Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,817 Year: 3,074/9,624 Month: 919/1,588 Week: 102/223 Day: 13/17 Hour: 0/1


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Eden = Aden
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 12 of 55 (821626)
10-09-2017 9:45 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by granpa
10-09-2017 8:57 PM


What is your evidence?
Why BELIEVE that it will rain today when you can KNOW that it might rain today. ...
This is a virtual tautology. It might rain anywhere anywhen. This tells us nothing.
The sky might turn green.
So tell me how old you think the earth is?
Was there a flood? If yes, when?
And most important ... what is your evidence?
Enjoy
Edited by RAZD, : .

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 8:57 PM granpa has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 9:49 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 19 of 55 (821642)
10-09-2017 10:15 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by granpa
10-09-2017 9:49 PM


Re: What is your evidence?
Already answered that in the thread that got closed. What do you want me to do?
Answer the questions. I'm trying to parse out single arguments for you to defend one at a time rather than the whole caboodle.
(1a) Was there a flood (you apparently think so)? (1b) If so, when was it?
(2) How old do you think the earth is?
(3) What is your evidence?
The later bit is the most important, as it provide verifiability for your arguments. Opinions are useless.
Let me demonstrate:
(1a) Nope. (3(1)) There is no evidence of a singular world wide flood event. There is evidence that one has not occurred in the continuity of life and the geological evidence on each continent.
(2) at least 4.5 billion years old. (3(2)) See Age Correlations and An Old Earth, Version 2 No 1*, which also has evidence that no flood occurred while that evidence was accruing.
Enjoy
* or the revised, reformatted and updated versions The Age of the Earth Part 1: Biological Counting Systems and The Age of the Earth Part 2: Physical/Chemical Counting Systems, and The Age of the Earth Part 3: Radiometric and Cosmogenic Measuring Systems.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 9:49 PM granpa has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 10:18 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 22 of 55 (821648)
10-09-2017 10:24 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by granpa
10-09-2017 10:18 PM


Re: What is your evidence?
That's exactly what I've been trying to do. I opened an entire thread to discuss that exact thing. It got closed. I posted a link to the page where I answer all those questions and I'm told that I can't do that either. I'm not going to rewrite an entire article just for you.
So don't copy and paste your argument, just present it anew. In bits. starting with these 4 points:
Did a flood occur?
When?
How old is the eart?
What is your evidence?
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 10:18 PM granpa has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 10:26 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 24 of 55 (821652)
10-09-2017 10:30 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by granpa
10-09-2017 10:26 PM


Re: What is your evidence?
I am not going to rewrite an entire article just for you.
Curiously, I did not ask you to. I only asked you to answer four simple questions:
Did a world wide flood occur?
If yes, when did that happen?
How old do you think the earth is?
What is your evidence.
Capice?

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 10:26 PM granpa has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 11:48 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 26 of 55 (821659)
10-10-2017 7:41 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by granpa
10-09-2017 11:48 PM


Re: What is your evidence?
I started an entire thread to answer those exact questions and it was deleted. I just posted a link to a page answering those exact questions and I'm told that that's not acceptable either. Now you are demanding that I answer the exact questions that I was trying to answer in the first place.
So condense it down.
Was there a world wide flood? Yes No
If "yes" then when did it happen? ______________ Billion Million Thousand years ago.
How old do you think the earth is? ______________ Billion Million Thousand years old.
Answer these questions and then we can get to your evidence.
The purpose is to understand your position, I'm trying to make it easy for you.
Enjoy
Edited by RAZD, : .
Edited by RAZD, : .

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 11:48 PM granpa has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 27 of 55 (821666)
10-10-2017 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 25 by granpa
10-09-2017 11:48 PM


Re: What is your evidence?
Look, I "get" that you think:
quote:
Theia and the flood: 3 billion years ago Theia's decaying orbit reached the Roche limit ...
Then 2.4 billion years ago the dunite was deposited. This created the banded iron formations. The dunite sank to the bottom of the mantle. ...
... First the ices (water, carbon dioxide, & ammonia) on its surface were deposited. This created Earths ocean (and atmosphere). Since the earth at that time had no continents the water completely flooded its surface. ...
If Noah was born 3 billion years ago then Adam was born 4.5 billion years ago. ...
We can skip for now your earth building concept and the extra moons.
None of that says how old the earth is, or when a mythical flood purportedly occurred (other than implying that it was +/-3 billion years ago ....
quote:
Lunar recession and Earth receding from the sun: However, the current rate of lunar recession is consistant with the observation that there were 400 days in a year 620 million years ago if the Earth was closer to the Sun (because the year would be shorter). Its orbital radius would have to have been 0.9589 au at that time.
If the rate of recession is inversely proportional to the cube of the orbital radius then that puts the Earth just inside the sun 4.5 billion years ago.
This is mixed with a sprinkling of facts ("the observation that there were 400 days in a year 620 million years ago").
But it tells me nothing about the age of the earth or when a mythical flood purportedly occurred. It does tell me that you have problems with your math (because a closer orbit around the sun would have fewer days).
Crucifixion and the lunar eclipse of June 14 of 29 AD and El-o-Hym = ολω-Hym = All-Human = No ego also tell me nothing about the age of the earth or when a mythical flood purportedly occurred.
So you see I am not ignoring your closed posts, I am just trying to clarify certain points before delving further into your scenario.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by granpa, posted 10-09-2017 11:48 PM granpa has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 49 of 55 (821768)
10-12-2017 7:19 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by granpa
10-11-2017 8:37 PM


