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Author Topic:   The psychology of political correctness
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(3)
Message 76 of 309 (779046)
02-29-2016 6:01 AM
Reply to: Message 75 by Faith
02-29-2016 5:46 AM


Re: "Political Correctness" and "Progressive" have origins in Marxism
Now if this doesn't answer you it's probably because I don't have a clue what you were trying to say, so I'm going to sleep and forgetting about it
I was perfectly clear. The use of the term progressive which would very well describe those things that you agree the Communist party had nothing to do with pretty much diminishes the connection between any modern use of the term and the Communist party. It really does not matter who the first person to use the term might be or have been.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Faith, posted 02-29-2016 5:46 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 77 of 309 (779047)
02-29-2016 6:09 AM
Reply to: Message 73 by NoNukes
02-29-2016 5:39 AM


Afraid to call out what behavior, specifically? And in what terms? Labeling every supporter of BLM based on someone rioting or shooting policeman? What exactly are people afraid to say.
And you believe liberals aspire to this. Sorry. Not buying that. You are certainly entitled to an opinion, but you haven't been very convincing.
It seems like you're being intentionally obtuse. I've been explicit in several different ways, but there's really no need to belabor it any further

"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by NoNukes, posted 02-29-2016 5:39 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by NoNukes, posted 02-29-2016 10:36 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(4)
Message 78 of 309 (779052)
02-29-2016 8:13 AM
Reply to: Message 75 by Faith
02-29-2016 5:46 AM


Re: "Political Correctness" and "Progressive" have origins in Marxism
Faith writes:
The TERM Progressive as a political label is what I was talking about and I didn't get the connection from the CP itself but probably from some neoconservatives calling them out for the euphemism designed to bamboozle us dumb Americans.
While Americans may not all be dumb, they are it seems often very ignorant.
You are aware I hope Faith of the American Progressive Party, started by the former US President Theodore Roosevelt in 1912 before there was a Communist Party?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Faith, posted 02-29-2016 5:46 AM Faith has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22392
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.3


(2)
Message 79 of 309 (779054)
02-29-2016 8:28 AM
Reply to: Message 75 by Faith
02-29-2016 5:46 AM


Re: "Political Correctness" and "Progressive" have origins in Marxism
Faith writes:
I have yet to figure out how your mind works. In fact I'm sure I'll never figure it out. All I know is that most of the time I can't make any sense at all out of your responses.
I'll attempt to translate:
NoNukes in Message 70 writes:
Top link in the search...
Communist Party USA – Communist Party USA
quote:
The Communist Party has an unparalleled history in the progressive movement of the United States, from the struggle against Jim Crow segregation, the organizing of the industrial unions, from the canneries of California, to the sweatshops of New York City.
That's a pretty frightening indictment of the Communist Party. They claim essentially every civil right success ever made in the history of the US. Apparently if not for the Communist Party, it would still be 1952. Wouldn't we have been better off without this kind of, er, progressiveness.
Faith in Message 72 writes:
Propaganda. Something the CP is particularly known for.
NoNukes in Message 74 writes:
Exactly. So perhaps the idea that progressive is somehow irrecoverably linked to the Communist Party can be dismissed in a similar way. Because surely those things cited in the propaganda were considered progressive. Yet you acknowledge that 'the Party' deserves no credit.
NoNukes is saying that if the Communist Party's civil rights and unionism advocacy can be dismissed, then its association with the progressive movement evaporates. In other words, if the Communist Party had nothing to do with "the struggle against Jim Crow segregation, the organizing of the industrial unions, from the canneries of California, to the sweatshops of New York City," then they aren't really associated with the progressive movement.
Speaking just for myself, if what that passage said about the issues the Communist Party furthered can be dismissed without evidence, then what it said about the Communist Party's association with the progressive movement can also be dismissed without evidence. The basic principle here is that understanding should be built upon evidence.
According to Wikipedia, the Communist Party was active in integration issues and the labor movement.
--Percy

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 Message 75 by Faith, posted 02-29-2016 5:46 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 80 by jar, posted 02-29-2016 8:44 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied
 Message 86 by Faith, posted 02-29-2016 2:18 PM Percy has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(2)
Message 80 of 309 (779056)
02-29-2016 8:44 AM
Reply to: Message 79 by Percy
02-29-2016 8:28 AM


Re: "Political Correctness" and "Progressive" have origins in Marxism
Percy writes:
According to Wikipedia, the Communist Party was active in integration issues and the labor movement.
The Greensboro Massacre.
In 1979 the US Communist Workers' Party was holding a rally to oppose the KKK and organize mostly black textile workers in Greensboro, NC. They were attacked and five were killed. The Police actively pulled all protection away from the rally and and later the shooters were acquitted in two all white jury trials.
The people killed were:
quote:
The marchers killed were: Sandi Smith, a nurse and civil rights activist; Dr. James Waller, president of a local textile workers union who ceased medical practice to organize workers; Bill Sampson, a graduate of the Harvard Divinity School; Cesar Cauce, a Cuban immigrant who graduated magna cum laude from Duke University; and Dr. Michael Nathan, chief of pediatrics at Lincoln Community Health Center in Durham, North Carolina, a clinic that helped children from low-income families.
source
That is hardly what I would call propaganda.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by Percy, posted 02-29-2016 8:28 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 81 of 309 (779057)
02-29-2016 10:36 AM
Reply to: Message 77 by Hyroglyphx
02-29-2016 6:09 AM


