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Author Topic:   Exploring (mostly Cultural) Marxism in today's Left
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 256 of 381 (813729)
06-30-2017 8:52 AM
Reply to: Message 253 by Tusko
06-30-2017 4:29 AM


Re: A Review of what Classical and Cultural Marxism have in common
Before commenting it would help if you knew something about what has been said before. Please go listen to the video in Message 185
People are incredibly ignorant about the phases and stages of Marxism. It long since stopped being primarily an economic theory and has set itself to kill western civilization. That was the goal of the Frankfurt School as they invented scheme after scheme to attack the west. It's all in that video and there's more in the article on political correctness (Message 220 and Message 226), and the other video, Message 207. It was Marxist Susan Sontag who may have been the first to say the white race is most evil thing that ever existed or something like that. abe: Wikipedia quotes her as saying "The white race is the cancer of human history."
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 253 by Tusko, posted 06-30-2017 4:29 AM Tusko has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 257 of 381 (813730)
06-30-2017 9:18 AM
Reply to: Message 255 by Faith
06-30-2017 8:47 AM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
No Faith, I said the guys remarks only mean that some person is alleged to have made that remark.
Which reduces it to meaninglessness. Duh.
Yup. That's the point. It's meaningless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 255 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 8:47 AM Faith has not replied

  
caffeine
Member (Idle past 1025 days)
Posts: 1800
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


Message 258 of 381 (813731)
06-30-2017 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 244 by Faith
06-29-2017 5:52 PM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
Seems to me I've seen a lot of European leaders in particular but some ordinary Europeans as well, refusing to say anything at all against the Muslims, even going out of their way to avoid identifying them, hiding their great preponderance of crimes under general statistics for instance.
And other European leaders and people say different things. The Prime Minister of Hungary enjoys loudly expressing his view that Islam is incompatible with European civilisation, that it is impossible for Muslims to integrate and that we should not allow Muslims into Europe. Clearly there is no sinister force preventing people from speaking their minds on the topic.
Have you paused to consider that the leaders and ordinary people who do not talk about Islam and Muslims in the same way as you do so simply because they don't agree with your view of things?
But since you show that there is some pretty loud complaining, why haven't they figured out how to throw the bums out?
Because we don't all think the same. I am not terrified into silence and inactivity by hate-mongers ranting about me betraying Europe; and more than they are terrified into silence and inactivity when I refer to them as hatemongers and Islamophobes.
You probably didn't watch the video in Message 185 - ? - but there's a Muslim there shown saying how in twenty years the UK will be Pakistan. Is that OK by you?
Idiot says something stupid. What's your point?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 244 by Faith, posted 06-29-2017 5:52 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 260 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 9:36 AM caffeine has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 259 of 381 (813732)
06-30-2017 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 255 by Faith
06-30-2017 8:47 AM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
But again Faith, the issue is not what someone says but rather "is there any evidence to support your assertions and the topic"?
So far there has been no evidence of any "Western Decline", no evidence of any "Marxism in Leftism (whatever that meant) and no evidence of "(mostly Cultural) Marxism in today's Left".
HINT:
The UK becoming a Muslim Nation has NOTHING to do with the topic EVEN if it were true.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 255 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 8:47 AM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 260 of 381 (813733)
06-30-2017 9:36 AM
Reply to: Message 258 by caffeine
06-30-2017 9:21 AM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
Good for the Hungarian Prime Minister.
Of course you "disagree," sadly and dangerously.
Good for the Hungarian Prime Minister. There should be more like him.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 258 by caffeine, posted 06-30-2017 9:21 AM caffeine has not replied

  
Tusko
Member (Idle past 101 days)
Posts: 615
From: London, UK
Joined: 10-01-2004


(2)
Message 261 of 381 (813734)
06-30-2017 10:02 AM
Reply to: Message 246 by Faith
06-29-2017 6:23 PM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
(When I get the time I will have a look at the video you recommended in your other response, though I having read a bit more about the Frankfurt School Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory on Wikipedia I don't think it has very much to do with actual Marxism. It sounds more like a reactionary appropriation of an obscure offshoot of Marxism.)
As a UK resident, and someone whose experience leads me to believe that Muslims are about as nice as any other minority group, maybe I can put your mind at rest about the UK. It seems to me there isn't much chance of it becoming an Islamic state in the next few decades, if ever. And I would say this was in significant part due to political correctness. To the best of my understanding, being 'politically correct' is about taking a classically liberal approach (liberal in the John Stuart Mill sense, not like Satan) - which is precisely the opposite of embracing a particular religious denomination to the exclusion of all others.
That's why I think being politically correct is actually rather wonderful, tolerant, enriching etc... - at least when it means being empathetic, slow to judge, tolerant, and quick to defend people's ability to believe - in their own home at the very least - whatever they wish.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 246 by Faith, posted 06-29-2017 6:23 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 262 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 10:24 AM Tusko has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 262 of 381 (813735)
06-30-2017 10:24 AM
Reply to: Message 261 by Tusko
06-30-2017 10:02 AM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
What you are describing in such glowing terms is not political correctness, it's more like Christianity.
Sometimes I just have to think the Left deserves what it's going to get, and leave it at that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 261 by Tusko, posted 06-30-2017 10:02 AM Tusko has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 263 by Tusko, posted 06-30-2017 10:30 AM Faith has replied

