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Author | Topic: The Clinton Email Controversy | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1405 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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The government's position is that classified information shouldn't exist on unclassified systems, but where did Hillary's received emails come from, and where did the sent emails go? Looking at just a few of Hillary's emails (WSJ Clinton Email Search), many were being received from and sent to email addresses at the domain state.gov, which is an unclassified network. All indications are that the State Department uses this network for most email communication, and this practice did not suddenly begin when Clinton became Secretary of State but must also have been the practice under Condoleezza Rice, who was not herself an email user ... Her unique fault was not that she used unclassified networks for classified information, for that practice was ongoing and probably continues to this day, but that she used her own email server, thereby exposing the State Department to potential security breaches they were unaware of. To my mind there are two issues of relevance about the Clinton e-mails: (1) unsecured classified information was on a private server -- there are several people that put classified information on a private device and were then prosecuted for breaking protocol, losing their classified status and being black-listed for ever seeing classified information ever again. So there is the appearance of "Well it was Hillary, so it is okay" and that laws don't apply to the big name people. (2) the coverup -- this was the issue that brought Nixon down, the stonewalling and the coverup. This is also why she has such high unfavorable ratings: instead of being transparent and forthcoming they tried to hide what had happened and pretend that it was all approved sop etc etc. Same for the bank speeches (which we now have bits and pieces of from Podestas hacked emails), again pretending that it was nothing special (in spite of the high $$ fee). So we now know that she has one "private face" and one "public face" on issues, confirming that she is not open and fully disclosing her positions on a number of topics, from bank regulation to TPP to fracking, etc. One for raising funds and one for getting votes? Hillary has so much baggage from their previous occupation of the white house, this only adds to her perceived problems with trustworthiness. And I find it somewhat amusing that the first time around they blamed a "vast right-wing conspiracy" and this time it's the Russians -- even to saying that the Russians are organizing protests to fracking and pipelines. Really? All those Native Americans protesting #NoDAPL are Russians? There's always a scape-goat to blame ... Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1405 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
But wasn't her server set up by the Secret Service? Aren't they involved in securing US secrets? The server may have been set up by the SS for Bill's use. The person who set it up for Hillary's use was not SS:
IT worker who helped set up Hillary Clinton email server gets immunity - CBS News
quote: It wasn't intended for Sec of State use when set up for Bill. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Taq Member Posts: 9972 Joined: Member Rating: 5.6
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RAZD writes: (1) unsecured classified information was on a private server -- there are several people that put classified information on a private device and were then prosecuted for breaking protocol, losing their classified status and being black-listed for ever seeing classified information ever again. The first question that comes to mind is to ask if these other people just discussed classified information in emails, or if they disseminated documents that were marked as classified. Added in much later edit: Here is a decent website comparing the false equivalency between what Clinton did and what others have done with respect to mishandling classified information. Right-Wing Media Run With Another Baseless Comparison With Clinton Emails | Media Matters for America
Same for the bank speeches (which we now have bits and pieces of from Podestas hacked emails), again pretending that it was nothing special (in spite of the high $$ fee). What other presidential candidate has ever been expected to release transcripts of speeches made behind closed doors at a fund raising event? Edited by Taq, : No reason given.
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1.61803 Member (Idle past 1504 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
To quote him....."It will be YUUUGE!"
"You were not there for the beginning. You will not be there for the end. Your knowledge of what is going on can only be superficial and relative" William S. Burroughs
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Pressie Member Posts: 2103 From: Pretoria, SA Joined: |
RAZD writes: To my mind there are two issues of relevance about the Clinton e-mails: (1) unsecured classified information was on a private server -- there are several people that put classified information on a private device and were then prosecuted for breaking protocol, losing their classified status and being black-listed for ever seeing classified information ever again. Yeah, then some things happen. For example, for me (not involved in the US govt) , the official Government server stopped functioning. Couldn't get service. For days on end. Yet, we had to do the job. Every day without official service cost us millions. The privately owned server worked, so I sent the info through that. So, maybe, the idea is to improve govt. services to an acceptable standard?
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Pressie writes:
The Americans have no incentive to do that. It would just undermine their aversion to "big government".
So, maybe, the idea is to improve govt. services to an acceptable standard?
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Pressie Member Posts: 2103 From: Pretoria, SA Joined:
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Yes, that's what I got from all of that.
