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Member (Idle past 1433 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Marxism vs Socialism vs Communism vs Totalitarianisms | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1433 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Too often it seems that opposition to communism is based not on reality or even the writings of those who developed the concept and just like the support for "Biblical Christianity" not what is actually written but rather fantasies. Such as the belief that communism is anti-god or godless, when many communes were religious organizations. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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subbie Member (Idle past 1282 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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And when it says, "Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me," that sounds a lot closer to communism than capitalism to me. But I'm sure the apologists have an out there, too.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Faith writes:
Indeed. And how can you not extend that to your neighbour's well-being?
Also, you can perhaps deny yourself self defense, if only your own wellbeing is at stake, but how do you justify denying your protection to your children?quote: quote:The Great Socialist and His Son agreed that we should take care of our neighbours the same as we take care of ourselves or our children - protecting them not only from physical danger but also from hunger, disease, etc.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes: And your purpose for telling us this is....? Are you somehow proving that jars perception of logic, reason, and morality are superior to that of Jesus Christ? Are you for Him or against Him, jar. What exactly is it that you preach here? Well according to the Bible Jesus lived in a communistic community but was unable to abide by the rules and so used luxuries for himself instead of the poor. The account is found in Matthew, Mark and John. Luke has a somewhat different version of the story.(...)From the Bible stories it seem Jesus would have espoused Communism over Capitalism but would likely not have the moral capability to follow through. Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo It's easy to see the speck in somebody else's ideas - unless it's blocked by the beam in your own.~Ringo If a savage stops believing in his wooden god, it does not mean that there is no God only that God is not wooden.(Leo Tolstoy)
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
I don't preach anything Phat, just report what the authors of the New Testament stories wrote.
It has absolutely nothing to do with being for or against anyone but rather honestly reporting what was actually written. The Bible does support totalitarianism. That is simply a fact. Or should I do like the apologists and make up shit that is not in the story to make it mean something other than what was written? Have you ever actually read the Bible Phat?Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1433 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Jon writes: Message 413: Either way, it makes reasonable people really question the sanity of folks who still see Communism as a social and economic system workable on a national level. Would you agree that unrestrained capitalism is also a failed social and economic system that is not workable on a national level? And that any restraint on capitalism to make it a better social and economic system would be taking some tenets from socialist thinking? Just curious ... Enjoy by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Indeed. And how can you not extend that to your neighbour's well-being?
Oh but I do, and have said so many times.
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Faith writes:
Socialist.
ringo writes:
Oh but I do, and have said so many times. And how can you not extend that to your neighbour's well-being?
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes: Fair enough. Perhaps each of us here--on this forum---should ask ourselves if we want to report everything or only report what it is we want others to read? I don't preach anything Phat, just report what the authors of the New Testament stories wrote.It has absolutely nothing to do with being for or against anyone but rather honestly reporting what was actually written. Personally, I report on Jesus divinity, whereas you report on his humanity...thus we differ.Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo It's easy to see the speck in somebody else's ideas - unless it's blocked by the beam in your own.~Ringo If a savage stops believing in his wooden god, it does not mean that there is no God only that God is not wooden.(Leo Tolstoy)
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: Fair enough. Perhaps each of us here--on this forum---should ask ourselves if we want to report everything or only report what it is we want others to read? Personally, I report on Jesus divinity, whereas you report on his humanity...thus we differ. Not quite Phat; I simply report what the Bible says. Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0
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ringo writes: socialist! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMLgEnDGkG4Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo It's easy to see the speck in somebody else's ideas - unless it's blocked by the beam in your own.~Ringo If a savage stops believing in his wooden god, it does not mean that there is no God only that God is not wooden.(Leo Tolstoy)
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
and I would argue that you demean Jesus through your selective reports
We humans cannot be better than He is even if we might behave better than he did while human...which is quite frankly a difficult charge in and of itself. It was not His fault that the alabaster oil was "wasted" on him. You say He was a failed Messiah because you have the same spirit of stupor in your thinking that the Jews themselves have to this day. You claim to be a Creedal Christian. Why cant you read beyond the fact that he was made man? Who Is Jesus today?Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo It's easy to see the speck in somebody else's ideas - unless it's blocked by the beam in your own.~Ringo If a savage stops believing in his wooden god, it does not mean that there is no God only that God is not wooden.(Leo Tolstoy)
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xongsmith Member Posts: 2587 From: massachusetts US Joined: Member Rating: 6.4
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Phat asks
Who Is Jesus today? A wonderful mythical figure that all of us on earth need to continue to learn about and incorporate into our every day life.- xongsmith, 5.7d
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: and I would argue that you demean Jesus through your selective reports We humans cannot be better than He is even if we might behave better than he did while human...which is quite frankly a difficult charge in and of itself. It was not His fault that the alabaster oil was "wasted" on him. You say He was a failed Messiah because you have the same spirit of stupor in your thinking that the Jews themselves have to this day. You claim to be a Creedal Christian. Why cant you read beyond the fact that he was made man? HUH? Why can't we be better than Jesus was? What excuse did Jesus give in the story? I say Jesus is a failed messiah (not was a failed messiah) because none of the requirements of being a messiah, Jewish or Christian, have been fulfilled.
Phat writes: Who Is Jesus today? I have no idea what that even means or how that could even be answered by anyone. What does any of this have to do with the topic beyond what I pointed out; that Jesus lived in a Communistic society and yet did not live by the economic system instead choosing his personal comfort over the communal needs.Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1433 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Indeed. And how can you not extend that to your neighbour's well-being? Oh but I do, and have said so many times. Unless they are muslim or socialists or etc etc etc
Message 217 on The Search for Moderate Islam: It is also stpid and dangerous to continue to support Marxism and Communism when these have been shown to lead to nothing but the violent destruction of societies and the oppression of dissidents. And yes, Capitalism is the best economic system ever devised. Not perfect, best. Shown by whom? Did the Kibbutzes in Israel end in violent destruction of the Israeli society? How about the Christian communes? What leads to violent destruction of societies and suppression of dissidents is oppressive government either by dictators or oligarchs, and what you rail against as Marxism and Communism was in reality oligarchies that usurped governments. And oligarchy run capitalism is just as bad as oligarchy run pretend communism, because it is the totalitarian oligarchy that is evil. Curiously capitalism leads to large international corporations that are oligarchies run like feudal kingdoms that trample on the nations\states regardless of political format. The purpose of free government is to serve the people, the purpose of unbridled corporations is to make the rich richer at the expense of the people. These are not compatible purposes, and the question becomes which is more important to you -- free government or the corporate oligarchy that results from unbridled capitalism. The money in politics? Capitalist Oligarchs. The economic failure? Capitalist Oligarchs. Bailout of the rich instead of the people? Capitalist Oligarchs. Using communism as a red flag to distract you from reality? Capitalist Oligarchs. Using fear to distract you from reality so you vote for more oppression? Capitalist Oligarchs. You have the wrong bogeyman in your closet. Enjoy Edited by RAZD, : qsby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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