What if Satan reformed?

You realise that you're just inventing all this stuff don't you?I still waiting for an explanation of why people need to have a relationship with God to be nice.

I realize that you believe that. They dont. there are nice people all around. They sell you cars. They do business with you. They are at football games with you. My belief is that having a relationship with God stops internal and spiritual death. The problem with nice people...as well as mean ones...is that they die. And having kids wont carry your dreamsbut by all means live for today. Eternal life is not some fantasyland.

And so, even though just one post ago you denied it, the relationship you imagine is your get outta hell free card.

Valar morghulis.
All men must die.
-Game of ThronesDying isn't a problem, it's just a fact.
You can personally make it a problem for yourself, but you don't have to do that. 1. Eternal life is a fantasyland. There have been advocates for it throughout all of history. All of them have died.
2. Without eternal life, you still do not have to "live for today." Again, that is something you can choose to do yourself, or not.
3. Living your life for something bigger than just yourself is more meaningful if you do so without the idea that some God wants you to.People have brains, and they're very good at using them.
They can decide many, many things with their brains.
The limited list of options you present indicate that you need to use your brain more, you're lagging behind.

There's that twelve-step nonsense again. "Acknowledge a higher power. You can't do it on your own."But in the end, you have to do it on your own. Nobody's going to do it for you, least of all your wishful-thinking sky daddy. If you fail to do it on your own, he's going to send you off to spend eternity with the spirits which chose to have no need nor want of heaven. He may not have "initially created" it for you but he's sure as hell going to use it on you if you don't measure up.That kind of "freedom" you can keep.

Well that's provably untrue. I am not internally or spiritually dead. What are you going to do with this new information, adjust your belief or carry on believing an untruth? Yes, and if I believed in a God, I'd be right-royally pissed off with him for that little piece of malevolence. where did that idea come from?? You're off in your own title world now. People generally both live for today and also plan for the future. I know I do, how about you? Well obviously it is. But you've already admitted elsewhere that you are a fantasist, why doesn't having that knowledge about yourself lead you to some other conclusions?

Not true. You choose your destiny. The only thing you may have an issue with is that He built the roads, and there are essentially only two destinations. At least He was nice enough to offer us more than only one option. We may complain that we are not allowed an option to build our own destination---and road--for ourselves and that this is unfair and not true freedom, but I would ask if it is unfair that an eternal God is logically going to foreknow whatever destination we would choose and that we would either choose wisely...which would end up being Heaven..or we would choose on our own...imperfectly by default..and thus end up building our destination and road in the same subset that encompasses option 2 by default. Does that make sense? Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

I don't know. What languge is it?So God gives us two roads, one that leads to the beach and one that leads to prison. If we go off-road, we go to prison. How is that a choice?Edited by ringo, : Fixed quote.

Because the beach is next to a freshwater lake...which is the only source of water in the state. God won't simply change the nature of the reality of the source of life in order to give you the power to create your own water supply.

And yet He has the gall to talk about "choice".

There are some choices in reality that we dont get to make. We will never fly, yet we can build airplanes. We will never live forever through our own efforts or that of medical science. WE cant redesign our bodies to not need water or food, and we can't worship our own offroading spirit. Its not His fault that you always decide to go offroading on the day He sends His Son to your house to bring some water over from the beach next to the lake. You still had the choice what to do with your time...you just cant live forever away from the water supply.

Have you never had a relationship with someone who kept you busy and out of trouble?Im not saying that you dont have a responsibility to try and do your best. I am suggesting that the relationship is the charge to do so.

Of course it's His fault. He created the situation and all of the choices. He can't claim to give me a choice and then punish me for the choice I make. Only because He deprived me of the choice by creating it that way.

Here you go again! Thats satans argument...not yours.You can always go offroading. Just make sure to take plenty of water with you.Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

So how do you decide which argument is right? How do you know Satan is the bad guy? He isn't the one who's threatening us.If he does reform, should we cave in too or should we continue to fight the good fight against that God guy?