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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Fake polls, fake news | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
America does not punish Christians, it punishes law breakers. That is what is so great about the US, you cannot get punished for your beliefs (at least before Trump & Fellow Travelers) but only for your behavior. The Roman Empire does not punish Christians, it punishes law breakers. That is what is so great about the Roman Empire, you cannot get punished for your beliefs .... [Just for refusing to worship Caesar] the RCC did not punish Bible believers or Jews, it punished law breakers. That is what is so great about the RCC, you cannot get punished for your beliefs .... [Just for being Jewish; or for translating the Bible into the vernacular, or for owning a Bible or refusing to affirm Transubstantiation, and they'll come up with new reasons when they bring back the Inquisition] Communist China does not punish Christians, it punishes law breakers. That is what is so great about Communist China, you cannot get punished for your beliefs .... [Just for meeting with other believers to worship and pray except in a state-controlled "Church"] tThe USSR didn't punish Christians, it punished law breakers. That is what is so great about the USSR, you cannot get punished for your beliefs .... [Just for meeting with other Christians to worship and pray] The Babylonian Empire didn't punish believers in God, it punished lawbreakers.; That is what is so great about the Babylonian Empikre, you couldn't get punished for your beliefs.... [just for refusing to bow down to a statue of Nebuchadnezzar] Islam does Ther must be lots more but I'm running out of steam. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 395 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Correct Faith. In each example it is behavior not beliefs that were punished even though so many of those were simply made up and not reality.
Thank you for supporting what everyone has been telling you. AbE:But again, you really need to check actual history. Islam did not punish Christians and still does not punish Christians in most cases. Babylon did not punish people who believed in God, in fact they welcomed them into their society. That was one of the major threads in much of the Old Testament, the fact that so many Jews had become assimilated into Babylonians society and did not want to move back to the barbaric Judah and Israel. Edited by jar, : see AbE:
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xongsmith Member Posts: 2578 From: massachusetts US Joined: Member Rating: 6.8
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Jar observes:
Islam did not punish Christians and still does not punish Christians in most cases. In fact, who was it that raised a huge amount of their own money to repair the vandalized Jewish cemeteries recently? The muslim community. And why is refusing to bake a cake on the same level as getting eaten by lions in the Colosseum for refusing to recant your religion? SMH- xongsmith, 5.7d
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frako Member (Idle past 306 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Qur'an 29:45-49 Surah Al-Ankabut (The Spider)
Recite what is sent of the Book by inspiration to thee and establish Regular Prayer: for Prayer restrains from shameful and unjust deeds; and remembrance of Allah is the greatest (thing in life) without doubt. And Allah knows the (deeds) that ye do. And dispute ye not with the People of the Book except with means better (than mere disputation) unless it be with those of them who inflict wrong (and injury): but say "We believe in the Revelation which has come down to us and in that which came down to you; Our Allah and your Allah is one; and it is to Him we bow (in Islam)." Qur'an 3:64-71 Surah Ale-'Imran (The Family of 'Imran) Say: "O people of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: that we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with Him; that we erect not from among ourselves Lords and patrons other than Allah." If then they turn back say: "Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah's will)." Ye people of the Book! why dispute ye about Abraham when the Law and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Have ye no understanding? Thers planty in the quoran about not harming jews and chrisitans unless they do harm to others. But in the end it dosent matter the bible also says dont kill and there have been countless deaths in the name of god. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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jar Member (Idle past 395 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
xongsmith writes: And why is refusing to bake a cake on the same level as getting eaten by lions in the Colosseum for refusing to recant your religion? Well, even though I did not make that comparison it is a great question. But in addition, that's another of those kinda/sorta/almost/notquite true tales. During the period when that happened refusing to recognize the Emperor as a God got you et regardless of the reason. All that was required of the Christians of the period was common courtesy. When in Rome do as the Romans do. But again, all that was covered in the Bible stories in 2Kings 5:
quote: The issue for the Christians was not a matter of obedience to what the Bible says but rather as is so often the case, ignorance of what the Bible says. Had they known the story of Naaman they would have known that they would be forgiven for acknowledging the claims of Rome.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
So what? We know the Koran contradicts itself. It's nice to the Jews when Mohammed was trying to convert them. When they refused he murdered them and advocated continuing to murder them.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Gosh aren't Muslims NICE? Sure, if you ignore all the other things they advocate about murdering people. I know those videos are too much to watch but there's one where Imam after Imam preaches death to the infidel in one way or another, to Europe, to the Jews etc.
