Another one that hurts

The John Quincy Adams "quote" is listed as bogus (https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Talk:John_Quincy_Adams) and reported to actually be by one Joseph Blunt in "The American Annual Register" (1830). The misquoting is attributed to Robert Spencer (1995).Your sources are lying to you yet again.

And in the Churchill quote, you left out the ironic part:

quote:

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... ; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilisation of ancient Rome.

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Ironic given how much "true Christians" hate science and seek to destroy it.

Faith, my main problem with Christianity are Christians. And Christians, especially "true Christians" have proven themselves to be notorious liars. Actual Christians are mindful of the truth, but "true Christians" demonstrate time and again that they hate the truth.Sadly, it has gotten to the point that whenever a "true Christian" says anything, we must suspect it as a falsehood until we can verify it. That is especially true of creationists (I have personally witnessed a local creationist tell one deliberate lie after another and display immense dishonesty on all matters) and Religious Right historical revisionists.If you had followed that link, you have seen the link to Blunt's own work at https://books.google.com/books?pg=PA267&dq=%22transcenden.... Then you would have seen it for yourself. Not that you would ever do such a thing.

Did Spencer cite his source for that quote? Did you then go to that source to verify that that is indeed what JQ Adams had written?If Christian revisionist historians are anything like creationists, they just borrow from each other and then cite the "sources" their fellow "historians" "cited" without ever looking at the original.An example of that by creationists is described on my page, Moon Dust. Leading creationists used a "1976" NASA document ("written well into the space age") to support their claim that direct measurement of meteoric dust in showed that a 4.5 billion year old moon would be covered with a layer of meteoric dust over 200 feet thick. They all cited that "1976" NASA document, but when I pulled it off the university library shelf I immediately saw that they had never laid eyes upon it themselves. It was a collection of papers presented at a 1965 conference and it was printed in 1967. All they ever did was copy the claim from another creationist along with that creationist's "citation" and fraudulently claimed it as their own.There's an on-line book (a PDF file), "Liars for Jesus", when researches into Christian revisionist historians' claims. The author examines a claim and the versions of that claim as it appears in several Christian "history" books and points out who had borrowed from whom. Then the author goes to the actual historical documents to see what the truth behind those false claims is. It is very enlightening, though it does get into a lot of detail.So, Faith, did Spencer cite his source for that JQ Adams quote? Did you go to that source to see what Adams actually said? Or whether he had said it at all?And surely even you must realize that if you continue to use liars as your sources, we will not be able to believe anything that you say.

No, Faith, I am not a liar. I have no reason to lie, since I am not a creationist. And even less of a reason to lie since I am also not a "true Christian".Yet again, did Spencer cite his source? What was the citation?

I'm seeing basically two camps forming here:1. Islamists are repeatedly demonstrating what murderous monsters they are.2. Islamists are a people being misrepresented by extremists and with whom we must be able to deal in the future.My father served in the Pacific in WWII (Seabees, master carpenter). He returned with strong hatred for the Japanese. Then in civilian life he had to do work on the homes of Japanese-American farmers, during which time he learned of our shared humanity.Yes, we do need to deal with the extremists. But at the same time, we still need to work out how to deal with the entire Islamic community in the long run. Because we will eventually end up having to live side-by-side. So how are we to do that?