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Author Topic:   The Totalitarian Leftist Tactics against the Right
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 646 of 960 (812262)
06-15-2017 4:25 PM
Reply to: Message 627 by Faith
06-15-2017 1:36 PM


Re: Who will be the first A-hole
...it expresses the shooter's point of view which subtly implies it was justified....
Actually, it implies no such thing.

Freedom is merely privilege extended, unless enjoyed by one and all. — Billy Bragg

This message is a reply to:
 Message 627 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 1:36 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 647 of 960 (812265)
06-15-2017 4:42 PM
Reply to: Message 642 by New Cat's Eye
06-15-2017 3:31 PM


Re: Hate speech
Cat's eye, your video is ridiculous. Do you accept that proposition that speeches like Clinton's are what caused the shooting yesterday?
This is exactly the kind of stuff I thought you meant. I couldn't ask for a better illustration of why your position is bogus.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 642 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 3:31 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 650 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 4:53 PM NoNukes has replied

  
vimesey
Member (Idle past 93 days)
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


(1)
Message 648 of 960 (812266)
06-15-2017 4:44 PM
Reply to: Message 644 by New Cat's Eye
06-15-2017 4:04 PM


Re: Hate speech
You get a choice in your religion and yet that is a protected class.
If everyone got a free choice in their religion, then there would be a widespread distribution between Muslim/Sikh/Hindu/Jewish/Christian/atheists etc amongst children of Christian families and similarly amongst the other religions. Are you claiming that's the case ?
I don't subscribe to prejudging people based on groups that they belong to - it is wrong to affiliate people with weakness just because of their race or sexual orientation.
I have seen Asian people punched in the face by a passing skinhead - I have seen gay people abused without defence by bigots - I have not seen white people punched for their colour or straight people abused for their sexuality. I think people should be afforded extra protection if they are receiving extra abuse.
Put on a MAGA hat and go walk through Harlem and then come back and tell me if you felt vulnerable or not.
Are you prepared to claim that, in the states, Republicans suffer as much abuse/prejudice/bigotry/violence as black people ?
Sure, but what about calling for violence out of hatred?
They're Republicans so that doesn't matter?
That's wrong - but it's not hate speech. The disinction is important.
Edited by vimesey, : No reason given.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 644 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 4:04 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 651 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 4:54 PM vimesey has replied
 Message 652 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 4:58 PM vimesey has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 649 of 960 (812267)
06-15-2017 4:46 PM
Reply to: Message 644 by New Cat's Eye
06-15-2017 4:04 PM


Re: Hate speech
Sure, but what about calling for violence out of hatred?
That would be hate speech. How about some examples of folks in the media or politicians actually doing that. I'm not going to claim that nobody does that, but if you are going to tar "the Left" or "liberals" in that way, I expect you to show some mainstream calls for violence.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Not really, it is a theory that is imposed on nature so consistently that you think you are observing it. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 644 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 4:04 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 654 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 5:00 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 650 of 960 (812268)
06-15-2017 4:53 PM
Reply to: Message 647 by NoNukes
06-15-2017 4:42 PM


Re: Hate speech
Do you accept that proposition that speeches like Clinton's are what caused the shooting yesterday?
No, I've already said I don't.
But if the leftists don't want to be hypocrites, then they should admit that according to their own logic it does.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 647 by NoNukes, posted 06-15-2017 4:42 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 667 by NoNukes, posted 06-15-2017 5:56 PM New Cat's Eye has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1464 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 651 of 960 (812269)
06-15-2017 4:54 PM
Reply to: Message 648 by vimesey
06-15-2017 4:44 PM


Re: Hate speech
I guess you missed the incident of the white guy being dragged out of his car and beaten by five black men for supposedly being a Trump supporter, which he wasn't, he was merely white. Or the mentally handicapped white guy who was kidnapped and tortured by four blacks for being white and a Trump supporter? you must be watching the wrong news sources.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 648 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 4:44 PM vimesey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 653 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 4:58 PM Faith has replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 652 of 960 (812270)
06-15-2017 4:58 PM
Reply to: Message 648 by vimesey
06-15-2017 4:44 PM


Re: Hate speech
If everyone got a free choice in their religion, then there would be a widespread distribution between Muslim/Sikh/Hindu/Jewish/Christian/atheists etc amongst children of Christian families and similarly amongst the other religions. Are you claiming that's the case ?
Are you claiming that there is a widespread distribution between Democrats/Republicans/GreenParty/Independents amongst children of Democratic families?
I have not seen white people punched for their colour
There's all kinds of videos on youtube of Antifa doing exactly that...
All you have to do is call a white guy a Nazi first, then you're justified in assaulting them
Are you prepared to claim that, in the states, Republicans suffer as much abuse/prejudice/bigotry/violence as black people ?
As much? No, but a non-zero amount of vulnerability? Yes.
That's wrong - but it's not hate speech. The disinction is important.
I'm not seeing it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 648 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 4:44 PM vimesey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 656 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 5:10 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

  
vimesey
Member (Idle past 93 days)
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