Re: Forum Guidelines (addendum): quit bitchin, start answering.
I answered his questions before he even asked them in the thread that got closed
Except this isn't true. In Message 27 I went through ALL of your posted material looking for the answers to my questions and could not find them.
All you are doing is whining about your posts being closed, yet you can't seem to answer simple questions related to those posts. I come to the conclusion that you can't answer those direct questions because you don't have answers, just general statements.
quote:
Message 26: So condense it down.
Was there a world wide flood? Yes No
If "yes" then when did it happen? ______________ Billion Million Thousand years ago.
How old do you think the earth is? ______________ Billion Million Thousand years old.
Answer these questions and then we can get to your evidence.
The purpose is to understand your position, I'm trying to make it easy for you.
You say the earth was covered with water due to the decaying orbit of this purported "Thea" moon of yours, but you don't say it is THE flood of Noah's time or anything about his ark or animals on the ark. Instead you talk about certain people being rivers and other stuff.
If I had written a book and was on book tour and someone asked me about a point in the book, I would answer it, not say "read the book" ... because that is what the conversation/question is about: understanding your point of view.
As it is all your complaints give the impression that you are not familiar enough with what you claim is your material to answer simple questions about it.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by granpa, posted 10-11-2017 8:37 PM granpa has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 50 of 55 (821769)
10-12-2017 7:25 AM
Reply to: Message 36 by granpa
10-11-2017 6:51 PM


Re: What is your evidence?
I've added many pages to many wikis
Message 37: Granpa ADMIN
75,142 EDITS SINCE JOINING THIS WIKI
25 JANUARY 2010
So in other words your "evidence" is just a bunch of articles that you have written in other places.
That sounds like a total lack of supporting evidence to me, referencing yourself to support yourself is not evidence.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by granpa, posted 10-11-2017 6:51 PM granpa has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 51 of 55 (821771)
10-12-2017 7:29 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by JonF
10-11-2017 9:54 PM


moon data
I don't think much of this guy, but lack of references to moon recession is arguably valid. His numbers are at least close to correct. The phenomenon is well known in some circles, and the claim that it disproves an old Earth is an ancient PRATT.
He has one tid-bit of real information that seems to be picked out of the blue (400 day year in the devonian), but his explanation for it seems a bit whack. Three imaginary moons and the earth in an orbit closer to the sun (which would mean a shorter year not a longer one).
Enjoy
Edited by RAZD, : .

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by JonF, posted 10-11-2017 9:54 PM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by JonF, posted 10-12-2017 9:37 AM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 52 of 55 (821780)
10-12-2017 9:31 AM
Reply to: Message 47 by granpa
10-12-2017 4:53 AM


what we have here is a failure to communicate
Now read message 16
If you had typed "Now read [msg=16]" it would have posted
Now read Message 16
With a link to Message 16 for easy peasy follow up
granpa writes:
Message 16: If he had read the link that I posted he would have realized that his comment was completely out of place. I would love to post the text on that page but when I do that I get called out for copying and pasting. When I post a link then I get told I'm not allowed to do that either. I'm between a rock and a hard place here and you're just making it worse.
The question is when are you going to stop dancing around the issues and whining about closed posts and claiming you posted that information somewhere else ... except that you haven't posted it somewhere else ... the question is when are you going to quit bitching and get around to posting something of substance in answer to the questions put to you.
Was there a world wide flood?
If yes, when did that occur?
How old is the earth?
How do you know (what is your evidence)?
You could have answered this in Message 14 and we could be discussing something else by now. Something fun, like imaginary moons.
Instead you dodged and danced and wiggled and whined.
granpa writes:
Message 14: Already answered that in the thread that got closed. What do you want me to do?
Stop dancing and give some simple easy peasy answers to these easy peasy questions:
Was there a world wide flood?
If yes, when did that occur?
How old is the earth?
How do you know (what is your evidence)?
Enjoy
ps ... some posting tips:
type [qs]quotes are easy[/qs] and it becomes:
quotes are easy
and you can type [qs=RAZD]quotes are easy[/qs] and it becomes:
RAZD writes:
quotes are easy
or type [quote]quotes are easy[/quote] and it becomes:
quote:
quotes are easy
also check out (help) links on any formatting questions when in the reply window.
For other formatting tips see Posting Tips
For a quick overview see EvC Forum Primer
If you have problems with replies see Report Discussion Problems Here 3.0
Edited by RAZD, : st
Edited by RAZD, : .

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by granpa, posted 10-12-2017 4:53 AM granpa has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 54 of 55 (821785)
10-12-2017 10:11 AM
Reply to: Message 47 by granpa
10-12-2017 4:53 AM


dancing without substance
Now read Message 16
When people questioned your answer in Message 9 your reply was to read msg=16 ... So next time around you will post "Now read Message 47?" Really? This is how you debate?
granpa: see these links for my evidence and support for what I have posted
reply: don't post links, post the pertinent parts in your own words
granpa: those are my words
reply: you wrote those articles?
granpa: I wrote those and many other wiki articles on several wiki sites
In other words your only "evidence" and your only support for your conceptual world theology is ... you.
Is this why you don't answer easy peasy questions?
Not good enough.
Enjoy
Edited by RAZD, : .
Edited by RAZD, : LOL

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by granpa, posted 10-12-2017 4:53 AM granpa has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024