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Author Topic:   Fake polls, fake news
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 106 of 710 (800027)
02-19-2017 12:53 PM
Reply to: Message 100 by JonF
02-19-2017 9:04 AM


Worship of Obama: yes it is
Actually I found some still up on You Tube:
Wow, even one in China: (The "hope" on a t shirt identifies it

This message is a reply to:
 Message 100 by JonF, posted 02-19-2017 9:04 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 121 by Modulous, posted 02-19-2017 7:36 PM Faith has replied
 Message 135 by JonF, posted 02-20-2017 8:16 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 138 by RAZD, posted 02-20-2017 9:32 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 107 of 710 (800028)
02-19-2017 1:02 PM
Reply to: Message 102 by jar
02-19-2017 9:19 AM


Re: Pizzagate - There's something to it???
I didn't mention Hillary. I heard some names including hers associated with it but what I posted is just the basic facts as I know them. Those facts alone are pretty creepy, and I don't think there's any way you can say those emails didn't belong to John Podesta, but beyond that I don't know what it all means.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 102 by jar, posted 02-19-2017 9:19 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 111 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2017 1:47 PM Faith has replied
 Message 115 by jar, posted 02-19-2017 3:32 PM Faith has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9489
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 108 of 710 (800029)
02-19-2017 1:17 PM


Europe's simultaneously angry and amused by this lumpen idiot. He made some nonsense claims on Friday that upset the Swedes.
quote:
You look at what’s happening, he told his supporters. We’ve got to keep our country safe. You look at what’s happening in Germany, you look at what’s happening last night in Sweden. Sweden, who would believe this?
Not the Swedes.
Nothing particularly nefarious happened in Sweden on Friday or Saturday, for that matter and Swedes were left baffled.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

Replies to this message:
 Message 109 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 1:20 PM Tangle has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 109 of 710 (800031)
02-19-2017 1:20 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by Tangle
02-19-2017 1:17 PM


I can't find a link in that post. What are you talking about?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Tangle, posted 02-19-2017 1:17 PM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 114 by Tangle, posted 02-19-2017 3:19 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 110 of 710 (800032)
02-19-2017 1:41 PM
Reply to: Message 105 by Faith
02-19-2017 12:36 PM


Re: Criticism vs. Sabotage and then there is Pizzagate
When he called out CNN for fake news it was for treating that fake Russian "dossier" as true.
Except that CNN did not do any such thing. They reported that there was a dossier, that Trump and Obama had been briefed on the dossier and they reported the contents. More recently CNN reported that some of the contents had been confirmed but that none of the confirmed content involved the salacious allegations.
Trump's calling out of CNN as having put out fake news was and is a complete lie. I challenge you to find any details that show anything to the contrary.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 105 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 12:36 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 113 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 2:33 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 111 of 710 (800033)
02-19-2017 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 107 by Faith
02-19-2017 1:02 PM


Re: Pizzagate - There's something to it???
I didn't mention Hillary. I heard some names including hers associated with it but what I posted is just the basic facts as I know them. Those facts alone are pretty creepy
Most of what you reported was a few facts like letters included words about pizza, followed by interpretations that are likely complete bullshit, such as "nobody talks about pizza that way".
The origins of this story are well known. The story is wrapped around a few things that are facts but that are quite innocent and some things that are manufactured (the photos of children for example).
I would love to see either you or HG try to put together a narrative around the story being the least bit plausible. But I cannot take either of your words at face value. Make your best case.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 1:02 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 112 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 2:29 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 112 of 710 (800039)
02-19-2017 2:29 PM
Reply to: Message 111 by NoNukes
02-19-2017 1:47 PM


Re: Pizzagate - There's something to it???
You are actually denying that the email language isn't strange as a reference to pizza? I didn't mention anything about photos, don't know anything about them as a matter of fact. I merely claim that the language is very very strange and couldn't be referring to pizza, also can't imagine what "innocent" reference they could possibly have.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 111 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2017 1:47 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 117 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2017 5:21 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 113 of 710 (800040)
02-19-2017 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 110 by NoNukes
02-19-2017 1:41 PM


Re: Criticism vs. Sabotage and then there is Pizzagate
They actually hadn't been briefed beyond a mere mention as I recall, and since there was no evidence for it and it stinks so bad they should have withheld it. Actually although they now say parts of it have been validated but not the salactious parts, I wonder why all the headlines make it sound like some of those salactious parts have been validated. Headlines are full of fake news.
It's not my job to prove anything; Stuff like that is what has to be proved and should have been before it was published.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 110 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2017 1:41 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 118 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2017 5:23 PM Faith has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9489
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 114 of 710 (800044)
02-19-2017 3:19 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Faith
02-19-2017 1:20 PM


It's easily found Faith.
Sweden to Trump: What happened last night? - BBC News

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 1:20 PM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 115 of 710 (800046)
02-19-2017 3:32 PM
Reply to: Message 107 by Faith
02-19-2017 1:02 PM


Re: Pizzagate - There's something to it???
I can point out that John Podesta is not Hilary Clinton.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 1:02 PM Faith has not replied

  
caffeine
Member (Idle past 1024 days)
Posts: 1800
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