If the Government service is pretty crappy, it can't be improved. At all. Big Government and all that. No more money spent. Voted down in the House. So, no messages can be sent. Then claim to have attempted 600 phone calls in a few hours (impossible to do). Still not going through. If using private servers (which actually work most of the time) are used, it's supposed to be illegal. What to do, what to do? Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
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nwr Member Posts: 6408 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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If using private servers (which actually work most of the time) are used, it's supposed to be illegal.
That only applies to Hillary Clinton. For anybody else, it's fine. Everything that Hillary touches becomes evil, by virtue of her touching it. At least that's what the political right are telling us. Me? I'm voting for Hillary in this election.Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity
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Pressie Member Posts: 2103 From: Pretoria, SA Joined: |
nwr writes: Good on ye. I'm not American and never permanantly lived in the USA, ever. I' ve only been in America on and off for around 9 months, total. Me? I'm voting for Hillary in this election. The last time I visited (for a conference) ended quite a few months ago. Due to te fact that America is the largest economy and the President really can blow up everyone else in the world, I think that Clinton is the best way to go. She's not perfect by any means. She lies and is unlikeable and does things to get more money for herself and all that, but at least we know she's quite a stable person. Unlike her wacky opponent. If I lived there and could vote, I would have pinched my nose and done the same. The lesser of two evils, I guess. Trump=Really, really crazy and lies all the time and all that. Can't even try to be calm.Clinton= Unlikeable, lies too, but is more realistic. I feel safer with her thinking about making that doomsday call or not making it. Go Hillary. (Oops, if a foreigner says it, those Republicans would use it against her). So, I retract my comment. Edited by Pressie, : No reason given. Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
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Hyroglyphx Inactive Member
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That only applies to Hillary Clinton. For anybody else, it's fine. Everything that Hillary touches becomes evil, by virtue of her touching it. If ANYBODY else does the things she does, they go to prison for far less. Voter fraud, the passing/receiving of unsecured emails, the political assassination of Bernie Sanders, intentionally and knowingly inciting riots at Trump rallies, her stonewalling of investigations, The Clinton Foundation racketeering and campaign financing, etc, etc... These aren't isolated incidents. This is material evidence of an unscrupulous degenerate criminal who will do anything for power. Her level of corruption is staggering.
I'm voting for Hillary in this election. It's ironic. Everything Democrats despise about Republicans is extant in Hillary Clinton. If beating Trump is the ultimate goal, and I believe it is, because I cannot imagine this many registered Democrats willfully ignoring Bernie Sanders without this reason in mind, then you will have to accept the consequences of that vote. "Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine
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Percy Member Posts: 22392 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
This thread is about the Clinton email controversy. Maybe you could repost this over at The 2016 United States Presidential Election.
--Percy
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Taq Member Posts: 9972 Joined: Member Rating: 5.6
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Hyroglyphx writes: If ANYBODY else does the things she does, they go to prison for far less. Your first job is to find someone who has done far less and who then went to jail. From all reports, Colin Powell also did what HRC did, and no one is putting him in jail.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1405 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Your first job is to find someone who has done far less and who then went to jail. From all reports, Colin Powell also did what HRC did, and no one is putting him in jail. Not quite, but more to the point: N.S.A. Contractor Arrested in Possible New Theft of Secrets - The New York Times The latest in a long line of relatively unknown people that have been found to have classified material on their private computers. More "famous" people would be Snowden and Manning ... they sent the information they had to wikileaks, but one of the charges against them is stealing classified information -- ie having it on their computers. There was another instance that I ran across earlier this year, where the guy did nothing with the information and was still prosecuted, but do not have the link saved. It has happened, it continues to happen, it just isn't high profile. Enjoy.by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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nwr Member Posts: 6408 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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You've been drinking too much of the Trump Kool Aid.
Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity
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Pressie Member Posts: 2103 From: Pretoria, SA Joined:
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Hyroglyphx writes: Not me. I got a huge bonus because we could finish the contract ahead of schedule and then started another job. Getting paid for two contracts simultaneously. e-mails. Data. Reports. Publications. The works. All due to efficient communication systems. Private servers tend to work more reliably than the others. If ANYBODY else does the things she does, they go to prison for far less. Edited by Pressie, : No reason given.
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