  
Tusko
Member (Idle past 101 days)
Posts: 615
From: London, UK
Joined: 10-01-2004


(1)
Message 263 of 381 (813736)
06-30-2017 10:30 AM
Reply to: Message 262 by Faith
06-30-2017 10:24 AM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
This is maybe a bit of a sidetrack, but I've long been interested in the idea of political correctness. It is a term largely used in a pejorative sense - but if you look beyond the convenient caricature and ask "why would anybody actually think political correctness was a good idea?" then just as you say, it becomes a collection of rather Christian-sounding values - turn the other cheek, beams in eyes, etc... Becuase, as I understand it, the popularisation of the notion of "political correctness" is an attempt to discredit the classical liberal project: personal freedom, responsibility, etc...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 262 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 10:24 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 264 by JonF, posted 06-30-2017 10:33 AM Tusko has not replied
 Message 265 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 11:53 AM Tusko has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 264 of 381 (813737)
06-30-2017 10:33 AM
Reply to: Message 263 by Tusko
06-30-2017 10:30 AM


Re: Once again, Faith presents no evidence that anyone controls her, censors her, enforce
It's a right-wing magic incantation. "Politically correct, "fake news,... and problems with their worldview disappear without being addressed.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 263 by Tusko, posted 06-30-2017 10:30 AM Tusko has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 265 of 381 (813741)
06-30-2017 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 263 by Tusko
06-30-2017 10:30 AM


Political Correctness again
Well I included a link plus a lot of text from the classical discussion of PC as Marxist in Message 220 and an edited version in Message 226.
Marxism to my mind can be boiled down to the creation of an enemy class versus a good guys class, creating class conflict. It doesn't analyze reality as it claims, it creates the conflict -- between their designated Oppressor and Oppressed, defined quite strictly by Marxists themselves. It's totally phony simpleminded history, which is discussed in the links posted above.
Classical Marxism has the proletariat against the bourgeoisie, while Cultural Marxism, and PC, has feminists and gays and now Islam as their Oppressed classes it calls people "racists" and "homophobes" and "Islamophobes" and so on instead of addressing reasonable discussion of related issues in society. It's all about fingerpointing and intimidation, nothing at all good, nothing at all to be compared to Christianity. It attacks PEOPLE rather than ideas, which is one of the main things that makes it evil. That's the reason for the millions murdered in Communist regimes, which will never be acknowledged by the Lefties who haven't yet seen the truth. Which is just about everybody at EvC.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 263 by Tusko, posted 06-30-2017 10:30 AM Tusko has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 266 by JonF, posted 06-30-2017 11:58 AM Faith has replied
 Message 301 by Tusko, posted 06-30-2017 6:20 PM Faith has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 266 of 381 (813744)
06-30-2017 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 265 by Faith
06-30-2017 11:53 AM


Re: Political Correctness again
Political Correctness can be boiled down as respect for others. Sometimes it's taken too far, but mostly it's common courtesy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 265 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 11:53 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 267 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 12:00 PM JonF has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 267 of 381 (813746)
06-30-2017 12:00 PM
Reply to: Message 266 by JonF
06-30-2017 11:58 AM


Political Correctness is engineered class hatred
But it's not, that's just Marxist whitewashing propaganda.
ABE: If it were true at all, how do you explain the way Christianity is vilified by the Left, or now "white people?" No, the "politeness" which is really conformist intimidation, only applies to the "oppressed class" as falsely and tendentiously and politically defined by Leftists.
HERE's how it works: Remember Rwanda? The Hutus slaughtered the Tutsis after a history of no conflict. Because somebody got on the radio and told them that the Tutsis were "cockroaches" and didn't deserve to live. It was a Catholic priest who did that. He created the conditions for slaughter by defining one group as evil and the other as good. The more you can invent about how the bad guys have been unfair to the good guys the more of an emotional reaction you'll get. That's what Hitler did too. And it's what Marxism does. And it ultimately leads to murder.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 266 by JonF, posted 06-30-2017 11:58 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 268 by jar, posted 06-30-2017 12:11 PM Faith has replied
 Message 269 by ringo, posted 06-30-2017 12:12 PM Faith has replied
 Message 275 by JonF, posted 06-30-2017 12:17 PM Faith has replied
 Message 298 by PaulK, posted 06-30-2017 1:24 PM Faith has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 268 of 381 (813750)
06-30-2017 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by Faith
06-30-2017 12:00 PM


Re: Political Correctness again
Faith writes:
If it were true at all, how do you explain the way Christianity is vilified by the Left, or now "white people?"
Much of today's "Christianity" deserves to not just be vilified but to be actively opposed and condemned. And After Christians of all colors, White Christians and in particular US Christians have been the most successful practitioners of genocide and ethnic cleansing the world has ever seen.
Those are simply facts and it is about time such facts were discussed and taught.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 267 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 12:00 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 270 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 12:13 PM jar has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 269 of 381 (813751)
06-30-2017 12:12 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by Faith
06-30-2017 12:00 PM


Re: Political Correctness again
Faith writes:
... how do you explain the way Christianity is vilified by the Left...?
It isn't.
Christians who act like Christ are admired by left, right and center. The criticism is for self-styled "Christians" who mouth "Lord! Lord!" while kicking the poor in the face by taking their health-care away.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 267 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 12:00 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 271 by Faith, posted 06-30-2017 12:14 PM ringo has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 270 of 381 (813752)
06-30-2017 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 268 by jar
06-30-2017 12:11 PM


Re: Political Correctness again
Those are vile lies, a lot of them from Leftist revisionist history, and you are now guilty of spreading them just as the priest did on the radio.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 268 by jar, posted 06-30-2017 12:11 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 273 by jar, posted 06-30-2017 12:16 PM Faith has replied

  
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