Message 653 of 960 (812271)
06-15-2017 4:58 PM
Reply to: Message 651 by Faith
06-15-2017 4:54 PM


Re: Hate speech
Those are criminal assaults - I have been talking about hate speech.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 651 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 4:54 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 655 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 5:02 PM vimesey has replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 654 of 960 (812272)
06-15-2017 5:00 PM
Reply to: Message 649 by NoNukes
06-15-2017 4:46 PM


Re: Hate speech
How about some examples of folks in the media or politicians actually doing that. I'm not going to claim that nobody does that, but if you are going to tar "the Left" or "liberals" in that way, I expect you to show some mainstream calls for violence.
I'll pass, I don't have the time right now. But it's "leftists", not liberals.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 649 by NoNukes, posted 06-15-2017 4:46 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1464 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 655 of 960 (812273)
06-15-2017 5:02 PM
Reply to: Message 653 by vimesey
06-15-2017 4:58 PM


Re: Hate speech
But I was responding to this, which isn't hate speech:
I have seen Asian people punched in the face by a passing skinhead - I have seen gay people abused without defence by bigots - I have not seen white people punched for their colour or straight people abused for their sexuality.
And actually years ago -- in the seventies -- I once had to endure an abusive hate-filled speech by a gay rights advocate against straight people, saying we're all really homosexuals and should face up to it. We started out sympathetic to the cause and ended up in some other mood altogether.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 653 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 4:58 PM vimesey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 658 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 5:14 PM Faith has replied

  
vimesey
Member (Idle past 93 days)
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


Message 656 of 960 (812275)
06-15-2017 5:10 PM
Reply to: Message 652 by New Cat's Eye
06-15-2017 4:58 PM


Re: Hate speech
Are you claiming that there is a widespread distribution between Democrats/Republicans/GreenParty/Independents amongst children of Democratic families?
Way more so than amongst religious backgrounds, yes. And I note that you don't deny my rebuttal of your point.
There's all kinds of videos on youtube of Antifa doing exactly that...
All you have to do is call a white guy a Nazi first, then you're justified in assaulting them
There are some examples of that - are you claiming the preponderance of racist assaults against white people is greater than against black/Asian people in our societies ?
As much? No, but a non-zero amount of vulnerability? Yes.
In my view, it doesn't require Republicans to suffer a zero amount of vulnerability in order to protect black people/gays etc.
I'm not seeing it.
Because if we are to limit freedom of speech, to protect vulnerable segments of society, it is right that we limit those limitations. Hence hate speech should be a very specific definition.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 652 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 4:58 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 671 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-15-2017 9:09 PM vimesey has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1464 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 657 of 960 (812277)
06-15-2017 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 638 by PaulK
06-15-2017 2:03 PM


Re: Hate speech
Wow do you have a low threshold for hate. Wow. How Leftist can you get?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 638 by PaulK, posted 06-15-2017 2:03 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 660 by PaulK, posted 06-15-2017 5:17 PM Faith has replied

  
vimesey
Member (Idle past 93 days)
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


Message 658 of 960 (812279)
06-15-2017 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 655 by Faith
06-15-2017 5:02 PM


Re: Hate speech
But I was responding to this, which isn't hate speech:
Indeed (as to the punching part, in any event), but that was an example of why black/Asian people are especially abused in our society, and hence worthwhile offering protected class status for hate speech. Assault is criminal under any circumstances.
Edited by vimesey, : No reason given.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 655 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 5:02 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 659 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 5:16 PM vimesey has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1464 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 659 of 960 (812280)
06-15-2017 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 658 by vimesey
06-15-2017 5:14 PM


Re: Hate speech
OK how about the expressed opinion that white people are the cause of all the problems in the world? How about the bullying of a kid for being blond and "looking like Trump" because he's blond?
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 658 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 5:14 PM vimesey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 663 by vimesey, posted 06-15-2017 5:24 PM Faith has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 660 of 960 (812281)
06-15-2017 5:17 PM
Reply to: Message 657 by Faith
06-15-2017 5:13 PM


Re: Hate speech
The contempt underlying it - contempt for the truth as well as individuals - is a pretty good indication of hate. Let's face it proof is a pretty good justification for criticism. But apparently not good enough when you are the target.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 657 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 5:13 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 662 by Faith, posted 06-15-2017 5:23 PM PaulK has replied

  
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