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Author Topic:   Why is evolution so controversial?
Pressie
Member
Posts: 2103
From: Pretoria, SA
Joined: 06-18-2010


Message 151 of 969 (724163)
04-14-2014 6:04 AM
Reply to: Message 130 by Theodoric
04-12-2014 8:37 PM


Re: Why so hostile?
To me it seems as if he's is a troll. He claims to be from Namibia, but the only Medical School in Namibia is at the University of Namibia, started in 2011. They expect to have their first graduates in 2014, but the name G. Gaseb doesn't appear anywhere on their lists.
Apart from that, he didn't even attempt to answer basic questions about Namibia.
My guess is that he's some 'student' at one of the unaffiliated American fundamentalist Colleges who looked up the word Namibia on the net. Then he encountered the surname "Gaseb". One of them was involved as a defendant in a prominent court case. Then he pretended to be a Gaseb and then also pretended to be a medical student from Namibia.
The dishonesty displayed by those fundamentalist Biblical College students in the US know no bounds.
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by Theodoric, posted 04-12-2014 8:37 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 159 by Theodoric, posted 04-14-2014 9:44 AM Pressie has replied

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 3629 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 152 of 969 (724166)
04-14-2014 7:04 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Taq
04-10-2014 6:32 PM


quote:
Tell you what. Let's do a little comparison. You count the number of scientists who reject evolution, have a degree in the biological sciences, and whose first name is Steve (or a derivation thereof, such as Estaban or Stephanie). I will do the same for the number of scientists who do accept evolution as the best explanation for biodiveristy in biology
Like these guys you mean:
Stephen J. Anderson*****
Commercial Officer, U.S. Export Assistance Center, Baltimore, U.S. Department of Commerce
Ph.D., Political Science, Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Stephen Robert Anderson
Professor of Linguistics and Cognitive Science, Yale University
Ph.D., Linguistics, Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Steve Avons******
Reader in Psychology, University of Essex
Ph.D., Psychology, University of Stirling
Stephen Azevedo*
Deputy Division Leader, Electronics Engineering Technologies Division, Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
Ph.D., Electrical Engineering and Computing Science, University of California, Davis
Steve Beech******
Global Process Owner for Joining Technology, Rolls Royce PLC
Ph.D., Metallurgy, University of Manchester
Chartered Engineer; Fellow of the Institute of Materials, Minerals, and Mining........
Do linguists spend a lot of time learning Darwinian evolution? How about metallurgists?
What a piece of work you guys are.
I see the lying hasn't abated one bit here at the phony EvC site.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Taq, posted 04-10-2014 6:32 PM Taq has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by Pressie, posted 04-14-2014 7:20 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 154 by AZPaul3, posted 04-14-2014 8:07 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 155 by NoNukes, posted 04-14-2014 8:34 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 156 by Pressie, posted 04-14-2014 8:41 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 163 by ringo, posted 04-14-2014 11:45 AM Bolder-dash has not replied
 Message 171 by Taq, posted 04-14-2014 2:53 PM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
Pressie
Member
Posts: 2103
From: Pretoria, SA
Joined: 06-18-2010


Message 153 of 969 (724168)
04-14-2014 7:20 AM
Reply to: Message 152 by Bolder-dash
04-14-2014 7:04 AM


I can't see anyone you mentioned having any qualification in anything related to the relavant sciences. Life sciences.
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Bolder-dash, posted 04-14-2014 7:04 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8513
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 154 of 969 (724169)
04-14-2014 8:07 AM
Reply to: Message 152 by Bolder-dash
04-14-2014 7:04 AM


