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Author Topic:   Probability of the existence of God
Phat
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Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4 of 219 (464240)
04-24-2008 9:06 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Wumpini
04-23-2008 8:20 AM


No Gray area here
Just using my basic horse sense, I would imagine that if probability could be assigned in this area it would be a simple 50/50.
Either matter/energy was and is an uncaused first cause
or
God (as Creator) is the uncaused first cause.
Critics may assert that there is no way to prove God in any past, present, or future form...thus the probability is zero. (Remember that this is a Faith topic, though) Thus...I stick with roughly 50/50.

"All that we call human history--money, poverty, ambition, war, prostitution, classes, empires, slavery--[is] the long terrible story of man trying to find something other than God which will make him happy."--C.S.Lewis
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“The world has achieved brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.”--General Omar Bradley
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"The free man owns himself. He can damage himself with either eating or drinking; he can ruin himself with gambling. If he does he is certainly a damn fool, and he might possibly be a damned soul; but if he may not, he is not a free man any more than a dog." -GK Chesterson

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 209 of 219 (721450)
03-07-2014 10:15 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Rahvin
04-24-2008 1:42 PM


Re: Probability
Rahvin writes:
What is the probability of a fairy sitting on your shoulder? There is exactly as much evidence surrounding the fairy as there is for "god." If you accept that the probability of a fairy sitting on your shoulder approaches zero (not disprovable, but highly unlikely), then how can you rationally claim that "god" has a 50% chance of existing?
Conversely, do you honestly believe that every figment of anyone's imagination has a 50/50 chance of actually existing? After all, each figment either exists or does not exist.
Keyphrase: figment of anyones imagination. By definition,(as defined by believers) God is not a figment nor content of human imagination. We cant very well attempt to prove something that apriori is a figment of imagination. We must first assume...for the sake of argument(and in order to prove/disprove) that if God can even exist,then by definition God is not a product of human imagination.

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 210 of 219 (721451)
03-07-2014 10:18 AM
Reply to: Message 207 by onifre
10-07-2009 6:43 PM


I know....nothing.
Onifre writes:
What the "supernatural" actually is, has yet to be defined with a concept that we can all understand. Therefore no means to investigate it are available.
If we can't define it, and we can't investigated, then what exactly are you claiming there is probability for exactly?
"Is there a probability that God exists?" - Well, what exactly do you mean by God...?
Exactly. This is what I was trying to explain to Stile over in his topic.

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 211 of 219 (721452)
03-07-2014 10:23 AM
Reply to: Message 206 by Stile
10-06-2009 8:07 AM


Re: Current rational chances for God: 0.00%
Stile writes:
The only rational, and consistent position is to ignore all propositions for which there are no evidence.
In a sense, I guess we could say that you believe in evidence. By that I mean that you believe...nay we say you know that evidence is a rational grounds for belief.
There is a mental process that allows us to watch reruns over and over and ignore the ending so that we can enjoy the show. Suspension Of Disbelief.
Perhaps what you are suggesting to believers is that in order to embrace reality over fantasy and to be honest, they in essence need to practice Suspension Of Belief. Is that close?

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 212 of 219 (721454)
03-07-2014 10:34 AM
Reply to: Message 137 by Stile
05-12-2008 10:38 AM


Re: Evidence supports something, what is your something?
Stile,responding to Iano writes:
Your "excellent" example is the fact that your wife has had a great impact on your life.
What is this evidence for? What does this evidence suggest?
What if several witnesses approached the stand and declared that Ianos wife had also had a great impact on their lives?
We still have no evidence that Ianos wife exists, but we do know that something or someone is impacting lives. Iano claims that it is "his wife".
Stile,reasoning with Iano writes:
And everyone is asking you "what does this mean or even imply? How does this indicate anything?" Then you simply stare back with a blank face and declare yourself an equivalent.
What is your response? That you too have other things which arguably impact your life as much as Ianos---and that you don't need to meet or know his wife in order to enjoy a rich and fulfilling life? How is this not an equivalent?

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 217 of 219 (721519)
03-08-2014 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 213 by ringo
03-07-2014 11:13 AM


Facts, assertions, and lack of evidence
ringo writes:
God is, in fact, a product of the human imagination - which may or may not resemble some real entity.
I disagree. This fact is not established...only assumed for now...due to lack of evidence.
You and Stile! I tell ya...
This whole idea that humans define/frame reality is a hallmark of unbelievers thinking. Perhaps you are right in that believers are mildly delusional...I am no doubt adding data to that set of information...but the very fact that I am a believer shows that I am looking at this idea that we are discussing differently from you.
Now...this gets back to jars argument concerning god, God, and GOD. His take, if I recall correctly, was that IF GOD (Creator of all seen and unseen) exists, nothing that we humans do, say, believe, or doubt would have any bearing on that reality.
Thus...I would amend your statement.
God may be a product of the human imagination.
IF GOD exists, GOD would quite likely...in fact most certainly NOT be a product of the human imagination. Our idea of GOD would be.

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