I've been explicit in several different ways
Actually, you haven't. I cannot get a firm example of a PC statement out of you despite making direct requests. I can get statements that say that liberals aspire to be PC though. I've indicated that my reason for asking is that I believe that the way you apply the term PC is suspect because of your exuberance in throwing around unsupportable generalizations about what most liberals or progressives do.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by Hyroglyphx, posted 02-29-2016 6:09 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2578
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 6.8


(1)
Message 82 of 309 (779063)
02-29-2016 12:08 PM


BLM, Wall Street
We have seen instances in this campaign year of how candidates deal with disruptive people in the audience. We've seen Trump asking his supporters to steal coats off the dissenters and throw them out into the cold NH winter. He also has said things like "Punch him in the face". We've also seen the Hillary campaign throw out a BLM protester at one of her appearances.
Bernie, however, yields his microphone to the disruption and in effect absorbs the issue by being INCLUSIVE. There is no further disruption - Bernie needed to show that he is certainly on their side (despite how badly they believed it in South Carolina).
Is PC an issue here at all? We kneaux that Trump is no PC guy. He is however, nonetheless very crude & rude and perhaps correctly the target of these so-called "excessive PC" writers. But Hillary? Bernie?
Bernie was asked about whether Wall Street would like it if he got elected and readily said that most certainly they would not, in contrast to what Hillary said about that. Was Hillary being "PC" not to offend Wall Street?
Just wondering about the good PC versus the bad PC...there certainly are both kinds, along with PCs in between.

- xongsmith, 5.7d

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 83 of 309 (779064)
02-29-2016 12:38 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by xongsmith
02-29-2016 12:08 PM


Re: BLM, Wall Street
I'm still not sure what is and is not "politically correct". For example; which of the following assertions would be "politically correct"?
The US is a Christian nation.
The basis for our Constitution and Bill of Rights is the Bible?
Islam should not be recognized as a religion and eligible for tax-exempt status because it is the devil's own invention?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by xongsmith, posted 02-29-2016 12:08 PM xongsmith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 84 by Faith, posted 02-29-2016 2:05 PM jar has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 84 of 309 (779067)
02-29-2016 2:05 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by jar
02-29-2016 12:38 PM


PC
I'm still not sure what is and is not "politically correct". For example; which of the following assertions would be "politically correct"?
The US is a Christian nation.
The basis for our Constitution and Bill of Rights is the Bible?
Islam should not be recognized as a religion and eligible for tax-exempt status because it is the devil's own invention?
None of the above is PC, very far from it.
PC is leftist, and comprises opinions that nobody feels free to contradict because doing so would brand you as a racist or homophobe or Islamophobe etc., the exact opposite of the above statements which in fact often get you so branded. Nobody has a problem contradicting the above statements, it’s very PC to contradict them.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by jar, posted 02-29-2016 12:38 PM jar has replied

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 Message 88 by jar, posted 02-29-2016 2:45 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 85 of 309 (779068)
02-29-2016 2:12 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by xongsmith
02-29-2016 12:08 PM


Re: BLM, Wall Street
Just wondering about the good PC versus the bad PC...there certainly are both kinds, along with PCs in between.
No, that is not true. I guess only conservatives really know what PC is, liberals make it up to suit themselves. But PC is a specific way of thinking that originated in Cultural Marxism, that labels conservative opinion as racist, homophobic, Islamophobic and similar things to discredit their opinions by guilt, and shut them up. THIS is the essay that originally defined the term.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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 Message 91 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-29-2016 3:27 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 86 of 309 (779069)
02-29-2016 2:18 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by Percy
02-29-2016 8:28 AM


Re: "Political Correctness" and "Progressive" have origins in Marxism
The term "Progressive" has nothing to do with any particular issues as I was talking about it. It is a term that was invented by the CP in the USA as a way of hiding the fact that whatever issues originated with them came from the Communist Party. The links on google suggest Progressive has an independent life from the CP, though they at least show that there is a connection; but various ex-CP members have said it came directly from the CP propaganda machine. I'm not talking about particular political issues, just the term as a euphemism for Communism.
If the term has been used in other contexts, that doesn't change the fact that it was specifically used by the CP to cover its tracks.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by Percy, posted 02-29-2016 8:28 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by Percy, posted 03-01-2016 7:11 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 87 of 309 (779072)
02-29-2016 2:24 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by NoNukes
02-29-2016 6:01 AM


