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Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
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Author | Topic: Senator Al Franken? | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I can't help but wonder what the final outcome of the 2000 election would have been if they had been so ... civilized? ... thorough? ... patient about the recounting there, rather than trying to stampede the results to fit a non-existent calendar.
I note that we are still before the inauguration time ... Enjoy. by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. • • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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It appears that there is more to the story that what has been initially reported ...
quote: In contrast with Roy Scumbag Moore, Franken has requested an ethics inquiry ... Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
More evidence that Tweeden's claim is politically motivated and misinformation:
quote: So it looks like she owes Franken an apology, and also one to all the real victims of sexual assault as this ploy weakens the #metoo movement, and it gives perverts like Roy Moore a window to claim the women are just doing it for attention .. like Tweeden. Curious that this claim of hers only came out now that Roy Moore is in trouble because of sexually assaulting girls. Curious that it emanates from Faux Noise Nutwerk where she serves as part of the echo chamber. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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... Tweeden groped another performer? Did that turn out to be unwanted? ... Is that the standard now? Gropers will applaud. She's done her job, and now they can vote for Roy Moore?
Tweeden was seen kissing another performer? ... Remember her complaint is that Franken kissed her, a kiss was part of the act (there is footage), and there was no actual groping (just staged "bathroom humor" pretend to grope gag and she was in on it). In other words, she was doing exactly what she complained Franken was doing ... do we have one standard for men and a different one for women? Not for me. It was a USO show and some bawdiness was expected ... as is tradition (look at old Bob Hope footage ... or do we have to classify HIM as a groper now ...)
... but I won't react by differently to what seem to be attempts at shaming the victim ... So question the source of the story (the Faux Noise echo chamber of which she is a active member), question the accuracy of the claim (does any of the footage support it), question the politics (she is an ardent Trump supporter), and question the timing of the claim (why now when Roy Moore is in the headlines) ... does the claim pass the smell test? Personally I think it stinks. Enjoy by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
... Tweeden groped another performer? Did that turn out to be unwanted? ... Is that the standard now? Is that the standard now? Yes. The standard for whether sexual contact between adults is even a problem is strictly based on consent. You are saying that she kissed somebody and that she grabbed somebody else's butt. Absent those folks having a problem with it, or those folks being intimidated by her, you haven't shown me a problem yet. The question was about post kiss "consent" not prior ... you seem to say it is okay if it is post kiss consented. I don't. And context is important -- this occurred during the same show, it was part of the whole routine, and such routines are rehearsed, so the time to object is during the rehearsal. Additionally the Al Franken kiss is a prelude to her calling a soldier up to kiss. We can take this as the purpose of the skit: kiss a random serviceman as a proxy for all the soldiers. It's entertainment. Personally I think you are reacting exactly the way this issue was raised to do: distract from Roy Moore and gaslight people into stepping down the 50 shades of grey between a stage kiss and a statutory rape. One is disappointing at worst while the other is absolutely deplorable and the perp should be in jail.
She's done her job, and now they can vote for Roy Moore? Roy Moore is scum. That is completely independent of whether or not Al Franken groped anyone. And yet you are talking about Franken and not Moore. Like I said, the publication of this issue at this time is for the purpose of distraction and gaslighting, and it looks like job done.
I am addressing an attack on her that has a completely different basis. The attack I am rejecting seems to be based on either the accuser being a slut or having participated in sexual misconduct or her own.
o we have one standard for men and a different one for women? Not for me No. If she did what she was accused of, that does not get Al Franken off, in my opinion. Except that it was staged, and both occurred on stage during the skit. Taking it as anything else is like quote-mining: taking it out of context to make it seem different than it was. We also have the curious incident of the party celebrating Franken's election ... and she was there and all smiles and congratulations, etc ... the incident was not used then to discredit Franken before the election, which would have been a more appropriate timing than now, when Franken is not up for election and Roy Moore is. Franken has asked for a senate ethics investigation, not a normal course from someone who is guilty. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I think the photo clearly is staged, maybe or maybe not with Tweeden's awake participation. The photo documented a variety of "bad taste humor" but does not document a groping. ... Maybe she is telling the truth, but would one find the statement "Fox News corespondent lies to make liberal politician look bad" implausable? Now consider that the purpose is not to make Franken look bad, but it is aired now to distract attention from Roy Moore sexual predator ... that the purpose is to create false equivalence between a stage kiss and statutory rape. That goal seems to be accomplished. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Not going to happen to me at least. But what difference do I make? I don't vote in Alabama. But you do vote in America, and winning a senate seat from the republicans would (a) knock Thrump down another notch and (b) help prevent more republican disastrous bills and judge appointments from passing. You can help by contributing to Doug Jones Go to Doug Jones for Senateand Contribute I have a weekly donation going to him, because Roy Moore should be in jail, not the senate. Enjoy Edited by RAZD, : stby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Well this just got a little more interesting ...
