|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
EvC Forum active members: 63 (9162 total) |
| |
popoi | |
Total: 916,387 Year: 3,644/9,624 Month: 515/974 Week: 128/276 Day: 2/23 Hour: 0/0 |
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Another one that hurts | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
Nonsense. Most of us are willing to risk our lives for something - e.g. our children. Suicide bombers are just more sincere in their commitment. Suicide bombers, by definition, value their lives less than you or I do. We call people heroes when they die for our cause. Why call them something else when they die for their own?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
But they're not losing.
we call the guy that wins at Monopoly the hero. We call the guy who knocks over the board...when he is losing...a bad sport.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
~1.6 writes:
They weren't willingly risking their lives; they were just indulging in risky behaviour, like drug addiction. It's not analogous to two sides in a war.
Ted Bundy and Jeff Dahmer where also sincere in their commitments.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
You don't get to decide what their dream is or whether it's being fulfilled.
Their dream of an ideal Muslim Utopia is losing. Phat writes:
Exactly. Christian Fundamentalists ARE violent. They, and the war-on-terror terrorists in general, will stop at nothing.
Christian Fundamentalists quite possibly would also become violent were their American Dream Utopia destroyed. If we can't raise our children in a world of opportunity, Nobody Else will succeed either!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
|
~1.6 writes:
I didn't say it was laudable. I said it was no different from bombing civilians. Suicide bombers, blowing themselves up because they are more committed to their causes is no more laudable than Hitlers cowardly act of shooting himself hunkering in a bunker. But of course it IS laudable to them and to their recruits, just like (oops) "accidentally" killing their wives and children is laudable to you.
~1.6 writes:
Yes, no doubt God is on your side. He was on your side during World War 2. He was on your side during World War 1. He was on your side during the genocide of Native Americans. He's always on your side because you're always right.
Whether you like it or not there is a right side and a wrong side.... ~1.6 writes:
I'm not legitimizing anybody. I'm demonizing both sides.
Fuck them and anyone who wants to legitimize them.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
~1.6 writes:
Correct. Drunk drivers kill people inadvertently. We still throw them in jail.
Some civilians where inadvertently killed so I guess that means the intent does not matter to you. ~1.6 writes:
No. A doctor is trying to save his patient; if he fails, he fails. A bomber pilot is trying to kill people. If he kills the "wrong" people, he's no better than a drunk driver, maybe worse.
By that logic a Dr. should be put on trail for murder every time one of his patients dies. ~1.6 writes:
Maybe war was the only way to defeat fascism. That doesn't justify the bombing of civilians during that war. As I have said before, it's better to lose a war honourably than to win one dishonourably.
Unless you are a fascist you should be able to recognize the world is a better place without totalitarian fascist regimes.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
|
Tangle writes:
I think it's more important that non-Muslims take it on board.
If moderate Muslims take this on board and keep saying it, at least it'll become obvious that the murdering toerags are a marginalised minority and not representative of the beliefs of the majority of Muslims.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
|
~1.6 writes:
Does that apply to both sides?
Yes and that because of past moral transgressions of a state or country or group they should not automatically be forfeit any consideration or credibility.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Jon writes:
The US was founded by the evil warlord George Washington. Do we condemn all present-day Americans because of that?
1.Islam was founded by the evil rapist and warlord Muhammad....
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
|
~1.6 writes:
I don't ask Charles Manson for his opinions on murder.
Do you feel the US should withhold all comment on the subject since we are guilty of doing it in the past? ~1.6 writes:
If Germany says, "Oops. It won't happen again," they should be eyed with suspicion.
Should Germany be ignored on any issues concerning human rights since they perpetrated the holocaust?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Jon writes:
Again you fail to reply with any substance. Like all your attempts at analogy, this one also fails. Let's try Martin Luther then: he was a saving lunatic; should we tar all Lutherans with that brush?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
vimesey writes:
I did say "If".
... my experience of Germans is that in general they are incredibly aware of the dangers of seductively stirring, jingoistic, right wing rhetoric. They are proud to have a criminal offence of holocaust denial, for example.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
~1.6 writes:
If I wanted to know how to murder, I might go to a convicted murderer for pointers. ("How do you make sure they're not merely dead but really most sincerely dead?") And if you want to know something about murder who better to ask than a convicted murderer. But I wouldn't go to a murderer for advice on whether murder is a good idea. Similarly, I wouldn't go to the US, the only nuclear murderer in history, for advice on whether nuclear weapons are a good idea. Their opinions on the "obvious evils" don't interest me because we clearly disagree on what's obvious.
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024