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Author Topic:   Molecular Population Genetics and Diversity through Mutation
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9503
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.6


Message 371 of 455 (786043)
06-15-2016 3:40 AM
Reply to: Message 357 by Faith
06-14-2016 9:43 PM


Re: Mutations are not alleles
Faith writes:
Of course if there are areas of reality that aren't subject to scientific testing because they have nothing to do with the physical world but another realm of reality altogether, and you've arbitrarily rejected them for simply being a different kind of reality, that's pretty irrational of you isn't it?
There are no areas of reality that are beyond scientific testing. This is science's job. If you can show me a reality that is not being examined by science, I'll test it myself for you.
I inhabit an entirely different paradigm,
Yes we know
so that whatever is true in them is always being subsumed under a Big Fat Lie that skews it all beyond any real scientific usefulness. The science in them would stand without the lie, but that would require some intricate epistemological surgery.
It's not a single lie though is it Faith? If it was a single issue, it's vaguely possible that it could be wrong and if it was wrong it would be corrected - because all errors in science ultimately get corrected.
It's actually multitudes of 'lies' in all independant scientific disciplines that all rather miraculously converge on a single 'truth'. So physics, astronomy geology and biology all provide supporting evidence for an old earth and none for a young earth. Are all the millions of scientists involved in a massive conspiracy to corrupt and lie about everything from Rocks to space travel? It's pure fantasy Faith, it's utterly impossible for you to be right and literally millions of man-years of cross-disciplinary, peer-reviewed science to be totally wrong in every aspect of its work. If it was wrong great chunks of our technology would not work. Even you at your deepest level of denial and delusion must know this.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 357 by Faith, posted 06-14-2016 9:43 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 376 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 10:36 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9503
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 380 of 455 (786065)
06-15-2016 11:23 AM
Reply to: Message 376 by Faith
06-15-2016 10:36 AM


Re: Epistemological digression
Faith writes:
But the other reality I have in mind CAN'T be "shown" to you because it isn't physical.
Then it isn't part of reality.
But the other reality I have in mind CAN'T be "shown" to you because it isn't physical. It IS beyond scientific testing because it isn't physical. How would you test for the reality of nonphysical beings like angels and demons or "ghosts?" People try and the results are ridiculous because these, if real, would be nonphysical and not subject to testing.
Correct, non-real things can't be tested, because, well, they have no reality. We call things that have no reality 'non-existent'.
Religions make claims about their beliefs that should have measurable affects in the real world - miracles, prophecies, power of prayer etc. Sadly, when examined they prove to be nonsense.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 376 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 10:36 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 381 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 11:28 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9503
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.6


Message 382 of 455 (786067)
06-15-2016 11:46 AM
Reply to: Message 381 by Faith
06-15-2016 11:28 AM


Re: Epistemological digression
Faith writes:
Sure, that way you can just ignore the whole other realm of the spirit.
Correct. Until something can be shown to actually exist, it can be safely ignored.
Sorry, there is no way to reliably test the spiritual so your claim that it's been done and disproved it is a sad delusion.
I never claimed that the spiritual world has been tested, in fact I said it can't be, because to be tested it first has to be part of reality and actually exist.
But as I said there is lots of evidence from witnesses to the phenomena you claim is nonexistent, and witness evidence IS evidence whether you like it or not. Try believing the best attested witness reports some time, it should be an eye-opening revelation for you.
If these things are true there would be stacks of real evidence for them and you'd be producing it all over this forum - sadly there is none. But if you've been hiding evidence for the supernatural somewhere just waiting for the opportunity to produce it, now would be a good moment.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 381 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 11:28 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 383 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 11:54 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9503
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.6


Message 385 of 455 (786072)
06-15-2016 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 383 by Faith
06-15-2016 11:54 AM


Re: Epistemological digression
Faith writes:
Miracles, prophecies and prayer you claimed to have been tested. You can't test these things.
Of course you can. If I say tomorrow the sun won't rise, you can test my prophecy. If I said I had might amputated limb regrown, you could test that, if I said I prayed for a new Porsche 911in pink and one appeared in my garage you could test that.
There's no problem at all testing real things Faith.
but you still have to believe
Yup, instead of evidence, you just believe.
If you think what you believe is real, show it to me and I'll test it. If it's just what you believe is real, then there's no point 'cos it doesn't exist in the real world does it? It's not real, t's just a belief.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 383 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 11:54 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 387 by Faith, posted 06-15-2016 12:39 PM Tangle has not replied

  
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