Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 63 (9162 total)
4 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 916,356 Year: 3,613/9,624 Month: 484/974 Week: 97/276 Day: 25/23 Hour: 0/3


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Why did Jesus kill the Pigs?
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 27 of 45 (822576)
10-28-2017 9:17 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by Phat
10-28-2017 8:45 AM


Re: Boogeymen and Demonization
Phat writes:
Whats up with this parable and cruel tale of Pig Murder?
Looks like you and the whole town missed the point and what's up with the parable is that most folk miss the point.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Phat, posted 10-28-2017 8:45 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by Phat, posted 10-28-2017 11:19 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 29 of 45 (822581)
10-28-2017 11:44 AM
Reply to: Message 28 by Phat
10-28-2017 11:19 AM


Re: Boogeymen and Demonization
In the stories (remember this is all fiction and there are two mutually exclusive stories), fiction told by Jews to Jews.
The story is being told in a Roman Protectorate called Palestine.
The Jews are a protected minority in Palestine and given special privileges.
To Jews pigs are unclean animals. You don't eat them, wear them, raise them.
To the rest of the population pigs are food and wealth and clothing and tools and decorative objects.
Both populations believe in demonic possession.
One population is jealous of the other populations special status and considers them weird at best.
Someone who can control demons for any reason is a person to fear.
Now:
would one population see casting demons out of humans and into a useless, worthless object that is then killed and destroyed ending the threat from demons as good while one population see it as destruction of property AND someone with control of demons that might just cast them into the people?
Phat writes:
Why would Jesus destroy the livelihood of a region or family?
As a story told to Jews by Jews and about Jews see it as describing destruction of a livelihood?
If the answer to that is "No, they would not see it as describing destruction of a livelihood then the topic must be something else.
Throw "describing destruction of a livelihood" away and go back to the story.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by Phat, posted 10-28-2017 11:19 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by Phat, posted 10-30-2017 1:31 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 34 of 45 (822594)
10-28-2017 8:46 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by Dr Adequate
10-28-2017 8:37 PM


Re: Boogeymen and Demonization
Didn't he bring the Galileen Dozen with him?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-28-2017 8:37 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by Phat, posted 10-29-2017 3:24 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 36 of 45 (822596)
10-29-2017 6:31 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Phat
10-29-2017 3:24 AM


Re: Boogeymen and Demonization
Go reread Message 29 and then reread the passages.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Phat, posted 10-29-2017 3:24 AM Phat has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 38 of 45 (822635)
10-30-2017 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Phat
10-30-2017 1:31 PM


Re: Motive...Who Received Healing?
Phat writes:
So if the story was a Jewish one, getting rid of the pigs was only helping everyone.
The non-Jews still wanted Jesus to leave, however. Perhaps I was seeing it from their perspective...he was not helping them much at all.
Still missing the point.
We don't know if the "villagers" were Jews or Greeks or Romans. It doesn't matter.
The pigs, just like the Garden or the God character in Genesis 2&3 is just a plot device.
Go back and reread Message 29.
Was there something in the fable that both Jews and non-Jews should fear?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Phat, posted 10-30-2017 1:31 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by Phat, posted 10-30-2017 4:43 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 40 of 45 (822644)
10-30-2017 4:48 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Phat
10-30-2017 4:43 PM


Re: Motive...Who Received Healing?
Specifically, the ability to control demons.
In the story that is what the people fear. It's not the loss of the pigs it is a fear of someone who can control demons.
Or raise the dead.
Or turn water into wine.
Or tell folk that "They are NOT the chosen ones of God."
It is someone who is challenging the established order; who works outside the establishment.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Phat, posted 10-30-2017 4:43 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Phat, posted 11-01-2017 12:15 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 413 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 42 of 45 (822782)
11-01-2017 1:01 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Phat
11-01-2017 12:15 PM


Re: Motive...Who Received Healing?
Phat writes:
So did Jesus come for the Jews or for everyone?
Huh?
Jesus came as a teacher. What did Jesus teach about who are God's children?
We've been over this many times before Phat.
Luke 4 writes:
25 But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land;
26 But unto none of them was Elias sent, save unto Sarepta, a city of Sidon, unto a woman that was a widow.
27 And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian.
28 And all they in the synagogue, when they heard these things, were filled with wrath,
Phat writes:
And if so, why are you against Pauls new Religion?
I am not against Paul's new religion as long as folk understand even Paul's New Religion is not Christianity but just one man's creation.
And Christianity is not God's religion.
Christianity is a human creation.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by Phat, posted 11-01-2017 12:15 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024