Smoke and mirrors
You count the number of scientists who reject evolution, have a degree in the biological sciences, and whose first name is Steve ...
Like these guys you mean:
Reading comprehension? The requirement is for "a degree in the biological sciences "
That means guys like this:
Stephen T. Abedon
Associate Professor of Microbiology, Ohio State University
Ph.D., Microbiology, University of Arizona
Stephen A. Adam****
Associate Professor, Department of Cell and Molecular Biology, Feinberg School of Medicine, Northwestern University
Steven Reid Adams******
Assistant Professor, Department of Biology, University of Central Arkansas
Steve Adolph******
Professor of Biology, Harvey Mudd College
Ph.D., Zoology, University of Washington
Stephen B. Aley
Professor of Biological Sciences, Associate Dean, University of Texas, El Paso
Ph.D., Biology, Rockefeller University
Stephen C. Alley*
Senior Scientist, Seattle Genetics, Inc.
Ph.D., Chemistry, University of Washington
Steven D. Allison******
Assistant Professor, Departments of Ecology & Evolutionary Biology and Earth System Science, University of California, Irvine
Ph.D., Biological Sciences, Stanford University
Stephen D. Anderson*******
Scientific Administrator/Editor, Pacific Northwest Diabetes Research Institute
Ph.D., Biological Sciences, University of Southern California
Steven C. Anderson******
Emeritus Professor of Biology, University of the Pacific
Ph.D., Biology, Stanford University
Stephen W. Arch
L. N. Ruben Professor of Biology, Reed College
Ph.D., Biology, University of Chicago
Steve Archer****
Professor of Rangeland and Forest Resources, University of Arizona
Ph.D., Rangeland Ecosystem Science, Colorado State University, Ft. Collins
Stevan J. Arnold
Professor of Zoology, Oregon State University
Ph.D., Zoology, University of Michigan
Stephen M. Arthur****
Research Biologist, Alaska Department of Fish and Game
Ph.D., Wildlife Biology, University of Maine
Stephen J. Aves******
Associate Professor of Molecular Biology, University of Exeter
Ph.D., Biochemistry, University of Bristol
Stephen D. Baluch*******
Trait Integration Breeder, Monsanto Company
Ph.D., Plant Breeding and Genetics, Purdue University
Steven W. Barger*
Associate Professor of Geriatrics, Anatomy & Neurobiology, and Internal Medicine University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences
Steven Barnes*******
Professor, Departments of Physiology & Biophysics and Ophthalmology & Visual Sciences, Dalhousie University
Ph.D., Neurobiology, University of California, Berkeley
Stephen John Barnett*
Research Scientist, South Australian Research and Development Institute
Ph.D., Microbial Ecology, University of Adelaide
Steven J. Baskauf*
Senior Lecturer, Biological Sciences, Vanderbilt University
Ph.D., Biology, Vanderbilt University
Steven G. Bassett*******
Associate Professor of Biology, Seton Hill University
Ph.D., Biomedical Science, Eastern Virginia Medical School/Old Dominion University
Steven Bates******
Lecturer in Molecular Microbiology, University of Exeter
Ph.D., Molecular Biology, University of Leicester
Steven J. Beaupre*******
Professor and Chair of Biological Sciences, University of Arkansas
Ph.D., Ecology and Evolution, University of Pennsylvania
Stephen M. Becker****
Postdoctoral Fellow, Virginia Commonwealth University; Visiting Assistant Professor, Mary Washington University
Ph.D., Immunology, Virginia Commonwealth University
Stephanie Bedhomme******
Post-doctoral Associate Researcher, Animal Evolutionary Ecology Group, Institute for Evolution and Biodiversity, University of Muenster
Ph.D., Evolutionary Biology, University of Montpellier
Steven R. Beissinger
Chair and Professor of Environmental Science, Policy, and Management, University of California, Berkeley
Ph.D., Natural Resource Ecology, University of Michigan
Do linguists spend a lot of time learning Darwinian evolution? How about metallurgists?
What a piece of work you guys are.
I see the ***** hasn't abated one bit here at the phony EvC site.
The NCSE list is for all scientists who support evolution. Even Linguists.
The challenge in this thread is for you to list scientists who have a "degree in the biological sciences" who do not support evolution.
I very much doubt you inadvertently missed this. You chose to ignore it.
The only "lying" going on here is yours. You can't meet the challenge so you blow smoke, obfuscate, misdirect, lie.
Real piece of work you are, Pebblebrain.
Edited by AZPaul3, : wanted to
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Bolder-dash, posted 04-14-2014 7:04 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 155 of 969 (724172)
04-14-2014 8:34 AM
Reply to: Message 152 by Bolder-dash
04-14-2014 7:04 AM


Do linguists spend a lot of time learning Darwinian evolution? How about metallurgists?
What a piece of work you guys are.
You post the nonsense list and then call others names, troll?
I see the ***** hasn't abated one bit here at the phony EvC site.
Same old Bolder-Dash; cannot post without spoiling for a fight. Well that mild remark will not earn you the suspension you crave. You are going to have to work harder. How about some mean comments about Percy's Aunt Bea?
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Bolder-dash, posted 04-14-2014 7:04 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
Pressie
Member
Posts: 2103
From: Pretoria, SA
Joined: 06-18-2010


Message 156 of 969 (724173)
04-14-2014 8:41 AM
Reply to: Message 152 by Bolder-dash
04-14-2014 7:04 AM


Bolder-dash, so you mean out of the 187 900 life-science scientists in the US in 2008, (with PhD's on the subject) , you could only name a few scientists with no related fields of expertise?
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 157 of 969 (724179)
04-14-2014 9:20 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by Tanypteryx
04-13-2014 9:04 PM


Re: Why Is Evolution So Uncontroversial?
I wish we could find a better example of something that would falsify evolution.
I agree. I think what Faith was trying to say is that we are unlikely to find a cow skeleton down there even if the earth were only 6000 years old and that we have deliberately picked something difficult to find.
By having a list of things and giving general ways for creationists to compose examples of their own, the impression of deck stacking is avoided. Of course there is more reliance on the logical thought processes of creationists...