The image on the left is obviously photoshopped (where did that green patch come from on the wall) ... but why do that when you have the one on the right? Well the word is that it was photoshopped as well:
quote: and in the comments
quote: Why? Because Franken's hand was on her shoulder, and they had to hide the fingers ... So Franken is being "swiftboated" and maligned with false information, in an attempt to deflect news from Roy Moore child molester, pedophile and statutory rapist, and to provide false equivalence to gaslight people, especially voters in Alabama, into thinking it's ok to condone\vote for despicable Moore.
quote: Sadly this tactic will likely win, because republicans have shown time and again they don't care squat about morality if it interferes with the GOP agenda. They just talk about it to fool the gullible. Edited by Admin, : Change image width.by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Lest we Forget -- Al Franken is NOT Roy Moore:
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Of course, this might be a photoshopping by some left winger, to make it look like some right winger had photoshopped the image. The way Schrubbia's National Guard record was a set-up? Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
It is politics at its usual dirty best. Not to say that Franken isn't guilty---which he wisely admitted--but waiting for the ethics committee and holding his ground appear to be good strategies for now. So far the worst I have seen as an accusation is a hand on a buttock, not a pussy grab, and not a grapple ... Just remember -- Al Franken is NOT Roy Moore:
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
We have evidence of dirty tricks being pulled by the Republicans for political purposes in the past, and we have claims of evidence tampering in this particular set of accusations. I don't think that politicians should roll over for dirty tricks. On the other hand, they shouldn't be given a free pass either. Indeed, the timing is suspicious, and that's why I will await the ethics committee results.
I would also like to see similar investigations done for all politicians who have settled similar accusations by paying off the accusers with taxpayer money or contributions. and I still don't see how Franken's purported actions rise to the level of child sex trading and serial child abuse. If Franken resigns and other more serious scumbags don't then that will not be just. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Heard on Facebook that the next 72 hours will see a lot of resignations.
Implied but not stated is that the names of those who used taxpayer funds to settle sexual harassment suits could become known. Also Paul Ryan is retiring (job done?). If so, then the 2018 elections just became a whole lot more interesting, get your popcorn ready. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) |
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
... But if we can't tell if I was sexually assaulted, by what right have we to say that Franken assaulted anybody? I think we need to distinguish between inappropriate touching, sexual harassment, and sexual assault. Consider a person going down the street and patting people on the butt -- should they be put on a sexual predator registry? I think not, just told it isn't appropriate. A kiss with tongue falls into that category -- it's inappropriate, but it's not necessarily sexual. Groping the crotch is sexual assault. Grabbing a breast is sexual assault. Reaching inside someones clothes is sexual assault.to Continually asking someone to have sex is sexual harassment not assault My experience - when I was 19 that involved me being too drunk to stand, and a person unzipped me and fondled my boys - was sexual assault. It was not a kiss. It was not a request. Lumping these together in my mind diminishes the actual sexual assault. Just like making false claims diminishes #MeToo. Franken, as far as I can see, at most made inappropriate contact and inappropriate mock (for a gag photo) groping, but not actual sexual assault. Meanwhile in the last 24 hours we have two more republicans and one more democrat that will be resigning and one mention of a woman being accused of sexual harassment. Now I do think that sexual harassment and inappropriate touching are not proper for an elected official. I also think that sexual assault should lead to prosecution and if convicted to being registered as a sexual predator. The 2018 elections will be quite interesting. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
... The ethics committee hasn't investigated sexual harassment or assault allegations in 25 years, Axios reports - I wonder if Franken knew that when he invited investigation. And the reason they haven't is ... ... the allegations were being "settled" (paid off) with taxpayer money, so the amounts and the perps would not be a matter of public record and continue to sit in congress and on committees ... like the ethics committee? Certainly having a hearing on Franken would open the door to exposing these other accusations, particularly if Franken was one. And I still think there is no comparison between Al Franken's alleged actions and the alleged statutory rape by Moore and Trump and the admitted sexual assault of women by Trump in the Hollywood Bus tapes, grabbing by the p***y -- attempted rape? One is inappropriate behavior for an elected official, the other is a prosecutable offense. But now, even worse (imho) is the walking back of democrats on Franken's resignation: it becomes situational morality all over again. by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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