dinosaur tracks themselves, which are real, but rather the so-called "man tracks". Even most creationists no longer try to use them, which shows how discredited they are. As a start, read through Glen Kuban's site, The Paluxy Dinosaur/"Man Track" Controversy. He has spent many years on the site doing his research. He is a good source for you to finally get the truth about those claims. That area has been well known for dinosaur tracks for the better part of the last century. In the 1930's, one of the local industries was to carve footprints and sell them to tourists. One such carving is one that was referred to by one of your links in the "giants" "discussion", the so-called Burdick Print, with the locals recognizing the carving technique of one George Adams from the 1930's. In his article, Kuban goes extensively through the carving's history and microscopic examination. Part of my introduction to "creation science" was the single one-hour PBS program, Creation vs Evolution: Battle in theClassroom (KPBS-TV, aired 7 July 1982 -- because cable on base went out until the last few minutes of the broadcast, I ordered the transcript) -- besides covering the Arkansas trial of 1981 and Ray Baird's disasterous "balanced-treatment" class in Livermore, Calif (1981), that resulted in some of his elementary-grade students obeying the creationist instructional materials and deciding to become atheists, this was the program where ICR's Duane Gish made his infamous and deliberately bogus BullFrog Protein claim. The program also interviewed a paleontologist who has worked the Paluxy riverbed for dinosaur footprints -- I would need to locate that transcript buried away in a box somewhere to get his name. He recounted how some creationists had found a "man print" and brought him over to verify it. When he saw it, he had to admit that that bean-shaped depression did look suggestive, but it was obviously nothing more than an erosional mark. Of course, the creationists were disappointed. But then a short time later he was on a field trip with some students, so he decided to show them one of those "man tracks" that they kept hearing the creationists crowing about. They got there and found that since he had last seen it, it had sprouted five human toes. Clearly, the local art of carving human footprints had not died out. Let's face it, Scotty, that part of Texas is long known for carving fake prints in order to swindle the rubes. And that tradition for swindling rubes is still alive and well, with you being part of the newest generation of rubes. Of course, it doesn't help that one group of rubes (the creationists) is in turn swindling other groups of rubes (new creationists). Not that all the creationist "man track" fakery there has been done by carving. There was a famous/infamous creationist film, Footprints in Stone, about the Paluxy tracks. In 1981, a review of the film reported this ("An Analysis of the Creationist Film, Footprints in Stone" by Laurie R. Godfrey, Creation/Evolution Journal, Fall 1981, Vol.2, No.4, pp 23-30):
quote:That review is a very good read, because it also gets into how actual footprints will often become distorted by the ground that they are made in, especially if it's marshy or muddy. One such case came up with some "man tracks" that turned out to be tridactyl (that means "three-toed"; from what I've seen of your posts so far, I know I cannot assume any knowledge on your part) dinosaur footprints that had been partially filled back in with mud, such that the three toes and their claws were obscured ... at first. But then after those prints had been exposed to the air and material in that print boundary had started to oxidize, the original outline of the tridactyl dinosaur print reappeared. And several other lines of evidence, including the stride lengths of the "man tracks", all show that they are not human. Yet again, you post nonsense "evidences" that are not only totally bogus, but we have all known them to be bogus for at least three decades! You have a lot of catching-up to do. When you visit Glen Kuban's site, you will find some links that examine "giant men" claims, such as Ed Babinski's research into a claim by Carl Baugh, based on a "photograph" that is an obvious drawing and not even a good one (an artist upon seeing it immediately remarked how all the light sources were completely wrong). The story is at Men Over Ten Feet Tall. The really interesting part of the story to me was how the creationists who stood to gain the most from Babinski's attempts to verify their claims were more than totally disinterested. As if they already knew that he would never find anything, because they already knew that their claims were completely bogus. Oh, and also on Glen Kuban's site is an article on that "human hand impression" you mentioned, Alleged Human Hand Print in Cretaceous Rock. Yet another carving, rube.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1427 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Hi ScottyDouglas
I''ve been to the Paluxy River, and I''ve put my foot inside a dinosaur footprint I found. I did not find any human footprints. Carl Baugh is no Dr - he is a fraud, and well documented as such. His purported human footprints are fakes. Look it up. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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ScottyDouglas Member (Idle past 4354 days) Posts: 79 Joined:
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Looking at it from one side it is!
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fearandloathing Member (Idle past 4167 days) Posts: 990 From: Burlington, NC, USA Joined:
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The world, Earth, is only flat when you look at a map.
A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves. ― Edward R. Murrow
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 306 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
I'm inclined to agree.
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anglagard Member (Idle past 859 days) Posts: 2339 From: Socorro, New Mexico USA Joined: |
Must agree with Theodoric, I think we are being Poe'd/trolled.
Flat earth? Dead giveaway.Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider. - Francis Bacon
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jar Member (Idle past 416 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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Remember, Poe's Law states that it is impossible to create a parody of Creationism that is anywhere as funny or silly as the real Creationism.
Nathan Poe writes: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is utterly impossible to parody a Creationist in such a way that someone won't mistake it for the genuine article." Scotty has even gotten some Cheers from Creationists for some of his silliest posts.Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Shield Member (Idle past 2884 days) Posts: 482 Joined: |
I don't like the Buz reference, but otherwise i agree.
I'm not participating in this thread, i'm just following it. Based on this thread and several others, i'd be really sad for the guy, if ScottyDouglas is a real person.. He is like Hovind, Gish, and Rense, all in one. Edited by rbp, : No reason given. Edited by rbp, : No reason given.
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anglagard Member (Idle past 859 days) Posts: 2339 From: Socorro, New Mexico USA Joined:
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Panda writes: You believe that the current Queen of England can trace her family history back to Thor. Guess the Queen of England and the wife and daughter are related. As I have mentioned before, the wife can trace her ancestry back to Rollo of Normandy through Robert Count of Mortain, rather than the rather more influential William the Conqueror, his brother. Ask the Mormons. Now if one backtracks Rollo's ancestry, it means Freyr, who is considered the founder of Swedish royalty (hence the connection). His dad (Njord)'s wife Skadi is the one who defeated Loki. This of course makes the wife and daughter direct descendents of Odin, aka the Allfather and blood ancestor of Thor. Me? I'm just some dirtbag with primarily impoverished Lowland Scot and Irish ancestry, guess I married above my station. All good fun and we all have a good laugh, but I have read even sillier, (even here) . It's great for a laugh.Read not to contradict and confute, not to believe and take for granted, not to find talk and discourse, but to weigh and consider. - Francis Bacon
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