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Author Topic:   Heat release from tectonic friction
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2128 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 39 of 102 (684131)
12-15-2012 9:34 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by NoNukes
12-15-2012 1:01 PM


Babbling
Having the continents in one place explains things like how the animals got home after the great flood and how humans scattered after the Tower of Babel was destroyed.
The global flood is placed by most biblical scholars at about 4,350 years ago.
The tower of babel is placed by most biblical scholars some hundreds of years later. Estimates vary widely.
Let's ignore common sense and demographics and place the tower about 4,000 years ago.
The Phoenicians were major seafarers by about 3,200 years ago. (Egyptians may have been seafaring a couple of hundred years earlier, but we'll ignore them for this calculation.)
This means you have about 800 years to get the continents from Pangea to roughly their present locations. That span is between 4,000 years ago and 3,200 years ago when the Phoenicians started sailing all over the place. Please adjust all tectonic heat calculations to reflect this shorter time period.
Science would suggest that this took more on the order of 200 million years. Anyone supporting the claim that this took place in some 800 years needs to explain the approximately 25,000x speedup and the equally outlandish sudden slowdown to modern rates.
And in all of this we're ignoring the pyramids of Egypt, built some 4,600-3,800 years ago. There does not seem to be any record of flood damage in those pyramids, let along disruption of Egyptian society about 4,350 years ago which a global flood would have caused. Neither is there a complete change in language in Egypt about 4,000 years ago.
The heat release from tectonic friction is just one of many factors that must be explained in a totally different manner in order for the creationist/young earth belief to be supported. Given the evidence to date, this will involve overturning pretty much all of science.
(Oh, and it will involve a considerable amount of evidence also.)

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by NoNukes, posted 12-15-2012 1:01 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 9:52 PM Coyote has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2128 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 41 of 102 (684133)
12-15-2012 10:00 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by Faith
12-15-2012 8:52 PM


Re: Nonsense and Science
Now you have radiometric dating, but since the whole idea was so irrationally established in the first place why should I trust radiometric dating? In principle it's understandable, but in reality who knows? It too can't be verified because you have no way to replicate the past, all you can do is assume your measurements apply.
You don't trust radiometric dating because it shows your beliefs are incorrect. You can come up with all the excuses and what-ifs you want, but unless you can come up with some solid scientific evidence you have nothing but belief based upon myth.
RAZD has a couple of nice treads on radiometric dating and correlations to which you could post your evidence. That's the place, and now's your big chance!
Show us how all of the dating methods used by science are incorrect and collect your multiple Nobel prizes; or be honest and admit you are acting from belief rather than scientific evidence.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 8:52 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 10:07 PM Coyote has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2128 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 43 of 102 (684136)
12-15-2012 10:52 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by Faith
12-15-2012 10:07 PM


Re: Nonsense and Science
It should be the other way around. You should be insisting that your "scientific evidence" conform to the Bible because the Bible IS God's word.
So you believe. Now all you need is evidence to show that that is the case. But evidence is the one thing you don't have, otherwise you, or another creationist, would have presented it by now. Rather what we get from you folks is faith and belief.
Radiometric dating cannot show that the Bible is incorrect; the Bible shows that radiometric dating is incorrect.
That is not the case. The only way you could claim that is if you a priori discount all evidence to the contrary and place your head firmly in the sand.
I just can't understand you folks. Doesn't evidence mean anything to you or your co-believers? You remind me of Cnut the Great, commanding the tides. Didn't do him any good; reality prevailed in spite of his commands and protestations.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 10:07 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by NoNukes, posted 12-15-2012 11:13 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 45 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 11:58 PM Coyote has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2128 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(2)
Message 46 of 102 (684147)
12-16-2012 1:27 AM
Reply to: Message 40 by Faith
12-15-2012 9:52 PM


Re: Babbling
You SEEM to be explaining why the continents have to be at their present locations in 800 years but it makes no sense. You put the tower of Babel at 4000 years ago then you say the Phoenicians were sailing some 800 years later, but none of that means the continents had to have moved to their present locations in the interim that I can see.
What does tectonic movement have to do with the tower of babel anyway?
That is based on your statement, a few posts above, to the effect that:
quote:
Having the continents in one place explains things like how the animals got home after the great flood and how humans scattered after the Tower of Babel was destroyed.
This implies that the continents were all together at the time of the tower, which I am placing at about 4,000 years ago.
I understand it to have started either during or shortly after the Flood. That's 4300 years ago.
Not unless Noah and kin managed to produce enough people to reconstitute a civilization capable of supporting themselves and doing massive engineering projects in just 50 years. I gave them the benefit of the doubt, at 350 years. Even that's not possible.
That's 1100 years until the Phoenicians started sailing according to your timetable. The continents would have separated quite a distance by then though not to the present location. Why do you assume it would have to be that far?
From 4,000 years ago to 3,200 years ago you are saying that the continents spread enough that a previously landlocked area formed the Mediterranean sea AND the people adjacent to that new sea learned seafaring? With the water level approaching that fast I'd have guessed they'd still be running for the hills!
ABE: I think I know the answer, it just came to me. You've always pictured the Phoenicians sailing around in the world just as it is today, but the ocean distances could very well have been much less between the destinations of the Phoenicians than they are today.
You still have to do all the tectonic movements in a scant 800 years. People don't develop seafaring cultures until they have a sea to play on. You have the continents together about 4,000 years ago and the oceans and seas by 3,200 years ago. In that time the continents had to have assumed their approximate modern positions. That's just not feasible.
You started out on this thread saying it could be done in several thousand years, and that was shown to be impossible. Now you're trying to defend the same events in a scant 800 or so years.
Really, there is only so much nonsense I can believe all at once, and you have far exceeded that limit. Don't you have any connection to reality at all?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by Faith, posted 12-15-2012 9:52 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 47 by Faith, posted 12-16-2012 2:00 AM Coyote has not replied
 Message 48 by Faith, posted 12-16-2012 2:25 AM Coyote has not replied
 Message 51 by NoNukes, posted 12-16-2012 1:04 PM Coyote has seen this message but not replied

  
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