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Author Topic:   Atheism Cannot Rationally Explain Morals.
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 802 of 1006 (806940)
04-29-2017 12:16 PM
Reply to: Message 801 by ringo
04-29-2017 12:00 PM


Re: Evolutionists can not explain morals
ringo writes:
Faith writes:
We are never to give aid to haters of God or his people.
On the contrary, we are to give aid especially to the ones we perceive as enemies.
Which was the important point found in Luke 4.
Luke 4 writes:
23 And he said unto them, Ye will surely say unto me this proverb, Physician, heal thyself: whatsoever we have heard done in Capernaum, do also here in thy country.
24 And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.
25 But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land;
26 But unto none of them was Elias sent, save unto Sarepta, a city of Sidon, unto a woman that was a widow.
27 And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian.
28 And all they in the synagogue, when they heard these things, were filled with wrath,
The Jews, like many Christians today, thought they were God's people. Jesus was telling them that that was fantasy.
Muslims and atheists and agnostics and Satanists and Hindus and Buddhists and Taoists and animists and Druids and all other people are God's chosen people.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 801 by ringo, posted 04-29-2017 12:00 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 804 by Davidjay, posted 04-29-2017 10:10 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 806 of 1006 (806957)
04-29-2017 10:30 PM
Reply to: Message 804 by Davidjay
04-29-2017 10:10 PM


Re: Evolutionists can not explain morals
David, once again you are simply posting utter nonsense that has no relation to the topic.
Davidjay writes:
Gods chosen people are those that choose God, choose Jesus or choose love.
An absurd bumper sticker slogan that has no0 worth or meaning and is certainly not supported by what the Bible says as I quoted.
Davidjay writes:
The Lord determines their situation and judges righteously in mercy for those that have chosen mercifully.
It doesnt appear you have mercy for others, so might reconsider the anger in which you speak and try to accuse the Lord's people and the Lord Himself.
Which of course contradicts what you said above and in fact i quoted. You may think you are "the Lord's people" but Jesus said you are wrong.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 804 by Davidjay, posted 04-29-2017 10:10 PM Davidjay has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 820 of 1006 (806995)
04-30-2017 8:58 AM
Reply to: Message 809 by Dredge
04-30-2017 12:43 AM


Dredge writes:
If a human believes that he is created by God, then it makes sense to conclude that the God who made everything and knows everything, will also know what is morally right and wrong, It also makes sense that this God will let humans know what is right and wrong.
But the Bible says that humans do not need God to determine what is right or wrong and in fact says that at times humans need to remind God what is right and wrong and that God does not know everything.
Genesis 3 writes:
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:
Genesis 18 writes:
20 And the Lord said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;
21 I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.
22 And the men turned their faces from thence, and went toward Sodom: but Abraham stood yet before the Lord.
23 And Abraham drew near, and said, Wilt thou also destroy the righteous with the wicked?
24 Peradventure there be fifty righteous within the city: wilt thou also destroy and not spare the place for the fifty righteous that are therein?
25 That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?
26 And the Lord said, If I find in Sodom fifty righteous within the city, then I will spare all the place for their sakes.
27 And Abraham answered and said, Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the Lord, which am but dust and ashes:
28 Peradventure there shall lack five of the fifty righteous: wilt thou destroy all the city for lack of five? And he said, If I find there forty and five, I will not destroy it.
29 And he spake unto him yet again, and said, Peradventure there shall be forty found there. And he said, I will not do it for forty's sake.
30 And he said unto him, Oh let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak: Peradventure there shall thirty be found there. And he said, I will not do it, if I find thirty there.
31 And he said, Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the Lord: Peradventure there shall be twenty found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for twenty's sake.
32 And he said, Oh let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak yet but this once: Peradventure ten shall be found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for ten's sake.
33 And the Lord went his way, as soon as he had left communing with Abraham: and Abraham returned unto his place.
God needed to go Walk About to find out what was happening and Abraham had to remind God about what is moral and how God should behave like God.
Sure, other parts of the Bible do say that God does know everything but that's what is so interesting about the Bible. It is filled with all the errors, omissions and contradictions that are common to all stores written by humans; particularly when it is an anthology of anthologies written by people who are trying to express entirely different concepts.
That's why the God described in Genesis 1 is so different than the God described in Genesis 2&3.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 809 by Dredge, posted 04-30-2017 12:43 AM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 821 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 9:44 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 823 of 1006 (807019)
04-30-2017 11:09 AM
Reply to: Message 821 by Davidjay
04-30-2017 9:44 AM


