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Author Topic:   Trilobites, Mountains and Marine Deposits - Evidence of a flood?
JonF
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Posts: 3969
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 511 of 518 (813210)
06-24-2017 10:51 AM
Reply to: Message 510 by Faith
06-24-2017 9:55 AM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old

Trilobites of the Burgess Shale, Canada

quote:
Unlike Chengjiang, where only four species of trilobites are known, 13 genera of trilobites have been recorded in the Burgess Shale, though trilobites make up a small percentage of the total fauna.

Four samples are shown.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 510 by Faith, posted 06-24-2017 9:55 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
RAZD
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Posts: 19085
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.5


(2)
Message 512 of 518 (813214)
06-24-2017 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 508 by Faith
06-24-2017 8:53 AM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old
THE POINT IS that if the different species of trilobites are found at large distances from each other that would fit with the Flood scenario.

You can't make up reality Faith.

Different species of trilobites are found in the same digs, but at different elevations.

quote:
Trilobites of the Wheeler Shale, Utah

The U-Dig Quarry, west of Delta, Utah.

Western Utah is one of the best-known Cambrian fossil localities in the world. The Wheeler Shale and Marjum Formation, strata of Middle Cambrian age, exhibit various exposures throughout the House Range and nearby mountain ranges west of the town of Delta, Utah. The Wheeler Shale is named for a major feature in the House Range, the Wheeler Amphitheater. The Wheeler Shale contains interbeds of shaley limestone, mudstone, and thin platy limestone. Much of the Wheeler Shale is not particularly fossiliferous, but certain layers contain abundant trilobites and other shelly fossils. The Wheeler Shale also is known for a diverse biota of soft-bodied fossils, including many of the same taxa found in the Burgess Shale.

The most famous Wheeler Shale fossil is the trilobite Elrathia kingi; so common at some sites that specimens are commercially quarried and are made into novelty accessories, as well as sold to collectors and institutions all over the world. However, Elrathia is just one of about fifteen trilobite genera of the Wheeler Shale. Bathyuriscus fimbriatus is also relatively common at certain sites. Even more abundant are several species of agnostid trilobites, such a Peronopsis interstricta. These are typically less than a centimeter in length. Here are eight representative species of the Wheeler Shale:

Elrathia kingi
PTYCHOPARIIDA
Family Alokistocaridae
Peronopsis interstricta
AGNOSTIDA
Family Peronopsidae
Modocia typicalis
PTYCHOPARIIDA
Family Marjumiidae
Asaphiscus wheeleri
PTYCHOPARIIDA
Family Asaphiscidae
Bolaspidella housensis
PTYCHOPARIIDA
Family Menomoniidae
Jenkinsonia varga
PTYCHOPARIIDA
Family Alokistocaridae
Modocia laevinucha
PTYCHOPARIIDA
Family Marjumiidae
Bathyuriscus fimbriatus
CORYNEXOCHIDA
Family Dolichometopidae

It is notable that the trilobite fauna of the Wheeler Shale, being a Middle Cambrian locality, is dominated by Ptychopariida, Corynexochida, and Agnostida. In addition to trilobites, there were other species of arachnomorph (trilobite-like clade) arthropods such as Naraoia. These trilobite-like arthropods demonstrate that the group from which trilobites arose was itself successful and diverse, though being uncalcified, are only preserved under exceptional conditions, such as at exceptional lagerstätten such as the Burgess Shale and Chengjiang. Because the Burgess Shale was the first lagerstätte with such exceptional preservation, other sites with similar preservation are referred to as "Burgess Shale type" lagerstätten. This level of preservation occurs only infrequently in the Wheeler Shale.


It only took a simple google search to find this information, and this was the top of the list.

quote:
Arachnomorpha is a subdivision or clade of Arthropoda, comprising the monophyletic group formed by the trilobites, other great appendage arthropods and trilobite-like families (Helmetiidae, Xandarellidae, Naraoiidae, Liwiidae, and Tegopeltidae), and a diverse sister clade including the chelicerates.[1][2] ...

