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Author Topic:   Climate Change Denier comes in from the cold: SCIENCE!!!
foreveryoung
Member (Idle past 583 days)
Posts: 921
Joined: 12-26-2011


Message 211 of 946 (769834)
09-25-2015 12:14 PM


Neither one of you is NoNukes

Replies to this message:
 Message 212 by NosyNed, posted 09-25-2015 12:25 PM foreveryoung has not replied
 Message 213 by Theodoric, posted 09-25-2015 12:34 PM foreveryoung has not replied
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NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8996
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


(2)
Message 212 of 946 (769836)
09-25-2015 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 211 by foreveryoung
09-25-2015 12:14 PM


So?
What difference does it make who wrote something? If NoNukes agrees and copies what others have written will that make a difference to you?

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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


(2)
Message 213 of 946 (769837)
09-25-2015 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 211 by foreveryoung
09-25-2015 12:14 PM


You do realize that this is an open forum, don't you. Grow a pair and address the answers that were given to you. If you cannot or will not then move along

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 211 by foreveryoung, posted 09-25-2015 12:14 PM foreveryoung has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3978
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.3


(2)
Message 214 of 946 (769862)
09-25-2015 7:57 PM
Reply to: Message 213 by Theodoric
09-25-2015 12:34 PM


Theodoric writes:
You do realize that this is an open forum, don't you. Grow a pair and address the answers that were given to you. If you cannot or will not then move along
I wonder if he'd leave his kid in a closed car on a sunny day, then demand a coherent thermodyamic definition from the police. Or maybe he needs a coherent thermodynamic definition before he kicks off the blanket on a steamy night?
Then again, I'm no NoNukes.
Edited by Omnivorous, : explanation->definition

"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."
Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.
-Terence

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 216 by NoNukes, posted 09-25-2015 10:04 PM Omnivorous has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 215 of 946 (769865)
09-25-2015 9:55 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by foreveryoung
09-24-2015 10:52 PM


Can you give me a thermodynamic definition of the greenhouse effect?
Yes I can do that.
The greenhouse effect is not in any way controversial. The greenhouse effect is the reason why temperatures on earth are moderate. Absent the effect the earth would be too cold to live on.
Generally the earth receives heat from the sun via radiation of all frequencies and loses heat primarily by radiation of infra red energy. The frequency based asymmetry difference occurs because of the far lower temperature of the earth. You may have observed for yourself that lower temperature radiating bodies give off a redder radiation than do higher temperature bodies. It is also the case that radiative heat transfer is proportional (roughly) to the fourth power of the absolute temperature.
The greenhouse effect is an asymmetry that allows a substance in the atmosphere to decrease the rate of heat transfer from the earth by a larger amount than the substance decreases the energy transfer to the earth. Accordingly the balance between heat out and energy in occurs at a higher earth temperature that it would without the effect. This observed effect is named after the effect of glass in a greenhouse because glass allows much of the sun's radiated solar energy to pass through freely but is more resistant to infra-red radiation that is re-radiated by surfaces within the greenhouse.
So that's the thermodynamic definition and there is no doubt
1) that the effect itself is real and that it occurs on earth. In fact we could not live on earth without the effect.
2) that gases such as methane and carbon dioxide can produce the effect
3) that the answer to your question can be found in any dictionary worth looking at. Why in the world you think that either I or real climate scientists are this particular kind of idiot is an idea I find hard to take seriously. I expect that kind of stuff from ICANT, but you ought to know better. Haven't you had a heat/light/sound type of physics course already if not a full blown thermodynamics course?
Find some other point of denial. The one you've chosen is hilarious.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

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Replies to this message:
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NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 216 of 946 (769866)
09-25-2015 10:04 PM
Reply to: Message 214 by Omnivorous
09-25-2015 7:57 PM


Then again, I'm no NoNukes.
Thank your lucky stars that you aren't NoNukes.
I have the reputation of being some kind of a physics idiot, so perhaps it will turn out that not only don't I know the definition of greenhouse effect, but I also won't look at wikipedia before answering the question.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 214 by Omnivorous, posted 09-25-2015 7:57 PM Omnivorous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 217 by Omnivorous, posted 09-25-2015 10:52 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied
 Message 218 by Omnivorous, posted 09-25-2015 10:53 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied
 Message 219 by AZPaul3, posted 09-26-2015 12:03 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied
 Message 223 by RAZD, posted 09-26-2015 5:14 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3978
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.3


Message 217 of 946 (769868)
09-25-2015 10:52 PM
Reply to: Message 216 by NoNukes
09-25-2015 10:04 PM


NoNukes writes:
Then again, I'm no NoNukes.
Thank your lucky stars that you aren't NoNukes.
Nope. I see your tag on a post as a seal of quality.
But I had to poke his pout, and I couldn't resist the chance to say "no NoNukes".

"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."
Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.
-Terence

This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by NoNukes, posted 09-25-2015 10:04 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3978
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.3


Message 218 of 946 (769869)
09-25-2015 10:53 PM
Reply to: Message 216 by NoNukes
09-25-2015 10:04 PM


Duplicate post.
Edited by Omnivorous, : No reason given.

