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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House The Trump Presidency

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Author Topic:   The Trump Presidency
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 763 of 4573 (805909)
04-21-2017 12:51 PM


Trump's Korea Policy
Trump does not appear to have a policy, but he does seem to be doing a pretty good job of blundering about.
Last week he made statements to the effect that he had learned from China that the Korean peninsula used to be a part of China. Between that and his misstatements regarding the USS Carl Vincent heading to the area when the carrier was actually heading in the opposite direction, Trump has managed to put America first in comedy.
quote:
Not North Korea, Korea. And you know, you’re talking about thousands of years and many wars. And Korea actually used to be a part of China
I would prefer that Trump actually do something funny and harmless like other presidents have done, like throwing up on the Japanese Prime Minister's shoes. Blunders of this nature are somewhat unsettling.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

Replies to this message:
 Message 764 by LamarkNewAge, posted 04-28-2017 9:05 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 767 of 4573 (807287)
05-02-2017 1:27 AM


Trump's musing about former president Andrew Jackson
During a recent interview Trump suggested that people don't ask the question Why was there a civil war. He then claimed that Jackson, who died in 1845, 16 years before the first state seceded from the union, who was also a slave owner, was a gentle man who was angered about the upcoming war. Trump claims that Jackson, had he come later would have stopped the Civil War.
On what planet could any of Trump's claims be the least bit meaningful.
Trump:
quote:
He was really angry that he saw what was happening with regard to the Civil War," Trump said of Jackson. "He said, 'There's no reason for this.'
quote:
People don't realize, you know, the Civil War, if you think about it, why?" Trump said in an interview with The Washington Examiner that also aired on Sirius XM radio. "People don't ask that question, but why was there the Civil War? Why could that one not have been worked out
Is Trump serious? Is he completely unaware of all that's been said, written, sung about, celebrated, and denigrated about exactly the question he is asking?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

Replies to this message:
 Message 768 by JonF, posted 05-02-2017 9:02 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied
 Message 769 by PaulK, posted 05-02-2017 3:25 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 778 of 4573 (807551)
05-03-2017 9:37 PM


Tillerson on "Values"
quote:
In advocating for America’s interests abroad, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson said today that American values must be separate from American foreign policy, even as they guide it.
Guiding all our foreign policy actions are our fundamental values -- our values around freedom, human dignity, the way people are treated, he said. Those are our values. Those are not our policies, Tillerson told State Department employees in a speech today.
What does it meant to have values which are not actual policy? Isn't acting that way what we mean by paying "lip service". Does someone want to take a stab at explaining why this is a good thing?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 789 of 4573 (808295)
05-09-2017 7:04 PM


Trump fires Comey!!!
I expected that whatever the outcome of the election, Comey would not last long in the office, but he actually held on far longer than I expected.
The administration is claiming that the firing is based on Comey's handling of the investigation of the Hilary email server incident. Comey recently made substantial miss-statements regarding emails he found on the server. He claimed that Weiner’s wife had forward hundreds of thousands of emails to her husband, but apparently nothing like that happened. Of course, that raises the question of what the hell Comey was investigating during the final weeks of the campaign that he felt had to be released publicly.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

Replies to this message:
 Message 790 by 1.61803, posted 05-10-2017 3:57 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied
 Message 791 by Chiroptera, posted 05-11-2017 8:39 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 801 of 4573 (808762)
05-12-2017 3:36 PM
Reply to: Message 799 by 1.61803
05-12-2017 10:07 AM


So we now have 3 firings of people who were directly responsible for investigating Trump: Sally Yate, Preet Bahara James Comey.
The early word put out by Trump's surrogates was that the Comey firing was based on Comey's handling of the Clinton email scandal. Based on the timing, and Trump's praise for Comey, and on Trump's own statements about a lack of interest in pursuing Clinton, the 'email' excuse made little sense.
Now Trump has admitted that the primary reason behind Comey's firing was the Russia investigation, something that was actually strongly hinted at in Trump's firing letter.
Still, it appears based on Trump's poll numbers, that Trump still has the support of well north of eighty percent of his base. I would estimate that such support would have to drop down into Nixon-Watergate territory (around 50-60 percent) before Republicans would have the sack to take Trump on. In my mind, absent catching a close campaign adviser 'riding dirty', that won't happen.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 799 by 1.61803, posted 05-12-2017 10:07 AM 1.61803 has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 821 of 4573 (809172)
05-16-2017 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 816 by Percy
05-16-2017 8:05 AM


