Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 89 (8876 total)
Current session began: 
Page Loaded: 12-11-2018 9:26 PM
73 online now:
DrJones*, kjsimons, Minnemooseus (Adminnemooseus) (3 members, 70 visitors)
Chatting now:  Chat room empty
Newest Member: Bill Holbert
Post Volume:
Total: 843,821 Year: 18,644/29,783 Month: 589/2,043 Week: 141/386 Day: 44/47 Hour: 0/0


EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Gun Control Again Summations Only
Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Prev1
...
67
8
910
...
346NextFF
Author Topic:   Gun Control Again
Faith
Member
Posts: 30168
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 106 of 5179 (684105)
12-15-2012 6:22 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by crashfrog
12-15-2012 10:27 AM


I'm not talking about "posting armed amateurs at a million schools" crash. Good grief. I'm not talking about "posting" anyone anywhere, I'm talking about the citizens of this country having and using and carrying the guns we're SUPPOSED to have, and it seems to me that these days we should be carrying them most of the time. Not I since I don't own one but those who do.

Also, the quotes I gave back there wherever talk about the necessity of training. Citizen gun owners would still be amateurs, but not quite as amateur as your phrase implies.


He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by crashfrog, posted 12-15-2012 10:27 AM crashfrog has not yet responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 30168
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 107 of 5179 (684106)
12-15-2012 6:25 PM
Reply to: Message 85 by Dr Adequate
12-15-2012 10:55 AM


You know, I bet even in the golden days of the Founding Fathers primary school teachers didn't take their muskets into class to defend against potential school shootings.

I'm sure you're right. They didn't need to. Though perhaps they did when the British were expected to invade. However, we may be coming to the point where it wouldn't be a bad idea for us. If just one in a hundred HONEST PEACELOVING TRAINED citizens carried a gun and knew how to use it, it could make a difference.

AbE. Yes, I think that after so many school shootings and mall shootings and so on it might be a good idea for at least a few teachers in every school to possess guns and the training to use them, and some shopkeepers and office personnel and people anywhere for that matter. With proper safety precautions and all that. Yes, I think that could act as a deterrent and as a defense.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by Dr Adequate, posted 12-15-2012 10:55 AM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 1689 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 108 of 5179 (684107)
12-15-2012 6:26 PM


It's obvious...
...Americans need more guns!

What could possibly go wrong.


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

Faith
Member
Posts: 30168
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 109 of 5179 (684108)
12-15-2012 6:31 PM
Reply to: Message 100 by shadow71
12-15-2012 4:44 PM


Re: Second Amendment
Using this logic, shouldn't all americans have the "right" to own and possess the type weapons the army possesses.
For example, tanks, rocket launchers, missles, fighter jets, nuclear weapons?
How else can we defend ourselves against the government army, navy, air force and coast guard?

No, I think the average citizen will have to make do with ordinary hand guns and rifles, and I wouldn't underestimate the deterrent and protective power of those.


He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 100 by shadow71, posted 12-15-2012 4:44 PM shadow71 has acknowledged this reply

  
hooah212002
Member
Posts: 3183
Joined: 08-12-2009


(2)
Message 110 of 5179 (684109)
12-15-2012 6:33 PM
Reply to: Message 81 by crashfrog
12-15-2012 10:13 AM


But look, they're just as safe today as they were yesterday. It's not like this is the first school shooting ever. It's not even like a school shooting is a statistically significant way to die. It's like being hit by a meteor.

Here's what I take from this comment: "look, we are allowed, (nay, have a right) to have guns so you are going to have to accept that a school full of children just might get shot up because hey, you can't stop me from having guns. Besides, who would have known that some crazy asshole had access to his mom's guns???"

Is that about right? Are we supposed to just accept that a random school might get shot up?

I sympathise with, and grieve for, the parents who lost children but it's still the case that the leading cause of death in children is traffic accidents.