Re: Atheists/Evolutionists can not explain morality
Davidjay writes:
They go hand in hand, and besides this is an evolutionist board, so the topic and discussion HERE should be about why evolutionists and atheists can not explain morality.
Once again you simply tell lies. Morals have been explained and explained to you several times in this very thread and you are simply continuing your dishonesty when you claim otherwise.
Your posts show that obviously you have no morals since you constantly lie.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 821 by Davidjay, posted 04-30-2017 9:44 AM Davidjay has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 839 of 1006 (807155)
05-01-2017 7:45 AM
Reply to: Message 835 by Dredge
05-01-2017 4:19 AM


Re: Let's start over.
Dredge writes:
If I were an atheist, I would consider life meaningless, morality meaningless and beliefs meaningless and actions meaningless and emotions meaningless.
Which is why everyone here pities you and we hope you get better soon.
There are better drugs that will help you more than your chosen drug of religiosity.
Edited by jar, : the word "we" somehow got left out.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 835 by Dredge, posted 05-01-2017 4:19 AM Dredge has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 860 of 1006 (807389)
05-02-2017 9:00 PM
Reply to: Message 858 by Taq
05-02-2017 11:05 AM


Re: Evolutionists can not explain morals
Taq writes:
This is the scary result of someone ignoring their own sense of morality in favor of blind obedience to a man made religion.
And ignoring what the Bible says as well.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 858 by Taq, posted 05-02-2017 11:05 AM Taq has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 878 of 1006 (807448)
05-03-2017 8:10 AM
Reply to: Message 869 by Dredge
05-03-2017 1:48 AM


Even if your God does exist the Bible says we should question Her morals.
Dredge writes:
If my God doesn't exist, then I'm talking complete nonsense and my God's morality (and thus, mine) is as meaningless as anyone else's.
That's not quite right. The Bible says that humans have the same capabilities as God to determine what is right or wrong and that sometimes we need to remind God to behave morally.
But morality is really subjective. There is no "Objective Morality" to be found in the Bible. In one place it says "Thou shalt not kill" and the in another story the God character says "Go kill them all, even their cattle."
Now even if there might be some justification to kill them all, it is never presented and really unlikely that the cattle committed any major transgressions.
Morality, whether among theists or atheists always involves a societal consensus. That does not make any morals meaningless but rather actually gives them meaning. Where so called Biblical Morality is based solely on "God said it" the morality that exists in reality is based on "We agreed with it". The former is imposed by a tyrant; the latter is self-imposed by consent.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 869 by Dredge, posted 05-03-2017 1:48 AM Dredge has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 907 of 1006 (807738)
05-05-2017 7:37 AM
Reply to: Message 905 by Dredge
05-05-2017 7:27 AM


Dredge writes:
Jim Jones initiallly used the cloak of Christianity in his "ministry", but it turns out he was a Communist!
While Jim Jones may or may not have been a Communist just like Jesus, he definitely was a Christian while Jesus unlike Jim Jones was never a Christian.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 905 by Dredge, posted 05-05-2017 7:27 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 910 by Dredge, posted 05-05-2017 7:57 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 912 of 1006 (807743)
05-05-2017 8:04 AM
Reply to: Message 910 by Dredge
05-05-2017 7:57 AM


Yup. Lots of poor examples of Christians out there. But then no movement has been more effective at Genocide than Christianity although the US is certainly pretty close.
Christians are good and bad just like any other segment of the population.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 910 by Dredge, posted 05-05-2017 7:57 AM Dredge has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(2)
Message 946 of 1006 (808028)
05-08-2017 7:13 AM
Reply to: Message 943 by Dredge
05-08-2017 3:29 AM


Re: Evolutionists can not explain morals
Dredge writes:
Good point - just look at the situation where Hitler decided the morally correct solution was to murder 6 million Jews. And also consider the Khmer Rouge, who accessed the situation and thought the right thing to do was to kill 5 millions Cambodians. Evidently, morality can be whatever you want it to be; you just make it up as you go along.
You are almost correct. Morality certainly is whatever a society decides is moral but it's not just made up as you go along. A societies morality does get passed from generation to generation but also evolves and changes and is effected by selection.
This has been explained to you several times by several people in this very thread.
Since it has been explained the topic "Evolutionists can not explain morals" has been refuted. Any future claim that Evolutionists can not explain morals deserves only ridicule.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 943 by Dredge, posted 05-08-2017 3:29 AM Dredge has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 995 of 1006 (808695)
05-12-2017 9:30 AM
Reply to: Message 989 by Dredge
05-12-2017 4:50 AM


Re: Evolutionists can not explain morals
Dredge writes:
To illustrate this point, if there were no religions, a great many people would still consider homosexuality to be immoral; likewise, many people would still consider abortion immoral.
Which of course is fine. No one cares whether you consider something immoral. You are perfectly free to feel that way.
What people object to is you trying to impose the concept of legality rather than morality.
Thank God legality and morality are not synonyms.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 989 by Dredge, posted 05-12-2017 4:50 AM Dredge has not replied

  
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