And there is a lot more to the fauna and flora found in the layers with trilobites, all showing mature marine ecosystems functioning for multiple generations.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 508 by Faith, posted 06-24-2017 8:53 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 514 by Faith, posted 06-26-2017 10:49 PM RAZD has responded

  
edge
Member
Posts: 4002
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 513 of 518 (813278)
06-25-2017 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 510 by Faith
06-24-2017 9:55 AM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old
Actually, no, that has NOT been shown.

I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Both Olenellus and Glossopleura are found in the same area (the GC, for instance), but are never found in the same layer, with Olenellus always being lower.

The Time Scale illustrations make them look to be in close proximity but that is just an illusion.

Again, I have no idea what you are trying to say. Jon was discussing the map location of trilobite fossils. The relative age is always the same with Olenellus in older sediments. Just because they are close in two dimensions does not mean that they are of the same age.

You need to supply the information of where the fossils of each species have been found.

In a relative age sense, you have been told. One is older than the other.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 510 by Faith, posted 06-24-2017 9:55 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 515 by Faith, posted 06-26-2017 10:52 PM edge has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 26449
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 514 of 518 (813355)
06-26-2017 10:49 PM
Reply to: Message 512 by RAZD
06-24-2017 11:56 AM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old
Different species of trilobites are found in the same digs, but at different elevations

All I wanted to know was how far from each other they are horizontally. Being at different elevations could mean one group directly above another group or it could mean at a different elevation but half a mile away horizontally -- or fifty feet or whatever.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 512 by RAZD, posted 06-24-2017 11:56 AM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 517 by RAZD, posted 06-27-2017 5:37 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 26449
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 515 of 518 (813356)
06-26-2017 10:52 PM
Reply to: Message 513 by edge
06-25-2017 10:22 AM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old
I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Both Olenellus and Glossopleura are found in the same area (the GC, for instance), but are never found in the same layer, with Olenellus always being lower

But as I just posted to RAZD, how often are they found directly above or below each other as versus some distance away horizontally?

Also although the same species is found in the same layer, how often are they found close together in their group versus scattered in the layer?

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by edge, posted 06-25-2017 10:22 AM edge has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 516 by edge, posted 06-26-2017 11:03 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
edge
Member
Posts: 4002
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 516 of 518 (813359)
06-26-2017 11:03 PM
Reply to: Message 515 by Faith
06-26-2017 10:52 PM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old
But as I just posted to RAZD, how often are they found directly above or below each other as versus some distance away horizontally?

I'm not sure what difference it makes. We are talking about the Bright Angel Shale in the Grand Canyon. I have no idea if they are stacked exactly in a vertical column. The section is what it is.

Also although the same species is found in the same layer, how often are they found close together in their group versus scattered in the layer?

Again, sounds irrelevant. I imagine both situations are common, but usually fossils are found in abundance near other fossils of the same kind. That's why fossil quarries are isolated occurrences. Not every part of a formation is productive.

Why do I get the impression you are on a hunting expedition?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 515 by Faith, posted 06-26-2017 10:52 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
RAZD
Member
Posts: 19085
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 517 of 518 (813388)
06-27-2017 5:37 AM
Reply to: Message 514 by Faith
06-26-2017 10:49 PM


Re: Reality is the earth is old, very very old
All I wanted to know was how far from each other they are horizontally. Being at different elevations could mean one group directly above another group or it could mean at a different elevation but half a mile away horizontally -- or fifty feet or whatever.

Irrelevant.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

This message is a reply to:
 Message 514 by Faith, posted 06-26-2017 10:49 PM Faith has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 518 by Pressie, posted 06-27-2017 9:00 AM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

  
Pressie
Member
Posts: 1802
From: Pretoria, SA
Joined: 06-18-2010
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 518 of 518 (813408)
06-27-2017 9:00 AM
Reply to: Message 517 by RAZD
06-27-2017 5:37 AM


RAZD, Faith is convinced that the Devonian is a rock layer. You might as well try to have a rational conversation with a wall.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 517 by RAZD, posted 06-27-2017 5:37 AM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

    
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