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Author Topic:   "Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them
Rei
Member (Idle past 7012 days)
Posts: 1546
From: Iowa City, IA
Joined: 09-03-2003


Message 22 of 49 (67506)
11-18-2003 5:40 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Lizard Breath
11-18-2003 5:22 PM


Re: Yep, that's it,
quote:
That's the message of the left if you don't already recognise it. You know, what the President does on his own time is of no consequence to the job or message they espouse.
Ah, like spending all of his time fundraising, or taking near record amounts of vacation?
quote:
All the while I have to pay more for my kids (who behave in class) to be in sports, drama and other events because the SBH program needed the money more. And that new industrial arts facility and chemistry lab, forget it. We had to buy 2 special busses to transport the SBH'ers to and from school because they are unable to sit still for an entire bus route like the rest of the kids. But there's nothing wrong with kids throwing desks cause Rush does drugs.
I'll take it that you (like Rush) has never actually looked at the cost of dealing with behaviorally handicapped students, or the actual rate of lawsuits?
It's easy for people like Rush to pontificate when they don't do research.
quote:
How about another of Rush's views do you not think much of. Public decency? So when a kid shows up for school with a shirt that says ***k You on the front, they should be allowed to wear it as their freedom of speech expression. And if the school sends the student home because he refuses to turn the shirt inside out, you probably support sueing the school and bringing in the ACLU to raise a publicity stink. You should wear whatever you want reguardless of it's level of debauchery because Rush does drugs.
And if it was a shirt that in big letters proclaimed, "Jesus Died For Your Sins", your stance would be... ?
quote:
I don't think your beef is with Rush's message. I think your beef is with any message that goes against absolute freedom with no restraint.
Democrats are for absolute freedom with no restraint? Tell that to the NRA.
You do realize that Rush does almost no research, right? That he regularly repeats things that he has been corrected on several times? Here, let me give you a well referenced statistical primer about the Reagan years, for example, so that you can consult it whenever he makes his ludicrous claims again. Here's a list of corrections to him on the environment. Hmm, what other topics should I include? Well, I'll just give you a general correction page to his show - read through at least some of them, such as "The Way Things Aren't". Of course, my pages are all referenced. I doubt Rush has touched a scientific journal in his life apart from to skim for out of context quotes.
------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Lizard Breath, posted 11-18-2003 5:22 PM Lizard Breath has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Lizard Breath, posted 11-18-2003 6:27 PM Rei has replied

  
Rei
Member (Idle past 7012 days)
Posts: 1546
From: Iowa City, IA
Joined: 09-03-2003


Message 28 of 49 (67525)
11-18-2003 6:56 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Lizard Breath
11-18-2003 6:27 PM


Re: Yep, that's it,
quote:
Go ahead and tell us how much you know about the cost of SBH'ers and what little effect they have on school budgets.
Since you've neglected to fill in your location blank in your profile, I can only speak in general terms and not address your specific district. Let's pick some random school district whose budget we can see, and see how much of their money gets spent on SBH:
http://perrynet.stark.k12.oh.us/board/minutes/M12182001.htm
Total monthly bills for November approved by the Perry Local School Board: $2,895,187.96; their yearly cost for SBH: $186,120.00. SBH percentage of total costs: 0.6%. SBH students typically cost 1.5 to 2 times as much as normal students, so that's a savings of, at best, 0.3% if you were to cut it all.
They're hardly breaking the bank - or, to quote you, forcing you to "pay more for my kids (who behave in class) to be in sports, drama and other events". It's easy to rail against groups you don't like, but that doesn't solve your problems.
Yes, they cost more *per student*, but they're a tiny percentage of total costs. If you're saying that all students should receive the exact same monetary benefit, I don't think you'll like the results. Vocational student programs also cost more - should these be cut? Extracurricular activities cost more - should they be cut too?
quote:
I'm not going to equate "Jesus died for your sins" with "***k You" since I won't even type the whole phase out.
So, in short, you support free speech, but only when it's free speech that you agree with? That makes the term "free speech" almost oxymoronic.
------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."
[This message has been edited by Rei, 11-18-2003]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Lizard Breath, posted 11-18-2003 6:27 PM Lizard Breath has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 30 by Lizard Breath, posted 11-18-2003 8:15 PM Rei has replied

  
Rei
Member (Idle past 7012 days)
Posts: 1546
From: Iowa City, IA
Joined: 09-03-2003


Message 31 of 49 (67562)
11-18-2003 8:38 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by Lizard Breath
11-18-2003 8:15 PM


Re: Free Speech
quote:
I use a litmus test for the Jesus T-shirt vs. The ***K YOU one. I admit that my litmus test is no longer acceptable in today's society and the ***K YOU Shirt is a celebration of free speech while the Jesus one is an obtrusive attempt to force one's religion down someone else's throat and therefore totally inapproriate.
No. One is not better than the other. One is something *you* agree with, and one is something that *you* disagree with. But they're both speech. Free speech. It is hypocritical to preach "free speech" when it's something that you approve of, and then fully oppose it when it's something you disapprove of. That's not free speech - that's censorship. You need to apply things equally - even if it's going to be "equal censorship".
quote:
In your Perry School System do you actually have SBH services there or is that money used to compensate another district that already has an established SBH program and Perry busses their SBH kids to them?
Perry contracts with the Stark County Educational Service Center. Of course, it's mostly irrelevant, because most of the cost of dealing with students of any type is incremental.
If you can tell me where you live,I can see if I can track down your school district's budget. I can't make any guarantees, but I can try.
P.S.: You may find this interesting. You'll never see people like Jerry Falwell support the ACLU in preventing discrimination of non-Christians and non-Jews, but....
ACLU offers to support Rev. Falwell (in reference to Virginia laws about how much property a church can own) (together, they won the case).
Jewish Student Allowed to Wear Star of David Pendant (the school classified it as a gang symbol)
(want more?)
------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."
[This message has been edited by Rei, 11-18-2003]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by Lizard Breath, posted 11-18-2003 8:15 PM Lizard Breath has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by Lizard Breath, posted 11-18-2003 9:01 PM Rei has not replied

  
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