I didn't say punishment in America iks on a par with it in any of the rest of the list, I was OF COURSE showing the principle of the thing. It could get way worse if the Left gets its way. You fail to understand that doing anything to legitimize a gay marriage is the same as being asked to renounce your religion.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
So what? We know the Koran contradicts itself. It's nice to the Jews when Mohammed was trying to convert them. When they refused he murdered them and advocated continuing to murder them. Taking your statement at face value ... that would make the Koran even more anti-Semitic than Martin Luther. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000
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Rrhain Member Posts: 6351 From: San Diego, CA, USA Joined: |
Faith responds to me:
quote: The only people who can "validate" a marriage are the people directly involved in the ceremony: The two people getting married and any officiant performing a ceremony over it. People who rent furniture, make food, sell flowers, etc. are not "validating" the marriage. They have no connection to the marriage at all. They're not being asked to participate in the ceremony.
quote: Your continued avoidance of the very simple questions just makes you look like a fool who knows that her answer doesn't actually rise to the level of being coherent.
quote: But renting furniture, a hall, making food, selling flowers, etc., none of that "legitimizes" the marriage. You're not participating in the ceremony any more than a car salesman is involved in the driver's subsequent drunk driving or a school is involved with the student's subsequent use of the knowledge given.
quote: No, it isn't. You act like there's some sort of special wedding fondant that cannot be used for anything else. I used to be a cake decorator, Faith. There is no difference between a wedding cake and a birthday cake. Well, except for maybe price. Some unscrupulous bakers and florists will charge you more if you tell them that you're buying their products for a wedding. It's still the exact same thing as what you would be buying otherwise, but they'll charge you 30% more. So no, a wedding cake is not a "very special custom service." It's a cake with a sweetened covering and some decorations, just like any other cake.
quote: If they can do it for a birthday, they can do it for a wedding. There is no difference.
quote: Nope. There's nothing special about the arrangement of flowers that can only be done for a wedding. The flowers don't know what they've been cut for. The wire doesn't understand why it's holding the flowers together. The foam doesn't understand what the stems are being used for.
quote: I used to do photography, too, Faith. There is no special film for weddings. The camera doesn't understand what it's taking a picture of. Light doesn't behave differently because there are two women wearing white dresses.
quote: Then they are free to not open their businesses to the public. They can be private contractors and thus pick and choose their clients. It's why if you want your picture taken, Glamour Shots at the mall cannot tell you no while Anne Geddes can.
quote: You don't seem to understand what the word "punished" means. Nobody is being punished for being Christian. They are being punished for violating the law. Do you get a religious exemption from the law, Faith?
quote: Says who? Certainly not the Bible. Have you forgotten the Loving v. Virginia case? The lower courts ruled against the couple precisely because god created the races separate and did not intend for them to mix.
quote: But if someone's religious proclivities prohibited that, would they be justified in denying interracial couples? Because it just happened down in Louisiana, Faith. A government official refused to sign the marriage license for an interracial couple citing their religious beliefs. Were they justified in doing so? Does the law allow people to claim a religious exemption to the law when it comes to equal treatment on the basis of race? If not, then why do you think you get to have one on the basis of sexual orientation? This is how we know that this isn't about your god, Faith, and all about your political correctness. You're PC enough to despise being thought of as racist... ...and PC enough to relish being thought of as a homophobe.
quote: Did you just pull the "some of my best friends are black" argument?
quote: Partially. I'm looking for details, Faith. How does providing a cake "validate" anything the customer decides to use it for?Rrhain Thank you for your submission to Science. Your paper was reviewed by a jury of seventh graders so that they could look for balance and to allow them to make up their own minds. We are sorry to say that they found your paper "bogus," specifically describing the section on the laboratory work "boring." We regret that we will be unable to publish your work at this time. Minds are like parachutes. Just because you've lost yours doesn't mean you can use mine.