Re: When does all the winning begin?
What we have is an incompetent and autocratic White House unfamiliar with handling the reins of government.
Trump is a narcissist and an idiot. He literally does not know any better, and his personality is such that he seems not be able to seek help. Further, he seems to have no sense of how unprepared he really is. Unfortunately, he's also, quite literally the most powerful man in the world.
So Trump cannot help but f' up. Mistakes like these and even larger ones are going to continue to happen. Those screw ups are funny when he is making mistakes involving things like civil war history or how many electoral votes he won last November. Heck, even this Russia screw up is a minor snafu.[1]
What is less excusable is how the senior members of his party cover for his screw ups. Those folks actually do know better. Not a one of them is exercising the least bit of leadership because apparently no amount of Trump screw ups alienate the base, and most Republicans are in gerrymandered seats and only fear to lose in a primary rather than an actual election. Trump's popularity is still around 40%, meaning that only independents and democratic voters are showing the slightest doubt about the man.
It just doesn't end.
No, it does not end. I expect things will get worse.
ABE:
[1] Maybe a bigger snafu than I was thinking. Apparently, the intelligence at issue is something that one of our allies shared with us. The info was not ours to share. Still seeing lots of denial from Republicans like McConnell and Hatch.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 816 by Percy, posted 05-16-2017 8:05 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 823 by Chiroptera, posted 05-16-2017 5:08 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied
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NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 866 of 4573 (809952)
05-22-2017 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 865 by Diomedes
05-22-2017 11:15 AM


Re: Flynn to take the Fifth
And before someone chastises me for 'leftist tactics against the president', the above is a Fox News article.
Not that it matters. The idea that none of the newspapers, news sites, and tv news ever tell the truth is for shite.
Mike Flynn was not fired by two different presidents for no reason. Any one, fool or not, can see that.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 865 by Diomedes, posted 05-22-2017 11:15 AM Diomedes has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 867 by Tanypteryx, posted 05-22-2017 1:58 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 868 of 4573 (809978)
05-22-2017 2:57 PM


On Trump sharing intelligence info with Russia...
Can somebody make some sense out of this?
quote:
President Donald Trump sought to rebut claims Monday that he damaged Israeli intelligence capabilities by revealing highly classified information to Russian operatives earlier this month.
"Just so you understand, I never mentioned the word or the name Israel," Trump said ahead of a bilateral session with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.
CNN reports that they were told by the state department not to name the source of the intel even now, and they followed those instructions. Then Trump just blurts out the source in a public denial. Even if there were some leaks, doesn't presidential confirmation make things worse?
Surely I am missing something. But what?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

Replies to this message:
 Message 869 by jar, posted 05-22-2017 4:40 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 874 of 4573 (810281)
05-27-2017 12:45 AM
Reply to: Message 873 by jar
05-23-2017 8:54 PM


Re: Trump to retain a Private Attorney.
But what is even more interesting is it seems he also wants to appoint an attorney from the same firm to head FBI.
Lieberman withdrew from consideration today based on the conflict of interest you just described. I think that is what most lawyers would have done.
quote:
With your selection of Marc Kasowitz to represent you in the various investigations that have begun, I do believe it would be best to avoid any appearance of a conflict of interest," Lieberman wrote in a letter.
Lieberman is a senior counsel at the same firm at which Trump's lawyer is the senior partner.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 873 by jar, posted 05-23-2017 8:54 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 875 by jar, posted 05-27-2017 8:35 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 881 of 4573 (810879)
06-02-2017 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 879 by 1.61803
06-02-2017 11:28 AM


Re: Trump pulls the US out of Paris Climate agreement
Given that the agreement was entirely voluntary with no enforcement mechanism whatsoever, I think this announcement has the purpose of pushing other news off of the front page.
Oh look over there.... a pony!!!
Immensely preferable to a drone strike on a wedding party. Also I see where Trump created 70 coal jobs and is claiming to have created 1 million other jobs so far.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 879 by 1.61803, posted 06-02-2017 11:28 AM 1.61803 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 882 by jar, posted 06-02-2017 3:03 PM NoNukes has replied
 Message 886 by Percy, posted 06-03-2017 8:43 AM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 884 of 4573 (810893)
06-02-2017 7:21 PM
Reply to: Message 882 by jar
06-02-2017 3:03 PM


Re: Trump pulls the US out of Paris Climate agreement
Plus the US cannot legally bow out of the accord until at least 2020
True. All true. But of course you can still make statements like "I was elected to represent folks in West Virginia and not folks in Paris" right now, which I think is the entire point; Trump is just playing to the base.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 882 by jar, posted 06-02-2017 3:03 PM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 885 by Phat, posted 06-03-2017 12:32 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 887 of 4573 (810987)
06-03-2017 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 886 by Percy
06-03-2017 8:43 AM


