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Author | Topic: Presuppositionalism | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Because there is One God that is not created nor imagined. He is the uncaused first cause.All of the rest have been created/imagined. I suppose you will demand evidence....
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
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Tangle Member Posts: 9512 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Phat writes: Because there is One God that is not created nor imagined. He is the uncaused first cause.All of the rest have been created/imagined. I suppose you will demand evidence.... Do you think that chanting ritualised propaganda like that is of any use at all outside your church? When my chemistry teacher chanted the party line that burning hydrogen in oxygen made water, I could check it out myself, but when you guys repeat the stuff you were taught like nursery rhymes do you really expect us to find them anything but laughable? Particularly when you fail time and time again to address the arguments you've been given. Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
The arguments are your problem, not mine. You have convinced yourself that God doesn't exist.
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
You didn't answer the question. Why do you think your God is different from Odin or the Flying Spaghetti Monster?
Because there is One God that is not created nor imagined. He is the uncaused first cause.All of the rest have been created/imagined.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Because both of those were inventions of the human mind
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
You're still not answering the question. What reason is there to think that your God is not an invention of the human mind? Because both of those were inventions of the human mind If there is a "prime mover" that created all that is, how do you distinguish one description of it from another? Is it just a coincidence that you were born into a nation where the prevailing description is the "right" one?
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Because for one thing the human mind likely would never have invented the God of scripture.
Is it just a coincidence that you were born into a nation where the prevailing description is the "right" one? The prevailing description in America is not the right One. Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
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DrJones* Member Posts: 2290 From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
it's invented all the other gods (except Odin the Allfather and his kin), what makes your's so unimaginable?
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds soon I discovered that this rock thing was true Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world And so there was only one thing I could do Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On *not an actual doctor
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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Phat writes: Because for one thing the human mind likely would never have invented the God of scripture. Except Phat, there really is no God of scripture. There are a whole bunch of different characteristics describing the God character found in scripture and the nature of the character changes with the intent, imagination, mythos and culture of the authors and editors and redactors. The evidence is overwhelming that the so called God of scripture is absolutely a human invention.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined:
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Boy are you in for a surprise.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes: What about Jesus? Who do you say He is? The evidence is overwhelming that the so called God of scripture is absolutely a human invention. Yes, you claim He was human while on earth. Yes, you claim that He is (so far) a failed messiah. Yet you claim the Nicene Creed. So now that GOD raised Him from the dead, who is He to you?Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
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Tangle Member Posts: 9512 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Phat writes: The arguments are your problem, not mine. The arguments are what we're supposed to be here for, if you're not going to take them on, you might as well be in your church on your knees. Why are you here?Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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Phat writes: What about Jesus? Who do you say He is? Yes, you claim He was human while on earth. Yes, you claim that He is (so far) a failed messiah. Yet you claim the Nicene Creed. So now that GOD raised Him from the dead, who is He to you? A personal belief and not anything I can explain to someone else.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
I get frustrated,but know when I've been bested. Perhaps I put too much importance into winning arguments and not enough on what the God I believe in can or will do.
At any rate I cannot prove that He exists.
jar writes: So in essence I am talking then about a character invention of my mind. Got it.
Of course there is a default position Phat. The default position is that something does not exist unless there is evidence that it does exist.jar writes: This is tough to do. I feel that I have failed God if I reduce Him to simply an imagination within my mind.
There is no understanding other than human understanding. Belief is 100% human understanding. I have never said belief should be discouraged but it should be understood to be irrational, unreasonable and unsupportable beyond simply acknowledging it as a personal belief.Dr.A writes: I can say that...but its not easy to include mine within that list. And I don't believe that all of them are made up though I have no way to convince or prove otherwise.
Surely even you must think that most religions are made up?Tangle writes: OK you win. Maybe I can beat you at chess later on....
You know the argument - the default position is that yours is too until proven otherwise. Simply saying that you believe it is not persuasive.Ringo writes: I suppose I cant change anyone's mind on this then, eh?
Belief is never anything but Plan B, a backup plan for when there is not enough evidence.Evidence IS the gold standard, the default position. Belief is never more than a poor substitute. What reason is there to think that your God is not an invention of the human mind? For one thing, I believe that He loves me. Cares for me. None of the other gods have done this. If my God were simply an invention of my mind, where do I feel the love coming from?
Tangle writes: Because it gets lonely just staying in church praying for people. The arguments are what we're supposed to be here for, if you're not going to take them on, you might as well be in your church on your knees. Why are you here?Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
What's the difference between the God in your scriptures and the god in anybody else's scriptures?
Because for one thing the human mind likely would never have invented the God of scripture. Phat writes:
What makes you think there is a "right One"? If there are so many "wrong ones", why is yours different?
The prevailing description in America is not the right One.
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