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by Tanypteryx, posted 04-13-2014 9:04 PM Tanypteryx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by Pressie, posted 04-14-2014 9:33 AM NoNukes has not replied
 Message 167 by Tanypteryx, posted 04-14-2014 1:08 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Pressie
Member
Posts: 2103
From: Pretoria, SA
Joined: 06-18-2010


Message 158 of 969 (724182)
04-14-2014 9:33 AM
Reply to: Message 157 by NoNukes
04-14-2014 9:20 AM


Re: Why Is Evolution So Uncontroversial?
NoNukes writes
NoNukes writes:
I agree. I think what Faith was trying to say is that we are unlikely to find a cow skeleton down there even if the earth were only 6000 years old and that we have deliberately picked something difficult to find.
I disagree.
She's talking nonsense.
In a major global flood described by them, we would expect to find some cow skeletons amongst the fish. Remember, in a major flood, as postulated by creationists, there would be no boundary between oceanic 'layers' and continental 'layers' . In the case of a global flood, we would expect to find trilobite and cow fossils 'intermingling'. Everywhere. It's never found.
Cows sould be found in the same layer as trilobites according to them.
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 159 of 969 (724184)
04-14-2014 9:44 AM
Reply to: Message 151 by Pressie
04-14-2014 6:04 AM


Re: Why so hostile?
His profile now claims his location is Russia.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by Pressie, posted 04-14-2014 6:04 AM Pressie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 160 by vimesey, posted 04-14-2014 10:22 AM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 161 by Larni, posted 04-14-2014 10:26 AM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 180 by Pressie, posted 04-15-2014 12:23 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
vimesey
Member
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


Message 160 of 969 (724186)
04-14-2014 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 159 by Theodoric
04-14-2014 9:44 AM


Re: Why so hostile?
Maybe there's some sort of student exchange programme....

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 159 by Theodoric, posted 04-14-2014 9:44 AM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Larni
Member (Idle past 163 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 161 of 969 (724187)
04-14-2014 10:26 AM
Reply to: Message 159 by Theodoric
04-14-2014 9:44 AM


Re: Why so hostile?
He did say he would be away for a while.
Perhaps he is attending an evolution sceptic conference in Russia with all the other scientist disputing ToE.

The above ontological example models the zero premise to BB theory. It does so by applying the relative uniformity assumption that the alleged zero event eventually ontologically progressed from the compressed alleged sub-microscopic chaos to bloom/expand into all of the present observable order, more than it models the Biblical record evidence for the existence of Jehovah, the maximal Biblical god designer.
-Attributed to Buzsaw Message 53
The explain to them any scientific investigation that explains the existence of things qualifies as science and as an explanation
-Attributed to Dawn Bertot Message 286
Does a query (thats a question Stile) that uses this physical reality, to look for an answer to its existence and properties become theoretical, considering its deductive conclusions are based against objective verifiable realities.
-Attributed to Dawn Bertot Message 134

This message is a reply to:
 Message 159 by Theodoric, posted 04-14-2014 9:44 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 162 of 969 (724189)
04-14-2014 11:00 AM
Reply to: Message 158 by Pressie
04-14-2014 9:33 AM


Re: Why Is Evolution So Uncontroversial?
I never got an answer a few months back when I pointed out to Faith that trilobite and crab fossils never are found in the same rocks.

"The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails." H L Mencken

This message is a reply to:
 Message 158 by Pressie, posted 04-14-2014 9:33 AM Pressie has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 163 of 969 (724191)
04-14-2014 11:45 AM
Reply to: Message 152 by Bolder-dash
04-14-2014 7:04 AM


Bolder-dash writes:
Like these guys you mean:
So you can't name a single person who knows anything about biology who's a critic of evolution? You're shooting yourself in the foot.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Bolder-dash, posted 04-14-2014 7:04 AM Bolder-dash has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 164 of 969 (724192)
04-14-2014 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 149 by Percy
04-13-2014 9:27 PM


Re: Why Is Evolution So Uncontroversial?
They remind me of the Comfort/Cameron crocoduck, although of course they misunderstand evolution and proposed it as something that would validate evolution rather than falsify it.
I remember watching a video of Cameron and his crocoduck years ago. I can still feel the intense embarrassment I felt for him. I have always been mystified that people will make fools of themselves so publicly. It just is not that hard to find out what the ToE really is, but instead they protest against a caricature that has no resemblance to the theory at all.
Cameron shows himself to be a gullible dupe and embarrassingly he will probably never even realize it. I wonder what ever happened to him.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by Percy, posted 04-13-2014 9:27 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
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Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 165 of 969 (724194)
04-14-2014 12:38 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by Tangle
04-14-2014 2:37 AM


Re: Why Is Evolution So Uncontroversial?
When DNA was descovered it could have shown that the species taxonomists had declared as related weren't.
I do remember that there were some surprises when the DNA comparisons of families in Class Aves (birds) were completed. For example, if I remember correctly, Old World Vultures and New World Vultures were not closely related. Old World Vultures and Storks were related and New World Vultures and birds of prey were related.
Once DNA relationships were established, other taxonomic characters (morphology, embryology, behavior, etc.) were understood in a new light.
I have been involved in a number of studies using genetic comparisons of dragonflies at finer resolution, families, genera and species. It is an amazing tool.
Even now, if an organism was found that used a different set of molecules than DNA, the theory would be in trouble.
I'm not so sure the theory would be in trouble. The theory clearly works for DNA based organisms and also for all the fossils found so far.
I think it is more likely that we would develop a separate Theory of Evolution for XYZ life. This is what we will do when we discover extraterrestrial life.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by Tangle, posted 04-14-2014 2:37 AM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
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