Re: Trump pulls the US out of Paris Climate agreement
The jobs report that came out a couple days ago said that job growth in May slowed to 138,000. A number around 185,000 had been expected. In addition, the job numbers for March and April were revised sharply downward.
When does the winning stop?
Trumps claim of 1,000,000 jobs created was based on ADP reports which also claims that jobs grew by 253,000 in May. The official job creation numbers are about half of what ADP says.
I suppose Trump's claims are not exactly lying. Although they do reflect a bit of cherry picking.
ADP numbers:
Private sector job growth rebounds to ‘rip-roaring’ pace in May, ADP says - MarketWatch

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 886 by Percy, posted 06-03-2017 8:43 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 888 of 4573 (811479)
06-08-2017 5:55 PM


More of Trump's stupid tweeting
I am sure that Faith will find a way to blame this on the left. I don't see how, but...
Trump reverses course in Qatar call | CNN Politics
quote:
resident Donald Trump changed course on Qatar Wednesday, a day after praising a move by other Gulf nations to sever diplomatic relations with Doha, which hosts a US military base crucial to the fight against ISIS.
In a phone call with the Qatari Emir, Trump extended an olive branch, offering to help the parties resolve their differences by inviting them to a White House meeting if necessary. The outreach came as US officials told CNN they were observing increased Qatari military activity as the country placed its forces on the highest state of alert over fears of an military incursion.
Trump's phone call Wednesday made for a stark contrast to a series of tweets he sent Tuesday, in which he appeared to throw his weight behind the effort by Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, Bahrain and Egypt, along with Yemen, the Maldives and Libya, to ostracize Qatar.
In this case Trump makes public statements encouraging bunch of states to ostracize Qatar, seemingly forgetting about our own military base in Qatar. Later when it appears that his tweets are going to create instability in the region, he is forced to take action to recover from an international incident partially of his own making.
quote:
Trump's belated effort to calm the situation comes as the Qatari military has brought up 16 Leopard tanks out of storage in Doha and put the military on its highest alert out of fear that Saudi Arabia and others might attempt a military incursion.
On June 5, the Qatari Ministry of Defense transmitted a message to the governments of the UAE, Saudi Arabia and Bahrain, saying they would fire on any naval ships from those countries that enter into its waters, a US official said.
Trump's tweeting is going to get people killed. The administration has put out statements saying that Trump's tweets are not policy. I suppose that's means we should ignore direct statements from the president?
Trump's current rating is at 35 per cent approval and 57 percent disapproval, with something like 36% approval among independents. Yet something like 85 percent of all Republican voters think things are just peachy.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 890 of 4573 (811484)
06-08-2017 6:27 PM
Reply to: Message 889 by JonF
06-08-2017 6:23 PM


"White House sources" say he didn't know about the Al Udeid Air base. Critical to US operations from Afghanistan to North Africa.
Okay, so now we know the brand of stupidity involved.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 889 by JonF, posted 06-08-2017 6:23 PM JonF has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 891 of 4573 (811849)
06-12-2017 6:00 PM


Trump "working the room" at his first cabinet meeting
Trump started his first televised cabinet meeting by offering self-praise for his accomplishments to date. Among his claims was the boast that few presidents had passed as much legislation as he had. Of course, most folks know that Congress has yet to pass any major legislation.
Nothing newsworthy, there. Same old self-aggrandizing buffoonery we can read on Twitter on any given weekday.
But then Trump goes around the room getting cabinet members to chime in with their own (well over the top) words of praise. Pence does his sycophant impression with: being Trump's VP is "the greatest privilege of my life."
Priebus seemed to understand the farce he was participating in and offered this:
quote:
We thank you for the opportunity and blessing to serve your agenda.
I am guessing that Priebus won't be around much longer.
Only General Mattis managed to preserve some of his dignity, using his turn to praise the troops. But otherwise, the televised part of the meeting was pretty hilarious.
How did the televised spectacle end?
quote:
When it was over, reporters in the room asked questions of the president related to the ongoing Russia investigations. Trump answered, "Thank you," signaling his aides to usher the media out of the room.
I'd welcome any discussion from conservatives on why this meeting was not either a) creepy, or b) hilarious. Maybe something like, "Trump is just getting the real message out since the corrupt press won't laud the president about his wins?"
Ah, well, more late night fodder I guess.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

Replies to this message:
 Message 969 by NoNukes, posted 07-28-2017 11:13 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
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