Message 116 of 710 (800056)
02-19-2017 4:43 PM
Reply to: Message 62 by Percy
02-18-2017 4:47 PM


As I said, the Rasmussen poll includes only people who intend to vote, while the Gallup poll does not. This could account for the difference. Trump is still very popular with his base, but his administration appears chaotic and disorganized, and Trump himself seems ignorant, impulsive, mean and inept. He has no experience in governing and it shows. To ignore it would be to ignore the elephant in the room, and so the media is not ignoring it.
Gallup's polls for Presidential approval include all adults; which means about a tenth of those being polled are expected to be resident aliens.
Rasmussen, by contrast, only polls registered voters; and uses a series of screening questions to determine whether they are likely voters. Only 'likely voters' are included in the results. I don't know what their screening questions are, but their polls using this methodology consistently swing more Republican than ones that don't.
That does not mean they're biased (well, it does, but they are trying to bias them in the direction of predicting the results of elections); since people who don't vote are more likely to lean Democratic than Republican (this is a consistent finding - some examples here if needed).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by Percy, posted 02-18-2017 4:47 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 117 of 710 (800062)
02-19-2017 5:21 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by Faith
02-19-2017 2:29 PM


Re: Pizzagate - There's something to it???
I merely claim that the language is very very strange and couldn't be referring to pizza, also can't imagine what "innocent" reference they could possibly have.
Your claim is not fact and you did not quote any email language so we cannot even say that your claim is about what is "obvious" as if that were an actual argument. I explicitly said that was your characterization of the reference to pizza that is not fact. Are you going to quit stalling and back up your claim or are you going to continue to insist that it is my job to support your claims.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 2:29 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 120 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 7:20 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 118 of 710 (800064)
02-19-2017 5:23 PM
Reply to: Message 113 by Faith
02-19-2017 2:33 PM


Re: Criticism vs. Sabotage and then there is Pizzagate
They actually hadn't been briefed beyond a mere mention as I recall, and since there was no evidence for it and it stinks so bad they should have withheld it.
So now the report has gone from fake news to being just news that you wish was not reported. Let's recall that your original statement is that they treated the story as if it were true when they clearly did no such thing.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 113 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 2:33 PM Faith has not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 119 of 710 (800071)
02-19-2017 7:09 PM
Reply to: Message 105 by Faith
02-19-2017 12:36 PM


Re: Criticism vs. Sabotage and then there is Pizzagate
There's a difference between suspecting something to be true and making up stuff for the clear purpose of destroying somebody. Fake news is the latter
But clearly the people that faked documents, photoshopped pictures and edited videos didn't suspect it was true - they were trying to present information in a deceptive way with the clear purpose of destroying Obama. So it was the latter and was fake news.
that's what they are doing to Trump.
No, Trump is doing much of the damage to himself. Although some information is falsely presented, most of it is reported in a factually accurate fashion.
When he called out CNN for fake news it was for treating that fake Russian "dossier" as true.
Did they? That's not what I saw CNN do. Please enlighten me.
I believe some of the things on your list are true, in fact I believe they've been proved to be true
Yes, I know. Some people believe Donald Trump paid hookers to pee on a bed. Belief is insufficient. When pressed in the Birther thread, your evidence wasn't really up to much, in my view. Why is the evidence against Trump's actions, as reported by 'Mainstream media' worse than the evidence presented against Obama? Since I'm not likely to persuade you that some of those claims against Obama are false, show me why the Trump's claims have less foundation than that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 105 by Faith, posted 02-19-2017 12:36 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 120 of 710 (800074)
02-19-2017 7:20 PM
Reply to: Message 117 by NoNukes
02-19-2017 5:21 PM


Re: Pizzagate - There's something to it???
I merely claim that the language is very very strange and couldn't be referring to pizza, also can't imagine what "innocent" reference they could possibly have.
Your claim is not fact and you did not quote any email language so we cannot even say that your claim is about what is "obvious" as if that were an actual argument. I explicitly said that was your characterization of the reference to pizza that is not fact. Are you going to quit stalling and back up your claim or are you going to continue to insist that it is my job to support your claims.
As often happens here, I tried to post a minimum of what I thought would be recognized as simple facts and find there is no such thing according to some here, who pepper their objection with all kinds of slimy personal innuendoes too. I believe I did say pretty clearly that I was only saying what I considered to be the basic facts and was waiting for Hyro to come back and fill in his observations since he said he'd come to the conclusion there was probably something to the pizzagate allegations, without saying what.
I did think everyone would be at least superficially aware of the language in the email if nothing else, and wouldn't dispute its strangeness. That should of course be the case but I forget, this is the alternative universe of EvC.
SO, I still want to wait and see what Hyro has to say.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by NoNukes, posted 02-19-2017 5:21 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 122 by Modulous, posted 02-19-2017 8:11 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 127 by NoNukes, posted 02-20-2017 12:48 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 139 by Percy, posted 02-20-2017 10:17 AM Faith has replied

  
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