"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."
Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.
-Terence

This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by NoNukes, posted 09-25-2015 10:04 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8513
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


(3)
Message 219 of 946 (769873)
09-26-2015 12:03 AM
Reply to: Message 216 by NoNukes
09-25-2015 10:04 PM


I have the reputation of being some kind of a physics idiot...
Hey, me too! I'm so bad at GR (How bad are you? Well I'll tell ya.) I'm so bad at GR that when I sit in my chair I have to strap myself in to keep from floating away! I don't know how many times I've been knocked on my knoggin by that damn ceiling fan.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

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JonF
Member (Idle past 169 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 220 of 946 (769883)
09-26-2015 8:25 AM
Reply to: Message 215 by NoNukes
09-25-2015 9:55 PM


It might be worthwhile mentioning that, although we do receive radiation of a wide variety of wavelengths from the Sun, there are wavelengths of which we receive much more than others. These are the wavelengths to which our eyes respond. Coincidence, no doubt.
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1406 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 221 of 946 (769922)
09-26-2015 4:50 PM
Reply to: Message 219 by AZPaul3
09-26-2015 12:03 AM


and I though it was the medical maryjane.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1406 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 222 of 946 (769923)
09-26-2015 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 220 by JonF
09-26-2015 8:25 AM


... there are wavelengths of which we receive much more than others. These are the wavelengths to which our eyes respond. Coincidence, no doubt.
No doubt at all, nor is that any reason for chlorophyll to appear green ... oops
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1406 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(2)
Message 223 of 946 (769924)
09-26-2015 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 216 by NoNukes
09-25-2015 10:04 PM


New Poll of Scientists
Polling scientists on climate change | National Center for Science Education
quote:
Polling scientists on climate change
September 25th, 2015
polls on climate change
scientist polls
"Using responses from nearly 700 biophysical scientists," a new survey "finds that approximately 92 percent of them believe that human-caused climate change is really happening," according to the Washington Post (September 25, 2015), reporting on J. S. Carlton, Rebecca Perry-Hill, Matthew Huber, and Linda S. Prokopy's "The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists," published in Environmental Research Letters.
Asked "When compared with pre-1800's levels, do you think that mean global temperatures have generally risen, fallen, or remained relatively constant?" 93.6% of respondents indicated that they thought temperatures have risen, 2.1% indicated that they thought temperatures had remained relatively constant, 0.6% indicated that they thought temperatures had fallen, and 3.7% indicated they had no opinion or did not know.
When respondents who indicated that they thought that mean global temperatures have risen when compared to pre-1800s levels were asked, "Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?" 98.2% agreed. Multiplying 98.2% and 93.6%, Carlton and his colleagues concluded, "91.9% of scientists surveyed believed in anthropogenic climate change."
The researchers concluded, "there is a general consensus among biophysical scientists across the United States that (1) climate change is occurring, (2) humans are contributing to it, and (3) climate science is a trustworthy, mature, and credible discipline. Scientists who continue to claim otherwise are operating outside of the consensus, not just of climate scientists, but also of scientists as a whole."
Pretty strong results.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
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petrophysics1
Inactive Member


Message 224 of 946 (769925)
09-26-2015 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 211 by foreveryoung
09-25-2015 12:14 PM


A Geology Education
Foreveryoung,
Nothing like having the perspective of the last 600 million years in relation to climate as opposed to looking at the last 150 years with blinders on.
So using the Vostek ice core data no one here can show/prove a relationship between CO2 and the Earth's temperature.
The Earth's main greenhouse gas is water vapor responsible for 97% of the greenhouse gas effect (the EPA says 95%). But there is no easy way to tax water vapor.
That is not the case with CO2, as there are many ways this can be taxed. As Michael Faraday replied to a MP who asked what good is this knowledge, Mike responded "You may be able to figure out a way to tax it" or something along those lines.
This CO2, AGW thing is just a way to tax people..............so loved by the big government types.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 225 of 946 (769934)
09-26-2015 8:01 PM
Reply to: Message 224 by petrophysics1
09-26-2015 5:14 PM


Re: A Geology Education
The Earth's main greenhouse gas is water vapor responsible for 97% of the greenhouse gas effect (the EPA says 95%). But there is no easy way to tax water vapor.
It would be asinine to try to avoid AGW by trying to control the amount of water vapor in the atmosphere. The fact that we have oceans and a water cycle makes that impossible. Man has essentially no effect on the average amount of water in the atmosphere; the amount of moisture in the atmosphere cycles up and down on a relatively short cycle.
What we see here is a conspiracy theory based on a pretty silly idea that has absolutely no science behind it. The fact that water vapor plays a large role in the green house effect does not prevent methane and CO2 from being gasses worthy and even appropriate targets for reduction.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 224 by petrophysics1, posted 09-26-2015 5:14 PM petrophysics1 has not replied

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