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Rrhain Member Posts: 6351 From: San Diego, CA, USA Joined: |
Faith writes:
quote: Nope. The law doesn't care what your "point of view" is. Do you think you have a religious exemption to the law?Rrhain Thank you for your submission to Science. Your paper was reviewed by a jury of seventh graders so that they could look for balance and to allow them to make up their own minds. We are sorry to say that they found your paper "bogus," specifically describing the section on the laboratory work "boring." We regret that we will be unable to publish your work at this time. Minds are like parachutes. Just because you've lost yours doesn't mean you can use mine.
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Adminnemooseus Administrator Posts: 3974 Joined: |
See subtitle.
If someone wishes to pursue the "Fake polls, fake new" theme in greater depth, please start a new topic. AdminnemooseusOr something like that. |
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Percy Member Posts: 22394 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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The most recent jobs report was very positive, and Trump tweeted enthusiastically about it: "Great news. We are only just beginning. Together, we are going to #MAGA [Make America Great Again]!"
But up until his inauguration Trump dismissed the job reports as "totally fiction." See a list of the many times he has deprecated the jobs report as meaningless: 19 times Trump called jobs numbers ‘fake’ before they made him look good Once again Trump makes clear that his definition of fake news is any report not favorable to him. Whether its true or not (and so far the evidence is that it *is* true when it's from a major news outlet like the New York Times, Washington Post, ABC, NBC, CBS, etc.) doesn't matter to him. He's a propagandist of the first rank. --Percy
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1405 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
As posted in Message 338:
Ones at the bottom are less to un- reliable, at the top more reliable. Left side is left leaning, right side is right leaning. so looney-bin left is lower left while looney-bin right is lower right Now I agree that the lower left are unreliable and tend towards fake headlines that are not supported in the body of the article and to articles that overstate the case. ALL news is questionable, ALL polls are questionable, but some are way more questionable than others, and it is the duty of the READER to fact check articles and polls before posting them. Especially if they are from the bottom half and the left or right 25%. Data analysis for instance shows that people who watch Faux Noise Nutwerk (FNN) are worse informed about current and world events than people who do not watch ANY news. In terms of polls, we only need to consider that FNN polling the highest viewer rating of the major networks, but they are the ONLY network watched by conservatives, while the others are middle or left leaning and they divide up the remainder of the viewing public. For instance it appears from the numbers, that combining CNN and MSNBC numbers they would beat FNN. This would be similar to an election with one conservative candidate against a couple of liberal candidates dividing up the majority votes. Like a 40-30-30 split or a 40-35-25 split. And there are some structural factors involved as well. Visit any hotel or motel and see what is the default channel on the TV. Doctors offices and hospitals, same. When you stand in the middle of a swamp of misinformation and call the rest of the world fake, that is fake news. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) |
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
To the OP, "fake news" means news with a specific purpose of making Trump look bad. Similar PC is only applicable to folks on the left.
This is exactly the kind of double-think that is described in Orwell's 1984, namely language that makes it impossible to legitimately criticize one political side, while simultaneously dropping bombs on the left by conflating them with communists or fascists as the whim presents itself. Well given that there are several threads designed to accomplish this very purpose, it is clear that this thread won't be missed. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000 |
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Percy Member Posts: 22394 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
No evidence of fake or false news by the mainstream media was identified in this thread. Obviously Trump's accusations of "fake news" only apply to news not favorable to him.
Concerning polls, a recent Gallup poll had Trump at his lowest approval rating yet of 37%, and the Rasmussen poll that tracks a different demographic group has tracked the Gallup poll, dropping to 45% at roughly the same time. Trump's approval rating is slowly recovering from his disastrous last week - yesterday Gallup was at 39% and Rasmussen was at 50%. There seems nothing fake nor fraudulent about either poll. --Percy
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