Re: "Political Correctness" and "Progressive" have origins in Marxism
was perfectly clear. The use of the term progressive which would very well describe those things that you agree the Communist party had nothing to do with pretty much diminishes the connection between any modern use of the term and the Communist party. It really does not matter who the first person to use the term might be or have been.
The fact that the term is used for other purposes doesn't change the fact that the CP specifically chose it to cover their own tracks and hide the Communist origin of their operations. Whatever other uses it has been put to, it functioned and still functions as a euphemism for the Communist Party and its works.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by NoNukes, posted 02-29-2016 6:01 AM NoNukes has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 88 of 309 (779073)
02-29-2016 2:45 PM
Reply to: Message 84 by Faith
02-29-2016 2:05 PM


Re: PC
Faith writes:
PC is leftist, and comprises opinions that nobody feels free to contradict because doing so would brand you as a racist or homophobe or Islamophobe etc., the exact opposite of the above statements which in fact often get you so branded. Nobody has a problem contradicting the above statements, it’s very PC to contradict them.
So only leftists can be Politically Correct?
If the statements are called into question simply based on the fact that all three were simply false, is that still just "Politically Correct"?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 84 by Faith, posted 02-29-2016 2:05 PM Faith has not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 89 of 309 (779074)
02-29-2016 2:53 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by Hyroglyphx
02-29-2016 2:18 AM


Re: How to Eliminate the Need for Most Trigger Warnings
Type in "trigger warning" in a YouTube search and be prepared to cringe.
OK, let's try that:
Depressed/Suicidal edit *TRIGGER WARNING*
Seems to be a video about suicide and suicidality. Trigger warning very much correctly used.
Trigger WARNING
Seems to be a video where two smug gits mock other people going through traumatic mental health crises. The kind of attitude I was arguing against in this thread.
Social Justice Warrior Gets Rekt [Trigger Warning]
Is used ironically, again.
Trigger warnings demean feminism. Here's why.
The quick look I took indicates they think that experimenting with ways to reduce anxiety for some people in large crowds, suggests that all women are wilting flowers. Or something
What's The Deal With Classroom Trigger Warnings? | Idea Channel | PBS Digital Studios
Seems to characterize trigger warnings as I do.
TEACHER TOUCHED ME | TRIGGER WARNING
Seems to be a personal tale of sexual assault. Appropriate use.
I FORGOT TO TRIGGER WARNING! ( I'LL TRY TO TRIGGER WARNING FROM NOW ON! I'M SORRY )
It's seems to be an annoying dudebro mocking Trigger Warnings by misunderstanding them the same way previous mockers have.
*TRIGGER WARNING** ~Self harm~ Suicide~anorexia~Depression~
Self explanatory and correctly used.
"Trigger Warning" by Karina Stow (CUPSI 2015)
A poem. Seems to understand the concept as I do.
Trigger Warning: Your Ideas Don't Have Rights
A discussion/interview. It's half an hour so I didn't watch enough to get a sense of things, but Peter Boghossian has publicly denounced trigger warnings previously so I suspect that the theme of the discussion.
My cutting story *trigger warning*

Seems appropriately used.
suicide / depression edit (trigger warning)
Seems to be consistent with my usage.
Knife Party - 'Trigger Warning' OUT NOW
Marketing for a music album
Trigger warning self harm
Suicidal/ depression edit TRIGGER WARNING
Appropriately used.
Star Wars Trigger Warning
Humour about a world of excessive and evenly applied Trigger Warnings
Trigger Warnings in College Classes?
Seems to be using the textbook definition - literally - they flash it up on screen and everything.
Dave Rubin on Free Speech, Safe Spaces, and Trigger Warnings
Doesn't apparently talk about Trigger Warnings.
TRIGGER WARNINGS -- We the Internet Sketch 1
'Comedy.' Seems to be mocking trigger warnings. It makes the same confused mistakes I have argued against here. The teacher tells a Jew she should avoid Merchant of Venice. This isn't a Trigger Warning its the right wing fear that people are being mollycoddled (which doesn't generally apply when the subject matter is religion, for some reason)
London Thinks — Trigger Warning!
Seems to be an academic discussion on Trigger Warnings at University. Its 90 minutes so haven't even seen a representative enough of a sample to give more than this.
I may be wrong on some of these, maybe a few appear to be one way but are actually the other as a 'twist' that gets revealed at the end, or the creator may be a famous parodist or something.
Nevertheless, it seems to be a series of videos about depression and self harm labelled up as self harm, a few comedy videos mocking a disfigured understanding of trigger warnings, Some discussions that appear to be discussing actual Trigger Warnings (some pro some con), a poem and an album promotion.
I don't see anything to the degree of warning about evolution being real or just a theory, hard maths in hydrology, trigger warnings in climatology discussions...stuff that anglagard referenced.
Maybe you could provision me with your first page of results on youtube so that I can see what you mean?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Hyroglyphx, posted 02-29-2016 2:18 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 90 of 309 (779075)
02-29-2016 3:03 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by Hyroglyphx
02-29-2016 2:18 AM


Re: How to Eliminate the Need for Most Trigger Warnings
dbl pst
Edited by Modulous, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Hyroglyphx, posted 02-29-2016 2:18 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
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