.....aannnnd???? Guess what? We are doing what the fuck we can to lower those deaths. Or have car manufacturers done absolutely nothing to try and make their cars safer? Do we NOT pass more laws about traffic safety?

But fuck you, get your god damn hands off MY GUNS, right? I better have the easy access to fucking guns to kill people...oops, I mean "protect myself".

I just don't get that. The fact that it happened in Connecticut indicates, to me, that this is an incredibly rare event that's going to happen in some statistically-uneliminateable small number of cases, regardless of our legal gun control regime.

It tells me that America has a gun problem and no where is safe from guns. But we will both, obviously, see what we want.

Edited by hooah212002, : No reason given.

Edited by hooah212002, : No reason given.


"Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." -Dawkins

This message is a reply to:
 Message 81 by crashfrog, posted 12-15-2012 10:13 AM crashfrog has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 113 by Panda, posted 12-15-2012 7:09 PM hooah212002 has responded
 Message 129 by crashfrog, posted 12-16-2012 1:02 AM hooah212002 has acknowledged this reply

  
hooah212002
Member
Posts: 3183
Joined: 08-12-2009


Message 111 of 5179 (684110)
12-15-2012 6:35 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by crashfrog
12-15-2012 10:16 AM


Why are you talking about taxes?

"Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." -Dawkins

This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by crashfrog, posted 12-15-2012 10:16 AM crashfrog has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 187 by Theodoric, posted 12-16-2012 8:13 PM hooah212002 has acknowledged this reply

  
hooah212002
Member
Posts: 3183
Joined: 08-12-2009


(2)
Message 112 of 5179 (684111)
12-15-2012 6:44 PM


Certain liberals of EvC will rue the day that they make a creationist seem reasonable.

"Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." -Dawkins

Replies to this message:
 Message 116 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 7:36 PM hooah212002 has responded

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 1689 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


(2)
Message 113 of 5179 (684112)
12-15-2012 7:09 PM
Reply to: Message 110 by hooah212002
12-15-2012 6:33 PM


Hooah writes:

CF writes:

I sympathise with, and grieve for, the parents who lost children but it's still the case that the leading cause of death in children is traffic accidents

......aannnnd???? Guess what? We are doing what the fuck we can to lower those deaths. Or have car manufacturers done absolutely nothing to try and make their cars safer? Do we NOT pass more laws about traffic safety?

This does seem to me to be one of the most stupid arguments against gun control.

House fires kill fewer children than cars.
Drowning kills fewer children than cars.
Poisoning kills fewer children than cars.
Guns kill fewer children than cars.

Which cause of death, from that list, should not be actively and continuously reduced using any means possible?
Only guns, it seems.

Guns may be a symptom of a violent culture, but we treat symptoms as well as the disease.
In fact, we often can't cure the disease and instead we only treat the symptoms.
America's violent culture might never be cured, but there are definitely ways to mitigate the damage caused by it.


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

This message is a reply to:
 Message 110 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 6:33 PM hooah212002 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 114 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 7:14 PM Panda has responded

hooah212002
Member
Posts: 3183
Joined: 08-12-2009


Message 114 of 5179 (684113)
12-15-2012 7:14 PM
Reply to: Message 113 by Panda
12-15-2012 7:09 PM


Guns may be a symptom of a violent culture,

I deplore the idea that we are somehow a violent culture, as opposed to a violent nature. Guess what? There was plenty of fucking violence before vidya games and movies! Anyone care to remember the Roman fucking Colosseum? People act like 24 hour news programs or Grand Theft Auto V or even Call of Duty are the only reason people shoot each other up.

edit:
(my harsh language was not meant for you, Panda)

Edited by hooah212002, : No reason given.


"Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." -Dawkins

This message is a reply to:
 Message 113 by Panda, posted 12-15-2012 7:09 PM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by jar, posted 12-15-2012 7:34 PM hooah212002 has responded
 Message 124 by nwr, posted 12-15-2012 10:05 PM hooah212002 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 125 by Panda, posted 12-15-2012 11:13 PM hooah212002 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 164 by kofh2u, posted 12-16-2012 2:26 PM hooah212002 has acknowledged this reply

  
jar
Member
Posts: 30934
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.3


(1)
Message 115 of 5179 (684115)
12-15-2012 7:34 PM
Reply to: Message 114 by hooah212002
12-15-2012 7:14 PM


No, they are not the only cause of violence in the US, in fact most of those are only symptomatic of how totally fucked up the US is these days.

When I was young and growing up everyone I knew in the city, the suburbs, the country had guns. A family room or den without a gun rack or cabinet with ammo, rifles, shotguns and pistols seemed empty, like something was missing. A pickup without a gun rack with at least a "Dirty-Thirty" or shotgun and the windows down, door unlocked parked by the curb would have looked naked. A boy or girl at school without a knife would be laughable.

Well, since then the guns haven't changed much. Since then the knives haven't changed much. The people though have changed. The problem is not guns, not knives, it's people.


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 114 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 7:14 PM hooah212002 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 117 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 7:42 PM jar has responded
 Message 5045 by Phat, posted 10-03-2017 7:38 AM jar has not yet responded

Faith
Member
Posts: 30168
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 116 of 5179 (684116)
12-15-2012 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by hooah212002
12-15-2012 6:44 PM


Certain liberals of EvC will rue the day that they make a creationist seem reasonable.

This is really funny and SO telling. Anyone in good standing at EvC better not agree with ***a creationist*** better keep it to themselves if they do agree no matter how reasonable the creationist. It just can't happen at EvC, that's the RULE. So much for all those affirmations of objectivity and rationality.


He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 6:44 PM hooah212002 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 118 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 7:44 PM Faith has responded

  
hooah212002
Member
Posts: 3183
Joined: 08-12-2009


(2)
Message 117 of 5179 (684117)
12-15-2012 7:42 PM
Reply to: Message 115 by jar
12-15-2012 7:34 PM


I would love to find a way to see your response as something other than a "well, back in my day" comment, but I cannot. You see, "back in my day" comments are fucking worthless.

"Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." -Dawkins

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by jar, posted 12-15-2012 7:34 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 120 by jar, posted 12-15-2012 7:51 PM hooah212002 has responded

  
hooah212002
Member
Posts: 3183
Joined: 08-12-2009


Message 118 of 5179 (684118)
12-15-2012 7:44 PM
Reply to: Message 116 by Faith
12-15-2012 7:36 PM


This is really funny and SO telling.

The only thing telling I meant is that creationists are typically conservative and thus are gun nuts. Anything else drawn from my comment is wholly of your own imagination.

Edited by hooah212002, : No reason given.


"Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." -Dawkins

This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 7:36 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 119 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 7:50 PM hooah212002 has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 30168
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 119 of 5179 (684119)
12-15-2012 7:50 PM
Reply to: Message 118 by hooah212002
12-15-2012 7:44 PM


I'm not a GUN NUT. That's a pejorative used to poison the well against an opponent's argument.

I'm a defender of the Second Amendment.

Against the gunophobic liberals that have been brainwashed on this subject. (Yes, I'm aware of the irony. It was fun to say it)

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


He who surrenders the first page of his Bible surrenders all. --John William Burgon, Inspiration and Interpretation, Sermon II.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 118 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 7:44 PM hooah212002 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 122 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 8:31 PM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 131 by NoNukes, posted 12-16-2012 4:11 AM Faith has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 30934
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 120 of 5179 (684120)
12-15-2012 7:51 PM
Reply to: Message 117 by hooah212002
12-15-2012 7:42 PM


That is NMP
Your opinion is noted.

However what I posted is still fact.


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 7:42 PM hooah212002 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 121 by hooah212002, posted 12-15-2012 8:24 PM jar has responded

Prev1
...
67
8
910
...
346NextFF
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2015 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2018